NetFlix RedBox BD's Without DTS-HD Master Audio or TrueHD / DD 5.1 Instead - Page 46 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1351 of 1375 Old 08-30-2017, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by C*Tedesco View Post
HA! I liked it! Not the best, but I was entertained, except the ending.

Sound was great!
Just watched Alien and Aliens for the first time. Alien's had one of the best endings I've seen in a film. Sound impressed me w/ the newer DTS mixes, tho rear channel's lacked a bit in the 2nd film. Now I'm justing waiting for the other four films from DVD Netflix...apparently they're have shortage issues w/ Alien 3. My guess, it's so bad people are snapping the discs in half out of anger.
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post #1352 of 1375 Old 08-31-2017, 09:22 AM - Thread Starter
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They could have released it in mono AFAIC .. as a long time Alien Fan, this thing was just plain bad on so many levels ..
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Originally Posted by C*Tedesco View Post
HA! I liked it! Not the best, but I was entertained, except the ending.

Sound was great!
While I don't want this Thread to become the "Movie Review" Thread, I have to say .. "Covenant" looked great and sounded great .. my problem with it lies in the sheer implausibility of much of the film .. and I have a fairly high level of belief suspension ..

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post #1353 of 1375 Old 09-01-2017, 08:26 AM
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Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post
While I don't want this Thread to become the "Movie Review" Thread, I have to say .. "Covenant" looked great and sounded great .. my problem with it lies in the sheer implausibility of much of the film .. and I have a fairly high level of belief suspension ..
Come on Uncle Willy, it's Hi-Fi Sci-Fi, what do you expect? (That was a rhetorical question).


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post #1354 of 1375 Old 09-01-2017, 08:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Come on Uncle Willy, it's Hi-Fi Sci-Fi, what do you expect? (That was a rhetorical question).


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Yeah, Ian .. but I think you know what I'm talking about .. the sheer laxness of the Landing Party was ridiculous ..

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post #1355 of 1375 Old 09-04-2017, 02:18 PM
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Anyone know if the following rentals from Redbox or Netflix have Atmos:

Ghost in the Shell
John Wick 2
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post #1356 of 1375 Old 09-07-2017, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post
..."Covenant" looked great and sounded great .. my problem with it lies in the sheer implausibility of much of the film .. and I have a fairly high level of belief suspension ..
I just saw Ghost in the Shell and even being a UHD via Google Play Movies, still enjoyed the visuals. I watched it a 2nd time and the plot definitely did weight it down a bit, but I think I might have to check into Redbox and see if they have a better audio track, cause Dolby Digital didn't exactly impress.

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Anyone know if the following rentals from Redbox or Netflix have Atmos:

Ghost in the Shell
John Wick 2
John Wick 2, yes, Ghost in the Shell...you tell me!
https://i.imgur.com/Za8mXqR.jpg
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post #1357 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 08:52 AM
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Anyone rented Hell or High Water from redbox or Netflix? It's Lionsgate, and I'm wondering the usual about its sound. On the Netflix spec page, it does say it has "DTS-HD Master Audio."

Thanks for the help.

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post #1358 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by markhyams View Post
Anyone rented Hell or High Water from redbox or Netflix? It's Lionsgate, and I'm wondering the usual about its sound. On the Netflix spec page, it does say it has "DTS-HD Master Audio."

Thanks for the help.

Mark
Hell or High Water has a DTS Master Audio soundtrack from Redbox...at least it did for me.
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post #1359 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by deano86 View Post
Hell or High Water has a DTS Master Audio soundtrack from Redbox...at least it did for me.
Have any of you thought of a formal letter/petition with a ton of signatures to them (both RB & LG etc) to say that you refuse to support them at all unless they cease ALL of the BS of having "special" versions for rental with audio tracks etc stripped out vs the retail variant(s).

Also for any of you that do rent and find a "fubar" edition demand a refund on it and raise hell with their CS so they must compensate you for your lost time due to their stupidity.

Hit em where they actually care.. the $.. since ultimately that is all they do care about and crap like this being "in the name of piracy" is total complete BS the same as the idiotic encryption system has nothing do do with piracy. (It's only about control of how you use the product and to force you to watch commercials etc.. to maximize profits at your expense. The same as region coding is a pathetic scam.)

Think also on the $ wasted via "forced" upgrades over hdcp2+ for 4K when some equipment could already handle it or at least pass through the video untouched.. and leave otherwise good equipment alone since many still could handle all the sound tracks we have or damn near all of them w/o issue.

