Prometheus - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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post #631 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi2016 View Post

I can't really understand that.. the 3D is encoded directly into the source, I don't see how the equipment could have any effects on it in terms of depth and separation.

Yes you would think wouldn't you but based on Imagic's absolute stubborn refusal to accept that there is anything wrong with the content, I have been looking deeply into the operation of my Panasonic Blu-Ray player over the last hour or so and have found that the software on the device and the ludicrous settings Panasonic choose to default too on playback has been killing the 3D on Prometheous almost entirely.

On standard playback I get plenty of 3D on every title but not this disk. Oddly, the players default setting result in virtually no offset and there just isn't much if any 3D. When you guys see the Captain in 3D at the far end of a 3D room tending a 3D Christmas tree, I see a captain that is almost flat tending a flat Christmas Tree in a 2D room.

If I resort to manual 3D setting, suddenly I get offset and stunning 3D. mad.gif

So, my appologies guys for complaining about the Title. I am completely wrong and it in indeed my useless player that has been causing the problem which just goes to shown that its not just zeros and ones, its also the way in which the software in these players interprets and outputs these zeros and one.

I am off to take my embarrased backside to my HT to enjoy Prometheous in proper 3D at last!

Thanks Imagic for your insistence with this one. I would probably have never got to see this one in proper 3D without you. I am very grateful.
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post #632 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 12:18 PM
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I'm not a big 3D fan, but the 2D looked and sounded fantastic!smile.gif

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post #633 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 01:17 PM
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Rented this last night in 2D. PQ/AQ was fantastic. The film? Well, it was hit and miss for me. Definitely not up there with ALIEN and ALIENS.....

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post #634 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 02:02 PM
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That's totally unhelpful. Numerous players have an adjustment for the 3D effect. Panasonic has two different 'projection' settings - flat and spherical (or something similar) as well as an adjustable convergence point (or depth, or whatever). Those bits are still being converted back to analog output, and cheap Blu-Ray players are well known for botching various aspects of playback, contrary to your contention.
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Some players produce stronger 1's and 0's, so the ones are one-ier and the zeros are zero-ier. It's also important to use gluten-free cables for the best 3D experience. biggrin.gif

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post #635 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 02:48 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbcdesign View Post

Yes you would think wouldn't you but based on Imagic's absolute stubborn refusal to accept that there is anything wrong with the content, I have been looking deeply into the operation of my Panasonic Blu-Ray player over the last hour or so and have found that the software on the device and the ludicrous settings Panasonic choose to default too on playback has been killing the 3D on Prometheous almost entirely.
On standard playback I get plenty of 3D on every title but not this disk. Oddly, the players default setting result in virtually no offset and there just isn't much if any 3D. When you guys see the Captain in 3D at the far end of a 3D room tending a 3D Christmas tree, I see a captain that is almost flat tending a flat Christmas Tree in a 2D room.
If I resort to manual 3D setting, suddenly I get offset and stunning 3D. mad.gif
So, my appologies guys for complaining about the Title. I am completely wrong and it in indeed my useless player that has been causing the problem which just goes to shown that its not just zeros and ones, its also the way in which the software in these players interprets and outputs these zeros and one.
I am off to take my embarrased backside to my HT to enjoy Prometheous in proper 3D at last!
Thanks Imagic for your insistence with this one. I would probably have never got to see this one in proper 3D without you. I am very grateful.

Weird, to say the least. At least you got the issue resolved and we're not all crazy!

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post #636 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 03:40 PM
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Returned my faulty 4 disc set to BB and got a replacement. This one does the same thing only now it starts going screwy even earlier in the movie. Oh well. I guess I'll try and do a firmware upgrade and see if that helps but I can't see how firmware would cause macroblocking errors.
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post #637 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 03:50 PM
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The replacement disc is probably from their same damaged shipment. If there's another BD outlet in your area, you might try that. Target carries it too, for example, although at a slightly higher price.

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post #638 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 05:01 PM
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A user on a different forum said he got a firmware update for his player that resolved the playback issues.

CBC: That's really weird. I can see how you can manually adjust separation and the like, but the player can't actually reduce the angle of the alternate-eye shot.. I just don't get how that's happening. Then again, I'm one of those "hands-off" kind of viewers.. I don't want the player or the TV to be doing anything extra than just displaying what's on the disc, as close to 100% original as possible. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just saying it's stupid for Panasonic to add a feature that changes the output in any way. I'm really going to have to look into that when I buy future hardware.

My monitor does have a built-in 2D>3D converter function that's turned off. I wonder what it would do if that function were turned on, while it was also receiving a 3D signal (which I don't think it can identify)? I'm going to have go through my software settings to make sure it's not doing something stupid (although I don't think it is).

