Jaws - Robert Harris review (see post #1 for link) - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by NagysAudio View Post

Important Jaws Blu-Ray restoration information: http://www.aintitcool.com/node/54937

Read all the way through

"then we had some great processing to try and manage some of the grain."

"BG: What were his views on the amount of grain? Audiences are always hard to please where classics are concerned. Some like it, some don't.

MD: It always is, but you need grain; film has inherent grain in it. When we're dealing with high resolution content like that and an original negative that has some grain in it, it's a fine line on managing that, and I think we've managed that fairly well in the look of the [film]. He was very happy with it."

Ohhh kay.

T.B.
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post #182 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post

"MD: It always is, but you need grain; film has inherent grain in it. When we're dealing with high resolution content like that and an original negative that has some grain in it, it's a fine line on managing that, and I think we've managed that fairly well in the look of the [film]. He was very happy with it.".

And quotes like that is why I'm still in a guilty-until-proven-innocent mindset with this release. Why is it a "fine line" at all? Surely, a movie like Taxi Driver would have at least the same level of grain as an anamorphic show like Jaws, where are the people complaining about how it looks? Blech. Where's Grover Crisp when you need him
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post #183 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 03:14 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by 42041 View Post

And quotes like that is why I'm still in a guilty-until-proven-innocent mindset with this release, since. Why is it a "fine line" at all? Surely, a movie like Taxi Driver would have at least the same level of grain as an anamorphic show like Jaws, where are the people complaining about how it looks? Blech. Where's Grover Crisp when you need him

Shhhh now, i am clearly the only person who has reservations about this disc didn't you get the memo?
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post #184 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post

"BG: What were his views on the amount of grain? Audiences are always hard to please where classics are concerned. Some like it, some don't."

Man, don't I know it! I haven't been to a movie theatre in the past forty years without SOMEBODY angrily walking out complaining, "Why don't these people look waxy? I'm not paying good money to see this unless the people are all waxy!" Thank goodness the studios have finally been responding to this audience demand!
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post #185 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:21 PM
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Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post


If it is really too hard to copy and paste into google

http://www.joblo.com/blu-rays-dvds/n...riter-bob-gale

I just looked at your post history, lol pot meet kettle

Unless I'm missing something, that interview says that BTTF received new 2k transfers for Blu-ray. Did the Blu-ray not contain these transfers?

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post #186 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:22 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by NJPete View Post

Unless I'm missing something, that interview says that BTTF received new 2k transfers for Blu-ray. Did the Blu-ray not contain these transfers?

Nope DNR'd old HDTV masters
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post #187 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post


Nope DNR'd old HDTV masters

How was that determined?

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post #188 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by NJPete View Post

How was that determined?

Comparison
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post #189 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post

Comparison

Thanks. I'll have to check whatever that is later as it does not display on my iPad.

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post #190 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:35 PM
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Bloody hell, do people really have such amnesia about BTTF? Go and dig up the thread - it's all over it. The even sadder thing is someone posted completely un-DNRed screen grabs of the first film that look truly amazing - and we end up with the garbage that is the Blu-ray release. The HDTV/Blu-ray comparisons are there. They're the same master. The Blu-ray is even more heavily DNRed. Then you see the completely unfiltered copy of the same master and realise just how much **** DNR Universal have heaped on the films to "remaster" them.

So when people say you should treat Jaws with scepticism until you see the disc, they really do have a point. However, given this is Spielberg, we might get lucky and he'll haul ass to keep the DNR off his film. But we can only wait and see. And pray.
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post #191 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:36 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by DJ Mike TJG View Post

Bloody hell, do people really have such amnesia about BTTF? Go and dig up the thread - it's all over it. The even sadder thing is someone posted completely un-DNRed screen grabs of the first film that look truly amazing - and we end up with the garbage that is the Blu-ray release. The HDTV/Blu-ray comparisons are there. They're the same master. The Blu-ray is even more heavily DNRed. Then you see the completely unfiltered copy of the same master and realise just how much **** DNR Universal have heaped on the films to "remaster" them.

So when people say you should treat Jaws with scepticism until you see the disc, they really do have a point. However, given this is Spielberg, we might get lucky and he'll haul ass to keep the DNR off his film. But we can only wait and see. And pray.

