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post #91 of 112 Old 05-26-2012, 08:09 AM
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Watched the 2d version (on the 3d disc) earlier this week and watched the 3d version last night. I enjoyed the movie and thought it was a worthy sequel to the franchise, but it did feel a bit rushed/short. The good thing about the length though is there is never a dull moment so it is a fun ride.

3d was very subtle, but effective IMO. There was decent depth and even a handful of pop out moments which were fun. The 3d was better than I expected reading various comments here and is the best way to see this film IMO.

Audio was absolutely fantastic! Yes, this is a bass fest, BUT there is never bass just for the sake of bass like some people have alluded to. Anytime there is LFE, it is either in support of on screen action or to trigger emotion of impending doom or some sort of event. The LFE was like a character in itself and it really pulled me into the film. I loved how the Super Lycan was given the most weight as far as the low end which really convinced the audience of his dominance in relation to the regular Lycans. Anytime this big boy came on screen was just downright pure demo quality HT bliss IMO.

Some have also mentioned bass drowning out the other elements of the mix which I did not have ANY problem with. Even with as thundering and pounding as the low end got at times, it never drowned out the dialog and NEVER drowned out the awesome surround elements. There are some truly excellent panning effects and discrete type elements scattered throughout as far as the surround track in particular. Combined with the titanic low end, this one pulls you right in the middle and IMO probably the best audio track yet this year. 5 star reference audio in my book.

Just my thoughts. Great blind buy and my new audio demo movie for when people show up.

Thanks for that Todd looking forward in buying my copy next week.

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post #92 of 112 Old 05-26-2012, 08:30 AM
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Thanks for that Todd looking forward in buying my copy next week.

Curious to hear your thoughts Franin when you get your copy. Even though I loved the LFE and thought it worked very well for the reasons I mentioned, I can certainly understand how some might not like it since there is no denying the low end is VERY strong in this one. To me the LFE really supported not only the on screen elements, but the story as well. I never thought it was out of place.

I forgot to mention that due to how awesome the song in the credits sounded, I sat through right until the end which I VERY rarely do. Very clean and powerful music that will really work your entire system.

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post #93 of 112 Old 05-26-2012, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Toe View Post

Even though I loved the LFE and thought it worked very well for the reasons I mentioned, I can certainly understand how some might not like it since there is no denying the low end is VERY strong in this one. To me the LFE really supported not only the on screen elements, but the story as well. I never thought it was out of place.

I've never understood it when people complain about overpowering low end. I must be one of the lucky few whose preamp came with an LFE trim level. I keep things calibrated, but I certainly don't mind changing levels on the fly to make the sound fit my liking, especially with the subs.

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post #94 of 112 Old 05-26-2012, 01:41 PM
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I've never understood it when people complain about overpowering low end. I must be one of the lucky few whose preamp came with an LFE trim level. I keep things calibrated, but I certainly don't mind changing levels on the fly to make the sound fit my liking, especially with the subs.

Great point. Not sure why I dont do this more for movies where I feel there is to much or to little. I commonly do it for music and concerts.

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post #95 of 112 Old 05-27-2012, 01:04 AM
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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

I've never understood it when people complain about overpowering low end. I must be one of the lucky few whose preamp came with an LFE trim level. I keep things calibrated, but I certainly don't mind changing levels on the fly to make the sound fit my liking, especially with the subs.

True, that.

The mix in this movie is unusual...
In that, there is a lot of LFE.
However, it actually "fits."
The visuals demand nothing less....

I never felt the LFE levels didn't work.
As always: YMMV.

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post #96 of 112 Old 05-27-2012, 07:00 AM
 
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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

I've never understood it when people complain about overpowering low end. I must be one of the lucky few whose preamp came with an LFE trim level. I keep things calibrated, but I certainly don't mind changing levels on the fly to make the sound fit my liking, especially with the subs.

I'm not going to play with my settings because one movie chooses to be overblown. Chances are I'd forget to set them back to where they should be before the next film, and voila, I'm reviewing a disc and believing the bass is lacking.
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post #97 of 112 Old 05-27-2012, 07:44 AM
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Curious to hear your thoughts Franin when you get your copy. Even though I loved the LFE and thought it worked very well for the reasons I mentioned, I can certainly understand how some might not like it since there is no denying the low end is VERY strong in this one. To me the LFE really supported not only the on screen elements, but the story as well. I never thought it was out of place.

