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post #91 of 640 Old 07-11-2012, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

I have the Studio Canal HD DVD, which has a 5.1 track. I don't recall anything about it sounding much different than any other 5.1 mix for the movie I've seen. Does the SC Blu-ray have a different mix, and if so, what's wrong with that one?

StudioCanal did their own 7.1 mix a while back, adding lots of reverb to better 'sell' the rear speaker effects. Makes the track feel quite 'boxy', and the music sounds like it's being played in a bathtub. This is common to the 5.1 tracks on their initial HD DVD and Blu-ray offerings and the 7.1 track on Kino's German HD DVD. So, even though the Skynet edition has slightly smudgy PQ when compared with the SC version, I'll take the fuller, stronger sound mix of the Skynet every day of the week, and accept the PQ as the lesser of two weevils.
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post #92 of 640 Old 07-11-2012, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post

StudioCanal did their own 7.1 mix a while back, adding lots of reverb to better 'sell' the rear speaker effects. Makes the track feel quite 'boxy', and the music sounds like it's being played in a bathtub. This is common to the 5.1 tracks on their initial HD DVD and Blu-ray offerings and the 7.1 track on Kino's German HD DVD. So, even though the Skynet edition has slightly smudgy PQ when compared with the SC version, I'll take the fuller, stronger sound mix of the Skynet every day of the week, and accept the PQ as the lesser of two weevils.

Does the French HD DVD (which is a 5.1 track, not 7.1) supposedly have this problem as well, or just the discs with 7.1? I have admittedly not watched the disc in ages, but I don't recall anything being wrong with the soundtrack.

Many of Studio Canal's early HD DVDs and Blu-rays had a 4% pitch increase that sounds like PAL speedup, even though they run at the proper playback speed, but that doesn't sound like what you're describing. The French T2 HD DVD did not have a pitch problem.

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post #93 of 640 Old 07-12-2012, 04:35 PM
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The pitch of the SC T2 mixes is fine. As I said above, the 'reverb' effect is common to the 5.1 and 7.1 audio found on SC's various pre-Skynet versions. In fact, if people have the Euro Skynet Blu-ray then they can hear it for themselves by switching between the English 6.1 track (which is the Rydstrom 5.1 ES mix) and the German 7.1 version (which is the SC mix).
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post #94 of 640 Old 07-12-2012, 05:24 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post

The pitch of the SC T2 mixes is fine. As I said above, the 'reverb' effect is common to the 5.1 and 7.1 audio found on SC's various pre-Skynet versions. In fact, if people have the Euro Skynet Blu-ray then they can hear it for themselves by switching between the English 6.1 track (which is the Rydstrom 5.1 ES mix) and the German 7.1 version (which is the SC mix).

Its way to echo-ey
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post #95 of 640 Old 07-13-2012, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post

The pitch of the SC T2 mixes is fine. As I said above, the 'reverb' effect is common to the 5.1 and 7.1 audio found on SC's various pre-Skynet versions. In fact, if people have the Euro Skynet Blu-ray then they can hear it for themselves by switching between the English 6.1 track (which is the Rydstrom 5.1 ES mix) and the German 7.1 version (which is the SC mix).

Right, but what I'm asking is whether Studio Canal's French HD DVD 5.1 mix supposedly also has this problem? I don't recall anything sounding "off" about it. I have not watched the Studio Canal Blu-ray, which was remixed into 7.1.

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post #96 of 640 Old 07-13-2012, 01:24 PM
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Josh, I said that the HD DVD has the SC remix in post #92. Yes, it's only in 5.1, but if it's not a downmix of their 7.1 track then I'll eat an item of head-related apparel.
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post #97 of 640 Old 07-13-2012, 01:26 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post

Josh, I said that the HD DVD has the SC remix in post #92. Yes, it's only in 5.1, but if it's not a downmix of their 7.1 track then I'll eat an item of head-related apparel.

We agree on this 100%
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post #98 of 640 Old 07-14-2012, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post

Josh, I said that the HD DVD has the SC remix in post #92. Yes, it's only in 5.1, but if it's not a downmix of their 7.1 track then I'll eat an item of head-related apparel.