It's sad really how few ppl clue in on how badly they are being shafted by the "industry" in that regard on top of the obvious BS like missing sound tracks.
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post #1360 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 09:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Shalimar View Post
Have any of you thought of a formal letter/petition with a ton of signatures to them (both RB & LG etc) to say that you refuse to support them at all unless they cease ALL of the BS of having "special" versions for rental with audio tracks etc stripped out vs the retail variant(s).

Also for any of you that do rent and find a "fubar" edition demand a refund on it and raise hell with their CS so they must compensate you for your lost time due to their stupidity.

Hit em where they actually care.. the $.. since ultimately that is all they do care about and crap like this being "in the name of piracy" is total complete BS the same as the idiotic encryption system has nothing do do with piracy. (It's only about control of how you use the product and to force you to watch commercials etc.. to maximize profits at your expense. The same as region coding is a pathetic scam.)

Think also on the $ wasted via "forced" upgrades over hdcp2+ for 4K when some equipment could already handle it or at least pass through the video untouched.. and leave otherwise good equipment alone since many still could handle all the sound tracks we have or damn near all of them w/o issue.

It's sad really how few ppl clue in on how badly they are being shafted by the "industry" in that regard on top of the obvious BS like missing sound tracks.
This Thread has been devoted to the dissemination of the Info as well as past consorted efforts to contact and complain .. the issue is generally One Company and the reasoning has been discussed ad infinitum, here .. your Post is nothing new .. there are pages and pages that have covered your points ..

Feel free to pursue your suggestions .. many of us already have ..

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post #1361 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by markhyams View Post
Anyone rented Hell or High Water from redbox or Netflix? It's Lionsgate, and I'm wondering the usual about its sound. On the Netflix spec page, it does say it has "DTS-HD Master Audio."

Thanks for the help.

Mark
The Netflix rental does have DTS-HD Master Audio, but it was on a single-layer 25gb disc whereas blu-ray.com says it's supposed to be a 50gb double-layer disc. I thought that was odd. Maybe they lowered the video bitrate for the rental version? Or removed the extras? I wish I would have looked into it further when I had the disc.
Whatever the case, the movie was pretty good IMO.
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post #1362 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 09:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cnelson87 View Post
The Netflix rental does have DTS-HD Master Audio, but it was on a single-layer 25gb disc whereas blu-ray.com says it's supposed to be a 50gb double-layer disc. I thought that was odd. Maybe they lowered the video bitrate for the rental version? Or removed the extras? I wish I would have looked into it further when I had the disc.
Whatever the case, the movie was pretty good IMO.
This is generally done in order to save the cost of a double-layer blank BD for Rental Purposes ..

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post #1363 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post
This is generally done in order to save the cost of a double-layer blank BD for Rental Purposes ..
Yeah, I've seen rentals that don't have extras, but I wasn't aware that they sometimes use a lower video bitrate. Ugh that sucks. Do we need a new thread to discuss which which Netflix and RedBox discs have nerfed video now?
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post #1364 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 10:37 AM - Thread Starter
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DVD continues to out sell BD, the trend has been constant and the trend has been down on both .. most people could care less .. the numbers include disks sold both to Consumers and to Rental Outfits .. we enthusiasts continue to live in the minority, sadly ..


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post #1365 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post
This Thread has been devoted to the dissemination of the Info as well as past consorted efforts to contact and complain .. the issue is generally One Company and the reasoning has been discussed ad infinitum, here .. your Post is nothing new .. there are pages and pages that have covered your points ..

Feel free to pursue your suggestions .. many of us already have ..
Fair enough and I figured it might also be posted elsewhere... but given the nature of the info even if it is a complete duplication of that info it won't hurt to have it there and if anthing it could help.

As for doing such. I've done that and far more already actually including some work on bypasses (for many yrs now) of the idiocy they try to force on us (and yes it's perfectly legal for me since I'm not in the US and therefore am not subject to the draconian crap aka dmca). All of my systems are already setup to bypass virtually all of their crap by default already. However many ppl lack the tech background etc to do the same and I don't like seeing the avg person like say my mom as an example getting screwed over by the various companies with such garbage.

Also I understand it's mostly one company for the missing tracks but the rest is just as applicable to all of th various companies.. and sadly while one does this others might follow suit unless they see a negative backlash from the consumers. In that regard I help spread the word as best I can as well.

That said even just the listing alone for the one company is certainly of value esp for those that get redbox etc near them.

The big value however of any such petition etc for RB would have to come from someone in the US since that is their primary market. They already pulled the plug on their Canadian attempt due to lack of demand vs what they thought and they were told flat out that would happen since we are not constrained to follow the idiotic dmca and will refuse to support an inferior product especially one that is intentionally hobbled due to corporate greed when we have fa better alternatives.