Jurassic Park forgot the Spielberg shield
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post #192 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJPete View Post

Unless I'm missing something, that interview says that BTTF received new 2k transfers for Blu-ray. Did the Blu-ray not contain these transfers?

Maybe they were new, but if they're done at circa-2000 quality standards it might as well be that old.
A high-quality transfer of BTTF3, at least, would be comparable to pretty much any new movie (optical effects aside), since it was shot on "modern" film stock that was a major step forward from previous emulsions, and it was shot to be very clear and sharp.
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post #193 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 04:48 PM
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This Michael Daruty guy has two strikes against him IMO. To Kill A Mockingbird and Out Of Africa and I have seen both. Word around the campfire is that Buck Privates is no different. That's a potential three strikes right there. Anyone have an opinion on All Quiet On The Western Front?

It's the same team doing all these 4k remasters so it's not a stretch that Jaws will be more of the same. Especially since they keep repeating the idiotic "grain management" phrase in all these PR videos.
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post #194 of 754 Old 04-13-2012, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by haineshisway View Post


They definitely did a new, fresh scan of it.

I just heard from a friend and he confirms your info that a new scan of Jaws was done. 4k off the negative. He was operating the scanner and said the scans looked amazing, so let's hope Uni's post people keep the look intact all the way through.

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Originally Posted by NJPete View Post

I just heard from a friend and he confirms your info that a new scan of Jaws was done. 4k off the negative. He was operating the scanner and said the scans looked amazing, so let's hope Uni's post people keep the look intact all the way through.

I will, as always, keep an open mind and not rush to judgment and pre-condemn that which I have not seen. I'm hoping for the best.
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post #196 of 754 Old 04-14-2012, 09:58 AM
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Pre-ordered with a due sense of dread. Hopefully they'll do this film properly, but after seeing the Jurassic Park Blu-Ray its clear that Spielberg is much more involved in his Dreamworks owned pictures than the Universal properties.
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post #197 of 754 Old 04-14-2012, 01:34 PM
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There's no doubt that Jaws will come from a brand new transfer. In January Universal revealed a list of 13 titles that they will be giving new restorations this year. This list includes:
All Quiet on the Western Front
The Birds
Abbott & Costello's Buck Privates
Dracula (1931)
the Spanish-language Dracula filmed on the same set at night
Frankenstein
Jaws
Schindler's List
Out of Africa
Pillow Talk
Bride of Frankenstein
The Sting
To Kill a Mockingbird

BUT, since there are people who think it's okay to "manage" film grain and change the camera movement where it is not needed, we can not be sure if those restorations will be any good. We should hope for the best, but be prepared for the first.
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post #198 of 754 Old 04-15-2012, 04:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Strevlac View Post

Anyone have an opinion on All Quiet On The Western Front?

Unfortunately also a bit messed up. Grain is slightly smeary in motion and then sharpened, looks a bit like those Blue Underground titles e.g. Django but not as bad.
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post #199 of 754 Old 04-16-2012, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatBus View Post

Man, don't I know it! I haven't been to a movie theatre in the past forty years without SOMEBODY angrily walking out complaining, "Why don't these people look waxy? I'm not paying good money to see this unless the people are all waxy!" Thank goodness the studios have finally been responding to this audience demand!

For whatever reason, audiences tend to be completely oblivous to film grain in a theatrical setting, even though the screen is much bigger and the grain much more visible than what they'd see at home. Yet the same movie played back on a 30" HDTV, and suddenly the grain becomes abhorrent to them.

This is a real phenomena. When I ran the HD Advisor column at High-Def Digest, I'd get people writing in with complaints about "dirty" movies all the time.

Part of this is that these people have uncalibrated TVs with the Sharpness and Contrast settings maxed out, which will of course exaggerate grain. But it's also partly psychological. People have certain expectations for what movies look like in theaters, and can tune out grain there. But they expect content played back on their HDTV to look pristine and crystal clear, like shows or sporting events that were shot on HD video.

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post #200 of 754 Old 04-16-2012, 01:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

For whatever reason, audiences tend to be completely oblivous to film grain in a theatrical setting, even though the screen is much bigger and the grain much more visible than what they'd see at home. Yet the same movie played back on a 30" HDTV, and suddenly the grain becomes abhorrent to them.