I'm not trying to be pedantic here, but what you said was that the boxy sound problem was "common to the 5.1 tracks on their initial HD DVD and Blu-ray offerings," which is not the same thing as saying that you know that this specific HD DVD has the problem. The French HD DVD predates the first appearance of the 7.1 track on other releases. I find it more likely that the 7.1 is an upmix of the 5.1 track, not the other way around. If the problem were introduced during the upmix, the original 5.1 may not suffer from it.

After all, Terminator 2 already had an official 5.1 mix long before the French HD DVD. There was no need for Studio Canal to "mix" or remix anything at that point. All they had to do was take the original file and put it on their disc. On the other hand, the attempt to upmix the track to 7.1 could be where the boxy sound problem was introduced.

But, again, I haven't watched the HD DVD in ages. Until I have a chance to do so, I'm not going to argue that you're "wrong," just that I don't remember that disc having the problem you describe. Maybe I'm misremembering.

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post #99 of 640 Old 07-14-2012, 01:57 PM
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StudioCanal only released one French version HD DVD. If you knew that then the implication of my statement was clear, if you didn't then I'll remember to be more specific next time. Your point about the 5.1 mix being the extant one by default is logical, but only if one assumes that the 7.1 mix had not been created at that stage. There was only a 10 month gap between the French and German releases, so it's not like the 7.1 mix debuted years later.

I watched the T2 SE Laserdisc again last night, and while the PCM track sounded beautifully clear the mix itself wasn't especially lively, which was slightly surprising. The rears were quite subdued, as was the bass, and there were some different decisions made regarding sound effects. There weren't loads of changes, but one that stood out was the lack of that daft WOOOOSH sound when Terminator uses his explosive 'entry key' to get into the Cyberdyne lab.
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post #100 of 640 Old 07-14-2012, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post

StudioCanal only released one French version HD DVD. If you knew that then the implication of my statement was clear, if you didn't then I'll remember to be more specific next time.

The way I read it, you were making a generalized statement about most of Studio Canal's HD DVDs and Blu-rays, not necessarily this specific title.

In general, most early Studio Canal HD DVDs had a 4% pitch increase, but this one didn't.
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Your point about the 5.1 mix being the extant one by default is logical, but only if one assumes that the 7.1 mix had not been created at that stage. There was only a 10 month gap between the French and German releases, so it's not like the 7.1 mix debuted years later.

But the German disc is from Kinowelt, not Studio Canal.

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post #101 of 640 Old 07-14-2012, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post


The way I read it, you were making a generalized statement about most of Studio Canal's HD DVDs and Blu-rays, not necessarily this specific title.
Oh. I was referring to T2 only, seeing as we're in a Terminator thread. Again, the inference was there but I can see that nothing gets past you. biggrin.gif
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But the German disc is from Kinowelt, not Studio Canal.

Kino are/were a subsidiary of StudioCanal.

http://www.studiocanal.com/en/news/latest-news/331/optimum-kinowelt-to-be-rebranded-as-studiocanal
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post #102 of 640 Old 07-14-2012, 04:03 PM
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One other thing to bear in mind regarding StudioCanal remixing the audio and applying it as a 'global' change (irrespective of it being 5.1 or 7.1) across all of their HD versions of T2: they co-produced the film, so they've obviously got enough clout to be able to make changes like that.
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post #103 of 640 Old 07-14-2012, 05:30 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff D View Post

StudioCanal only released one French version HD DVD. If you knew that then the implication of my statement was clear, if you didn't then I'll remember to be more specific next time. Your point about the 5.1 mix being the extant one by default is logical, but only if one assumes that the 7.1 mix had not been created at that stage. There was only a 10 month gap between the French and German releases, so it's not like the 7.1 mix debuted years later.
I watched the T2 SE Laserdisc again last night, and while the PCM track sounded beautifully clear the mix itself wasn't especially lively, which was slightly surprising. The rears were quite subdued, as was the bass, and there were some different decisions made regarding sound effects. There weren't loads of changes, but one that stood out was the lack of that daft WOOOOSH sound when Terminator uses his explosive 'entry key' to get into the Cyberdyne lab.

That was the third mix, not many changes from the second but it was the first near field version iirc
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post #104 of 640 Old 09-28-2012, 07:44 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Should be here tomorrow, will check the audio and them rip and mux the LD audio lol
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post #105 of 640 Old 09-28-2012, 08:43 PM
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Should be here tomorrow, will check the audio and them rip and mux the LD audio lol

Wish I had a way to get my hands on that soundtrack. I'd do the same thing.
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post #106 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 01:11 AM
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The image quality looks great.

achpbhfB.jpg acnxxcZL.jpg abwZSUbu.jpg acgT4clS.jpg
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post #107 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 03:22 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Got it, running a BD info scan now.