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post #639 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 05:19 PM
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I couldn't agree more. I have my Onkyo just sending whatever comes from the HDMI socket of the Blu-ray player directly to the speakers without any sort of enhancement or alteration of any kind. I too dislike anything that alters the source.

It never occurred to me that the player would mess up the 3D, I just assumed it output the images off the disk. That was why I just could not understand why everybody was saying how good the 3D is on Prometheus Blu-Ray (Which it is by the way) when I was seeing very mediocre 3D. It's really very odd and not something I have ever come across before.

The player does have a soft minimal depth feature and I wonder if there is some sort of glitch that is causing normal mode to adopt these settings? Putting it in manual mode seems to override this and its like a switch, a sudden and large improvement in the 3D appears on screen.
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post #640 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 05:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

Weird, to say the least. At least you got the issue resolved and we're not all crazy!
smile.gif

Yeah and Thankfully niether am I. I really was seeing mediocre 3D thanks to a ridiculous and puzzling issue with a Panasonic Blu-Ray player. eek.gif
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post #641 of 997 Old 10-14-2012, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

That's totally unhelpful. Numerous players have an adjustment for the 3D effect. Panasonic has two different 'projection' settings - flat and spherical (or something similar) as well as an adjustable convergence point (or depth, or whatever). Those bits are still being converted back to analog output, and cheap Blu-Ray players are well known for botching various aspects of playback, contrary to your contention.

Hehe, just having some fun there. I admit I've never heard of players that allow the consumer to jack around with the offset of 3D Blu-ray left and right images. Sounds like a recipe for confusion at best.
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post #642 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 12:04 AM
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I'm not a fan of 3D, I hate it actually, but the best 3D (in live action movie) I've seen was in Avatar and Transformers 3.

Prometheus felt very flat to me, there was no dimensionality, no depth. Dariusz Wolski also shot Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides and for the whole movie I was wondering "Why am I even wearing those goddamn glasses? This is 2D."

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post #643 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 03:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Johnny Vertigo View Post

I'm not a fan of 3D, I hate it actually, but the best 3D (in live action movie) I've seen was in Avatar and Transformers 3.
Prometheus felt very flat to me, there was no dimensionality, no depth. Dariusz Wolski also shot Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides and for the whole movie I was wondering "Why am I even wearing those goddamn glasses? This is 2D."

I think Dariusz Wolski knows how to produce decent depth when shooting in 3D. He proved that in Pirates and in Prometheus. The depth in the alien ship for example is really good. Where I dislike his shooting style though is where he includes foreground objects in a 3D shot then uses a DOF that puts them out of focus. I don't see any point in including blurred foreground objects in any 3D shot.

That is my only critisism but otherwise he does a very fine job I think.
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post #644 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 05:59 AM
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I gotta ask, what equipment are you using to watch it... because it's not the movie, it's either you or it's the gear you watched it on. Guaranteed.
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Originally Posted by Johnny Vertigo View Post

I'm not a fan of 3D, I hate it actually, but the best 3D (in live action movie) I've seen was in Avatar and Transformers 3.
Prometheus felt very flat to me, there was no dimensionality, no depth. Dariusz Wolski also shot Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides and for the whole movie I was wondering "Why am I even wearing those goddamn glasses? This is 2D."

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post #645 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 06:53 AM
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Got the 4-disc set from Best Buy over the weekend. Updated the firmware of my PS3 to latest version before playing, and watched both the 2D Blu-Ray and special features disc without a single problem.

The 3.5 hour making of documentary was great!

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post #646 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post

I gotta ask, what equipment are you using to watch it... because it's not the movie, it's either you or it's the gear you watched it on. Guaranteed.

I would second what Imagic said to be honest having sworn blind it was the movie only to find that my player was inhibiting the 3D. Have a look and see if your player has defaulted to a minimal 3D depth setting like mine (Panasonic DMP-BDT110) had. It made a MASSIVE difference on mine and just opened up the 3D to the sort of levels I was expecting from the outset and just not getting.
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post #647 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by cbcdesign View Post

I would second what Imagic said to be honest having sworn blind it was the movie only to find that my player was inhibiting the 3D. Have a look and see if your player has defaulted to a minimal 3D depth setting like mine (Panasonic DMP-BDT110) had. It made a MASSIVE difference on mine and just opened up the 3D to the sort of levels I was expecting from the outset and just not getting.

I have that same player, what settings did you change and what did you change them to?
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post #648 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbcdesign 
The player does have a soft minimal depth feature and I wonder if there is some sort of glitch that is causing normal mode to adopt these settings? Putting it in manual mode seems to override this and its like a switch, a sudden and large improvement in the 3D appears on screen.

I think it more likely that the 3D encoded on the disc is as mediocre as previously discussed, and you have turned on a setting in the player that distorts the image in order to "boost" the 3D effect, which then brings this one into normal standards. How do your other 3D discs that you previously felt were fine look now? The same as before, or grossly exaggerated?