This is a real phenomena. When I ran the HD Advisor column at High-Def Digest, I'd get people writing in with complaints about "dirty" movies all the time.

Part of this is that these people have uncalibrated TVs with the Sharpness and Contrast settings maxed out, which will of course exaggerate grain. But it's also partly psychological. People have certain expectations for what movies look like in theaters, and can tune out grain there. But they expect content played back on their HDTV to look pristine and crystal clear, like shows or sporting events that were shot on HD video.

Well said.
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post #201 of 754 Old 04-16-2012, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

For whatever reason, audiences tend to be completely oblivous to film grain in a theatrical setting, even though the screen is much bigger and the grain much more visible than what they'd see at home. Yet the same movie played back on a 30" HDTV, and suddenly the grain becomes abhorrent to them.

This is a real phenomena.

I believe you, and yet I don't want to believe you. I guess the lesson for me is that J6P makes the rules, and J6P knows no logic, so it's best to not even try to understand.
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post #202 of 754 Old 04-16-2012, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

For whatever reason, audiences tend to be completely oblivous to film grain in a theatrical setting, even though the screen is much bigger and the grain much more visible than what they'd see at home. Yet the same movie played back on a 30" HDTV, and suddenly the grain becomes abhorrent to them.

This is a real phenomena. When I ran the HD Advisor column at High-Def Digest, I'd get people writing in with complaints about "dirty" movies all the time.

Part of this is that these people have uncalibrated TVs with the Sharpness and Contrast settings maxed out, which will of course exaggerate grain. But it's also partly psychological. People have certain expectations for what movies look like in theaters, and can tune out grain there. But they expect content played back on their HDTV to look pristine and crystal clear, like shows or sporting events that were shot on HD video.

Spot on all points!

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post #203 of 754 Old 04-17-2012, 12:47 PM
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Maybe it's because they've bought this super-ultra-max-hdtv and now see grain WTF!

21:st century Karate Kid......Logon, Logoff, Logon, Logoff..
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post #204 of 754 Old 04-17-2012, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rezpekt View Post

There's no doubt that Jaws will come from a brand new transfer. In January Universal revealed a list of 13 titles that they will be giving new restorations this year. This list includes:
All Quiet on the Western Front
The Birds
Abbott & Costello's Buck Privates
Dracula (1931)
the Spanish-language Dracula filmed on the same set at night
Frankenstein
Jaws
Schindler's List
Out of Africa
Pillow Talk
Bride of Frankenstein
The Sting
To Kill a Mockingbird

Schinder's List needs restored?
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post #205 of 754 Old 04-18-2012, 08:22 PM
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Schinder's List needs restored?


What makes you think otherwise?

Movies must be OAR, sports and movies must also have 5.1 audio, No EE or NO SALE!
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post #206 of 754 Old 04-18-2012, 08:47 PM
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The 2K HD master for Schindler's dates to what? 2004? So that would be much fresher than the Jurassic Park ones, but probably on par with Back to the Future.

If there were no issues with the existing master, I probably wouldn't care either way. But the hype that Universal has been building up with these new re-issues probably means they want to do a 4K master.
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post #207 of 754 Old 04-18-2012, 09:28 PM
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Scanning anew doesn't mean "restoration"

Restoration To me means the film or negative itself is damaged.
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post #208 of 754 Old 05-10-2012, 07:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post

"then we had some great processing to try and manage some of the grain."

"BG: What were his views on the amount of grain? Audiences are always hard to please where classics are concerned. Some like it, some don't.

MD: It always is, but you need grain; film has inherent grain in it. When we're dealing with high resolution content like that and an original negative that has some grain in it, it's a fine line on managing that, and I think we've managed that fairly well in the look of the [film]. He was very happy with it."

Ohhh kay.

T.B.

Manage? More like nuke. Getting concerned now...
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post #209 of 754 Old 05-11-2012, 05:41 PM
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Manage? More like nuke. Getting concerned now...

You are not kidding. Jeezus!

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
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post #210 of 754 Old 05-11-2012, 06:30 PM
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You are not kidding. Jeezus!

I sincerely hope this is just a result of over and re-compressed YouTube quality, but even at 1080p, geez...
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