What is it with BDinfo and MGM discs of late? Just would not scan.

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post #108 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 04:13 AM
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Off topic, but all this T2 soundtrack talk has got me curious. Does anyone know offhand whether the Japanese Premium Edition original/2.0 features the Rydstrom mix or SC mix? I would guess (and hope) the former.
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post #109 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 04:16 AM - Thread Starter
 
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All recent releases have the new mix
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post #110 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 04:20 AM
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Including the Skynet (or, at least, the US Skynet)? I thought Geoff had said above it features the Rydstrom mix, and since the JP Geneon release isn't tied in with SC that I know of (could be wrong on that), I just assumed it to probably have the Rydstrom too. What about the US Ultimate ed. DVD and later Extreme edition? Rydstrom? I have those so they'd make for an easy point of comparison with the Geneon if it's indeed the SC mix.
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post #111 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 04:31 AM - Thread Starter
 
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The Rydstrom mix is the new mix, and is on every digital release
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post #112 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 05:30 AM
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The screens looks bloody fantastic
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post #113 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post

The Rydstrom mix is the new mix, and is on every digital release

What differences is there to the old mix? And I gues that the old mix is the better one.

I know that on Star Wars, the 93 mix(based on the 6-track 70mm) is superior to the 2004 DVD and 2011 BD
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post #114 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 06:15 AM - Thread Starter
 
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The gun sounds are punchier and there are a few spacial changes, I do not have a full list yet as my PC died when I was compiling them last year
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post #115 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 08:29 AM
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Numerous layers of the music score are also missing. It's as bad as what Anchor Bay did with Suspiria.

Beyond the alteration of the music score (which was a mistake, not a purposeful act by the director) they also replaced all of the futuristic sound effects with the sounds from T2 so they "matched up.' But for those of us who know T1, that was beyond distracting.

All of the gun shots were replaced.

The Terminator's handgun sounds like it has a silencer, which it clearly does not.

It was met with unbridled hatred upon its release, but still... nothing is being done to fix it.

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post #116 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 01:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens View Post

Numerous layers of the music score are also missing. It's as bad as what Anchor Bay did with Suspiria.
Beyond the alteration of the music score (which was a mistake, not a purposeful act by the director) they also replaced all of the futuristic sound effects with the sounds from T2 so they "matched up.' But for those of us who know T1, that was beyond distracting.
All of the gun shots were replaced.
The Terminator's handgun sounds like it has a silencer, which it clearly does not.
It was met with unbridled hatred upon its release, but still... nothing is being done to fix it.

We were talking about T2 for some reason, but that list is great to compare the first, thanks I could not find more than a few YT clips and a few vague statements.



Did a quick A - B and it's louder in places but still the same ass mix
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post #117 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 05:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Anyone tried the 2.0 non English options? Some of them sound way closer in places to the mono
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post #118 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 06:40 PM
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I forgot I ordered the Terminator Disc form Amazon UK. Is this going to be alot better than the Blu-ray Disc launch Terminator title I have? The order is already at "Dispatching Soon" so I guess I'll be getting it whether I want it or not. I think at $20 US shipped it should still be cheaper than the BD I got in June 2006.

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post #119 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 06:56 PM
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It'd be nice if someone created a youtube video showing what scenes had their music removed, etc. I'm kind of oblivious to the way it was in the theater and vhs.

Also, what is the reason this transfer isn't being released in the US? Why do countries in which the film wasn't made get a better transfer than domestic?

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post #120 of 640 Old 09-29-2012, 11:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post

The Rydstrom mix is the new mix, and is on every digital release

Sorry, hadn't had the chance to come back by since my last post. You probably realize this but I was differentiating between the Rydstrom mix (which I thought dated back to the US Ult. Ed DVD and has been used ever since) and this apparent alternate Studio Canal mix Geoff mentioned, which I took to be more recent since going by his remarks it debuted on SC's pre-Skynet HD-DVD/BD releases. Do I have that right? So basically, Rydstrom is on everything except the pre-Skynet SC releases - including, presumably, the Geneon JP BDs. Does that sound right? Everyone else - I'm talking T2 here, so there's no confusion.
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