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post #649 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by imagic 
Clearly you have no clue what you are talking about. Consult an ophthalmologist. Spare us your misguided opinion. Ridley Scott surely knows what he's doing. unlike you.

Well, you sure schooled me with such a technically detailed and flawlessly logical argument. Allow me to counter that with an equally well considered response:

Nuh uh.

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post #650 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 11:10 AM
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You are not worth arguing with and I could care less if you belong to some tiny club of people who never saw Prometheus in glorious 3D. Some people think the world was created in 4004 B.C. and no amount of 'science' will change their minds - so it is with Prometheus, 3D and you. I figure you just enjoy being a contrarian.
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Well, you sure schooled me with such a technically detailed and flawlessly logical argument. Allow me to counter that with an equally well considered response:
Nuh uh.

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post #651 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 11:14 AM
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I can't wait to see what happens! I got rid of that exact Blu-Ray player after having it for only a week! Whatever it's default settings were, they made Immortals look like a cartoonish pastiche of cardboard cut-outs... the worst sort of 3D conversion. After getting rid of that Panny and watching Immortals through PowerDVD, Immortals looked incredible. I'm sure there are settings on that Panasonic that would yield a good 3D image, but I never had a chance to find them, seeing the PowerDVD rendition made me give up stand-alone players altogether.
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I have that same player, what settings did you change and what did you change them to?

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post #652 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 11:49 AM
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So in summary if we want to watch this at home in 3d we should probably wait for all these issues to get sorted out?


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post #653 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by swanlee View Post

So in summary if we want to watch this at home in 3d we should probably wait for all these issues to get sorted out?

Issues are with the players not with the disc, nothing will be sorted out with that. If youa re referring to the bad discs, unless you shop at best Buy, then you probably dont have anything to worry about.....
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post #654 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post

I gotta ask, what equipment are you using to watch it... because it's not the movie, it's either you or it's the gear you watched it on. Guaranteed.
I haven't seen it on Blu-ray, it was IMAX 3D. In the same cinema I've seen Avatar, TRON: Legacy Transformers 3 and Prometheus so I don't think there was something wrong with projector.

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post #655 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 02:00 PM
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And yet, a mis-configured projector (operator error) would be my #1 suspicion, especially if it's the same theater where you thought Tron looked more 3D than Prometheus. It's the only explanation that makes sense.
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I haven't seen it on Blu-ray, it was IMAX 3D. In the same cinema I've seen Avatar, TRON: Legacy Transformers 3 and Prometheus so I don't think there was something wrong with projector.

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post #656 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic 
OK so either Ridley Scott has no clue what he is doing

Considering the movie script that he chose to shoot, do you really think this is an unreasonable suggestion? The Ridley Scott of today is not the same man who made Alien and Blade Runner three decades ago. His talents have steadily slipped away over that time.
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and the majority of people who watched Prometheus, critics included, were fooling themselves... or you are wrong. It happens to be the latter.

Another great, convincing argument from you! To which I will exert an equivalent amount of mental faculty to counter with:

Neener neener boo boo, nyah! tongue.gif

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post #657 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 03:08 PM
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Everyone is entitled to their opinion but you really think Scott has slipped in 30 years?

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post #658 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 03:21 PM
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I haven't seen most of the films Ridley Scott has made in the last decade; but BHD was absolute crap IMO, it made me embarrassed for him, doing such vapid mercenary hackwork. American Gangster was forgettable and could've been made by any half-decent director. I'm one of the seemingly few people who didn't mind Hannibal that much, but before Prometheus I have to go as far back as Gladiator to find much evidence of a gifted filmmaker pulling the strings.
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post #659 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by TonyDP View Post

Just got thru watching the deleted scenes and for once I actually think they would have made the movie far, far better. Several key scenes really flesh out the story in interesting ways that were only hinted at in the theatrical cut. In particular a scene where Yanek talks to Vickers about an experience he had at a military complex on Earth, an extended sequence where Weyland speaks to the engineer and basically considers himself a god who wants to live forever, and Shaw's final confrontation with the engineer and her exchange with David all are far far more interesting than the versions that were shown theatrically. An alternate scene of a much more alien looking Fifield attacking his crewmates was also more interesting than what we got in the final cut.
In watching the making of feature it becomes pretty clear that Ridley Scott gets so many ideas while he's prepping a film that he can easily outstmart himself, changing a sequence that works perfectly fine with something which at first might appear better but in retrospect is probably a step backward.

Agreed.

High-def digest has a GLOWING review of the movie and bluray. he did not see the need for some of the alternate scenes. I think they would have helped many flesh out the movie.

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/7146/prometheus_3d.html

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post #660 of 997 Old 10-15-2012, 04:44 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Yet another poor thread of mine gone to the dogs, and something's are worth a warning or two, but hot damn for my sanity I am out

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