I forgot to mention that due to how awesome the song in the credits sounded, I sat through right until the end which I VERY rarely do. Very clean and powerful music that will really work your entire system.

Will do

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post #98 of 112 Old 05-27-2012, 08:02 AM
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I'm not going to play with my settings because one movie chooses to be overblown. Chances are I'd forget to set them back to where they should be before the next film, and voila, I'm reviewing a disc and believing the bass is lacking.

I adjust mine all the time. Sometimes I even move from one seat to another...during the movie. I'm an outlaw.

Stephen.

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post #99 of 112 Old 05-27-2012, 08:40 AM
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I adjust mine all the time. Sometimes I even move from one seat to another...during the movie. I'm an outlaw.

Rebel with a trim adjustment should be your signature.


I adjust my subs frequently with music and because of this I am in the habbit of doing a quick check before movies to make sure I am back at my standard setting.

GRG, just curious what your FR is for your low end? Are you pretty flat? I know there are lots of variables between setups and we all have dif opinions, but giving the audio a 2/5 seems very harsh IMO and I am wondering if maybe you might have some peaks in your low end that might be making it worse? Just a thought and maybe that is not the case. I am flat down to about 50hz and then have it hot below that for movies (music I am totally flat almost).

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post #100 of 112 Old 05-27-2012, 01:29 PM
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I adjust mine all the time. Sometimes I even move from one seat to another...during the movie. I'm an outlaw.

Sure I do adjust the SUB out too when I notice excessive output well below reference levels, Tron: Legacy, Super 8 Cloverfield comes to mind, but there is also, a design issue, which can't be adjusted by the user. Awakening, fell into that later issue for me, at least on Vudu, I still need to check this out on BD, but based on my experience I would be surprised to find much difference in that level, but one never knows.

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post #101 of 112 Old 05-27-2012, 05:10 PM
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Sure I do adjust the SUB out too when I notice excessive output well below reference levels, Tron: Legacy, Super 8 Cloverfield comes to mind, but there is also, a design issue, which can't be adjusted by the user. Awakening, fell into that later issue for me, at least on Vudu, I still need to check this out on BD, but based on my experience I would be surprised to find much difference in that level, but one never knows.

I've noticed in other posts that you've been watching some stuff online (I do the same), and I've noticed the soundtracks have been markedly different, especially in the LFE...compared to the same movies I've eventually rented on disc or bought. Just something to experiment with if you get the chance.

On my internet connection (which is pretty good), the HD material on low frequencies sounds a little "muddy" compared to the disc. However, even as much of an audio Nazi as I am, the convenience of pressing the rent button on certain movies is hard to argue with.

Stephen.

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post #102 of 112 Old 05-28-2012, 01:47 AM
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I've noticed in other posts that you've been watching some stuff online (I do the same), and I've noticed the soundtracks have been markedly different, especially in the LFE...compared to the same movies I've eventually rented on disc or bought. Just something to experiment with if you get the chance.

On my internet connection (which is pretty good), the HD material on low frequencies sounds a little "muddy" compared to the disc. However, even as much of an audio Nazi as I am, the convenience of pressing the rent button on certain movies is hard to argue with.

Yep convenience is really what they are all about. Yes audio does lack compared to BD, but Vudu does come pretty close at least it did in my previous experiences.

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post #103 of 112 Old 05-28-2012, 04:50 AM
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Rented this tonight finally get a chance to watch it.

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post #104 of 112 Old 05-28-2012, 10:35 AM
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Curious to hear your thoughts Franin when you get your copy. Even though I loved the LFE and thought it worked very well for the reasons I mentioned, I can certainly understand how some might not like it since there is no denying the low end is VERY strong in this one. To me the LFE really supported not only the on screen elements, but the story as well. I never thought it was out of place.

I forgot to mention that due to how awesome the song in the credits sounded, I sat through right until the end which I VERY rarely do. Very clean and powerful music that will really work your entire system.

Just finished watching I thought the LFE worked really well. There was a scene with Selena jumping to the ground were the bass matched it perfect I thought was pretty cool and that Lycan.....

It was good.

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post #105 of 112 Old 05-28-2012, 06:03 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Toe View Post

GRG, just curious what your FR is for your low end? Are you pretty flat? I know there are lots of variables between setups and we all have dif opinions, but giving the audio a 2/5 seems very harsh IMO and I am wondering if maybe you might have some peaks in your low end that might be making it worse? Just a thought and maybe that is not the case. I am flat down to about 50hz and then have it hot below that for movies (music I am totally flat almost).