It's like a client of mine recently made a comment on the fact that the "illegal" copy of X product worked better, faster and w/o issue than the real 100% legal "bought and paid for" version and wondered why anyone would willingly support the inferior product that is made worse intentionally only in the name of greed and gouging the consumer(s). I couldn't help but laugh a little at the time and then explained the basics to him as to why etc.. and his end verdict was "oh well I'll simply not buy their crap anymore until they stop fixing what isn't broken" and promptly canceled his "service" in question much to the dismay of the company that was getting $ from him routinely. In his case the service supplier even tried desperately to get him to stay with their service offering months free etc.. he turned them down and killed off his account completely and told them why he refused to buy their crap anymore.

Granted many won't due that but if even a handful do speak up that will start to get noticed and word of mouth from those that doe learn is a powerful tool for us all thankfully.

Meanwhile continue on with the list everyone.. and lets not idly sit back and just take it quietly so to speak!
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post #1366 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 11:01 AM
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DVD continues to out sell BD, the trend has been constant and the trend has been down on both .. most people could care less .. the numbers include disks sold both to Consumers and to Rental Outfits .. we enthusiasts continue to live in the minority, sadly ..

Unfortunately that is very true in many ways. However we as a minority also tend to be the ones that do speak up far more often and don't just accept whatever crap they try to serve up.. so thankfully in some ways due to us the majority do eventually tend to get better quality in the end (and in some cases with less BS stunts pulled like what this thread is all about)
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post #1367 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 11:11 AM - Thread Starter
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All I can tell you guys is the same thing most all of us know :: RB and NF don't define the terms of the bulk rental agreements they have with any Studio .. the Studios themselves define those agreements ..

The bottom line, as has been noted many times, is, if the consumer wants a cheap rental, NF & RB must abide by the Studios conditions .. I don't agree with it, but, as of yet, the Head of any Major Studio has not called and asked my opinion .. ..

I generally always agree with the gripes .. however, the bottom line is, er, bottom dollar Consumer rental cost .. if you want the full meal deal and don't have a real B&M in your area, then ::

https://www.store-3d-blurayrental.com/

RB and NF are not the culprits, nor are they the only source of content ..

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post #1368 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 11:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Unfortunately that is very true in many ways. However we as a minority also tend to be the ones that do speak up far more often and don't just accept whatever crap they try to serve up.. so thankfully in some ways due to us the majority do eventually tend to get better quality in the end (and in some cases with less BS stunts pulled like what this thread is all about)
I hope what you're saying holds true .. however, disk as a physical medium is still likely to continue it's decline and eventually end up a niche / boutique market ..

Because the bulk of Consumers don't care and value convenience over quality ..

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post #1369 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 01:24 PM
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All I can tell you guys is the same thing most all of us know :: RB and NF don't define the terms of the bulk rental agreements they have with any Studio .. the Studios themselves define those agreements ..

RB and NF are not the culprits, nor are they the only source of content ..
I will respectfully disagree with you here. Redbox and Netflix are customers of the studios, and they have mutually agreed-upon terms of how they do business with the studios. RB and NF are large customers of the studios, and have some leverage when negotiating deals with the studios. We (as individuals) have zero leverage at all when dealing with the studios, so complaining to Lionsgate is a waste of time. We are customers of Redbox and Netflix. If we complain to RB and NF enough and it affects their business, they will try and alter the terms of their contracts with the studios.

On another note, I notice that some Lionsgate films are now coming to RB and NF with lossless audio, which is a good thing. Maybe they have enough data now, which shows that their practice of neutering the rental copies has no effect on sales.

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post #1370 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post
I hope what you're saying holds true .. however, disk as a physical medium is still likely to continue it's decline and eventually end up a niche / boutique market ..

Because the bulk of Consumers don't care and value convenience over quality ..
Streaming quality is getting better and the gap is narrowing to the point that convenience has gained more weight then what is currently considered first rate.

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post #1371 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 01:56 PM - Thread Starter
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I will respectfully disagree with you here. Redbox and Netflix are customers of the studios, and they have mutually agreed-upon terms of how they do business with the studios. RB and NF are large customers of the studios, and have some leverage when negotiating deals with the studios. We (as individuals) have zero leverage at all when dealing with the studios, so complaining to Lionsgate is a waste of time. We are customers of Redbox and Netflix. If we complain to RB and NF enough and it affects their business, they will try and alter the terms of their contracts with the studios.