I review around 225-250 discs a year, and I might have trouble with one or two in that time similar to this, and it's not just a bass issue all the time either. Sometimes other balance is out of whack. It just happens. Were it an equipment/calibration issue, I would assume I would come across it more often.

I agree my score was harsh and I went back and forth for a while on it, but in the end, I simply couldn't enjoy it on any level. 'Tis the nature of reviews.
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post #106 of 112 Old 05-28-2012, 06:41 PM
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I review around 225-250 discs a year, and I might have trouble with one or two in that time similar to this, and it's not just a bass issue all the time either. Sometimes other balance is out of whack. It just happens. Were it an equipment/calibration issue, I would assume I would come across it more often.

I agree my score was harsh and I went back and forth for a while on it, but in the end, I simply couldn't enjoy it on any level. 'Tis the nature of reviews.

That did not answer my question, but OK. The reason I ask is because with a track like this that is already strong in the low end, IF you have peaks in the LFE spectrum, that could very well be a big part of your problem. If you truly cant hear the awesome surround work on this track like you talk about in your review/comments, I am betting you do have some sort of calibration issue. As strong as the LFE is on this one, it certainly does not drown out the awesome surround work and this is why I am asking. Just a simple question and I would assume as a reviewer you do know the FR performance of your setup? Do you have peaks in the .1 range? Are your surround speakers calibrated to the same level as your mains? Sorry, not trying to be a dick, but I have watched this movie 3 times this week (the GF asked if we could watch it again last night due in large part to the awesome sound, and also so she could see it in 3d) and the surround info comes through loud and clear. Difference of opinion is one thing, but a 2/5?

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post #107 of 112 Old 05-28-2012, 06:55 PM
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That did not answer my question, but OK. The reason I ask is because with a track like this that is already strong in the low end, IF you have peaks in the LFE spectrum, that could very well be a big part of your problem. If you truly cant hear the awesome surround work on this track like you talk about in your review/comments, I am betting you do have some sort of calibration issue. As strong as the LFE is on this one, it certainly does not drown out the awesome surround work and this is why I am asking. Just a simple question and I would assume as a reviewer you do know the FR performance of your setup? Do you have peaks in the .1 range? Are your surround speakers calibrated to the same level as your mains? Sorry, not trying to be a dick, but I have watched this movie 3 times this week (the GF asked if we could watch it again last night due in large part to the awesome sound, and also so she could see it in 3d) and the surround info comes through loud and clear. Difference of opinion is one thing, but a 2/5?

A 2/5? ?? The audio was amazing.

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post #108 of 112 Old 05-29-2012, 04:07 AM
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That did not answer my question, but OK. The reason I ask is because with a track like this that is already strong in the low end, IF you have peaks in the LFE spectrum, that could very well be a big part of your problem. If you truly cant hear the awesome surround work on this track like you talk about in your review/comments, I am betting you do have some sort of calibration issue. As strong as the LFE is on this one, it certainly does not drown out the awesome surround work and this is why I am asking. Just a simple question and I would assume as a reviewer you do know the FR performance of your setup? Do you have peaks in the .1 range? Are your surround speakers calibrated to the same level as your mains? Sorry, not trying to be a dick, but I have watched this movie 3 times this week (the GF asked if we could watch it again last night due in large part to the awesome sound, and also so she could see it in 3d) and the surround info comes through loud and clear. Difference of opinion is one thing, but a 2/5?

I have to agree. Even though I thought the bass was a bit hot for my liking , the rest of the audio sounded really excellent Lots of crisp surround activity and very engaging.

Kaboom.
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post #109 of 112 Old 05-29-2012, 11:26 AM
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That did not answer my question, but OK. The reason I ask is because with a track like this that is already strong in the low end, IF you have peaks in the LFE spectrum, that could very well be a big part of your problem. If you truly cant hear the awesome surround work on this track like you talk about in your review/comments, I am betting you do have some sort of calibration issue. As strong as the LFE is on this one, it certainly does not drown out the awesome surround work and this is why I am asking. Just a simple question and I would assume as a reviewer you do know the FR performance of your setup? Do you have peaks in the .1 range? Are your surround speakers calibrated to the same level as your mains? Sorry, not trying to be a dick, but I have watched this movie 3 times this week (the GF asked if we could watch it again last night due in large part to the awesome sound, and also so she could see it in 3d) and the surround info comes through loud and clear. Difference of opinion is one thing, but a 2/5?

As fun as the bass is, I was really impressed by the surround action in this and mentioned so in the audio thread. But there are so many variables to audio in the home environment. (Heck, even commercial theaters can be a mixed bag) But between gear, the room/treatments, particular eq, sound isolation, ie can you play it LOUD without waking the baby or annoying someone and your own particular taste or bias etc. Why the HECK am I even interested what someone else thinks with all these variables? But it is still interesting to hear other's take on various audio performance.

I think you are right though in maybe there is common ground with knowledge that someone is flat to a certain hz or hot below that. I know folks that are so proud of their shiny mains (12 layers of hand rubbed oil over some wood that is now extinct or something) and are irked when the surrounds seem more important than the mains in many movies, so when we talk, they score a movie higher based on the performance of the mains over the surrounds and .1. That's their bias and good for them. In my dedicated setup the surrounds and .1 are really impactful in the room. My mains are certainly adequate but sterling content to the mains is expected. Exhilerating action from the surrounds and .1 are the wild card to separate a movie track for me.

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post #110 of 112 Old 05-29-2012, 02:32 PM
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I watched this last night. Great PQ/AQ but this was the worst movie in the entire series by far. It was torturous to watch.
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post #111 of 112 Old 05-29-2012, 03:25 PM
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I watched this last night. Great PQ/AQ but this was the worst movie in the entire series by far. It was torturous to watch.

I have to agree. Booo.

Thought it felt more like the last resident evil flick and less like other UNDERWORLDS..

Eitherway, she was nice to look at.
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post #112 of 112 Old 05-29-2012, 04:49 PM
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As fun as the bass is, I was really impressed by the surround action in this and mentioned so in the audio thread. But there are so many variables to audio in the home environment. (Heck, even commercial theaters can be a mixed bag) But between gear, the room/treatments, particular eq, sound isolation, ie can you play it LOUD without waking the baby or annoying someone and your own particular taste or bias etc. Why the HECK am I even interested what someone else thinks with all these variables? But it is still interesting to hear other's take on various audio performance.

I think you are right though in maybe there is common ground with knowledge that someone is flat to a certain hz or hot below that. I know folks that are so proud of their shiny mains (12 layers of hand rubbed oil over some wood that is now extinct or something) and are irked when the surrounds seem more important than the mains in many movies, so when we talk, they score a movie higher based on the performance of the mains over the surrounds and .1. That's their bias and good for them. In my dedicated setup the surrounds and .1 are really impactful in the room. My mains are certainly adequate but sterling content to the mains is expected. Exhilerating action from the surrounds and .1 are the wild card to separate a movie track for me.

You are right. I usually dont feel the need to debate a difference of opinion when it comes to audio for the reasons you mention, mainly the sheer amount of variables from one setup/person to another. In this case though considering how far apart his score is from not only my own opinion, but the majority and along with how he worded his thoughts, I felt this would be a good one to discuss. Here is the last paragraph of the audio portion of GRG review......

Short of bass hounds who thump music so loud in their cars they can’t even keep their trunks closed, this isn’t going to appeal to many people. It’s not fun to listen too because you can’t appreciate the wealth of sound being projected elsewhere. The soundstage is probably superb if it could be heard. The balance is off track, off course, and off kilter. Those minor moments where the film is sedated enough to produce something else are a reprieve. Then, it’s broken down because it’s time for more bass. Awful.

SO basically ALL of us who loved the audio on this one are "bass hounds who thump music so loud in their cars they cant even keep their trunks closed".....lol My car stereo is so weak it barely passes as such, lol.

"The soundstage is probably superb if it could be heard"...........hhmmmmm.....came through loud and clear in my room with one of the better soundstages I have experienced on blu ray disc with excellent dynamics, awesome discrete effects, great panning, wide spread stage across front/rear, etc........I felt I was right in the middle of the action.

Whatever though. It is all just opinion and like you say there are so many factors/variables from one setup to another it is not worth arguing about, BUT this review just irked me a bit since it talks down to any reader who actually liked the mix. It is probably written for reaction though, so in that sense it accomplished its goal with me! A 2/5 is a ridiculous score though IMHO even with difference of opinion taken into consideration. Just my opinion though and some wont like it which is fine.

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