On another note, I notice that some Lionsgate films are now coming to RB and NF with lossless audio, which is a good thing. Maybe they have enough data now, which shows that their practice of neutering the rental copies has no effect on sales.
That's the whole point of what I had previously written .. .. it's not going to effect NF nor RB .. NF could care less as they continue to move toward an all streaming model and RB appeals to the lowest common denominator ..

In addition, the Studios have the leverage .. is NF or RB going to boycott a disk they can rent .. ?? No .. as well, that's one of the reasons NF makes it's own content ..

Again, we've been over this here from the get go ..

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post #1372 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 01:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Streaming quality is getting better and the gap is narrowing to the point that convenience has gained more weight then what is currently considered first rate.

Ian
Exactly .. and, since the bulk of the populace is still happy with DVD quality, that pretty much says it all, at least, IMO ..

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post #1373 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post
All I can tell you guys is the same thing most all of us know :: RB and NF don't define the terms of the bulk rental agreements they have with any Studio .. the Studios themselves define those agreements ..

The bottom line, as has been noted many times, is, if the consumer wants a cheap rental, NF & RB must abide by the Studios conditions .. I don't agree with it, but, as of yet, the Head of any Major Studio has not called and asked my opinion .. ..

I generally always agree with the gripes .. however, the bottom line is, er, bottom dollar Consumer rental cost .. if you want the full meal deal and don't have a real B&M in your area, then ::

https://www.store-3d-blurayrental.com/

RB and NF are not the culprits, nor are they the only source of content ..

That's only in part true.. since if RB etc flat out refused to carry X studios crap if they try to dictate such that in turn looses that studio $ and even more so if RB was smart and played politics instead.. ie: make it very well known that they are NOT carrying X studio's content due to that srudio trying to screw over the consumer and RB whom values their customers is choosing instead to tell their customers why they refuse to carry an inferior product which the studio would rather have the consumer remain ignorant of their dirty tricks.

Same in many ways as to those that made "region free" players and explicitly pointed out why it was in the consumers best interest since w/o that the studio would continue to have an artificial monopoly to gouge the consumer for more $ based strictly on where they lived and/or happened to wish to use their perfectly legal product. I remember explaining this to a group of "big wigs" at a meeting I was at yrs ago.. and to dumb it down so they could understand it I equated it to a car MFR being able to tell you what roads you can/cannot drive on.. and in local case for me I pointed said "How would you like it if your GM was crippled artificially by the MFR so you could only drive it on the 407 which was paying GM big $ to force ppl to use their highway only (toll road debacle of epic scale in stupidity screwing the tax payers over) despite their being other roads going to the exact same place that are free... and then GM etc was getting pissed at ppl like me that made it possible to drive the GM car where ever the owner wanted instead (Not a perfect comparison but they got the point)

The $ is what counts.. but while the one studio will ignore the odd consumer.. in #'s we have far more power than most ppl realize. I've even "poked the dragon" with a very sharp stick before by telling them flat out I refused to play their game.. so I downloaded a pirate copy of X movie instead of buying it due to the draconian garbage they tried to force on the consumer.. The look on the marketing mgr's face was priceless at being told such right there in person..

But even w/o going that far the avg person even taking the time to put a signature on a petition carries a ton of weight.. stats show that for each one of those few that would take that little bit of time is typically representative of between 10 and 100 others (it varies mostly depending on the subject in question and it's typically closer to 100 mark for consumers of movies etc that are as you know very lazy esp regarding defending themselves from the studios.).

A perfect example of this power being used for our advantage is the NetNeutrality fight and the backlash against the ahole ISPs like Verizon so desperately trying to gouge everyone to death.. and to be able to control everything we do online. (Also why the current NN fight is even more important to not allow the asshat in charge of the FCC right now get his way.. he's deep in bed with Verizon and others w/o any doubt).

But anyhow.. Rb if smart would instead listen to their customers and be proactive about protecting them from such crap pulled by the studios.. since many consumers would remain oblivious.. but it could easily be a huge win for RB in earning "they are the good guys to support" points which in turn earns them business and more importantly loyal; customers.. esp the minority such as we typically are.. and we in turn carry more weight than most think as well.. but only in #'s and if that is used right. That does take some effort and some balls as well per se... and some lunatics like myself to fight back (I've even taken on the Gov before in a diff but in some ways similar fight)

Don't play fair.. it's never fair.. play politics and play to win. That means make the "little fringe group" like us more representative of protecting the avg joe that does not understand it all but would in the end benefit from the actions of us few.

That in turn means making LG very well aware of us intentionally not only not supporting them when they do such crap but more importantly we are costing them far more by way of helping to educate the public in part and with that we help the avg person understand to not give LG their $.. give it instead to Y studio that values it's customers instead.

$ is what matters in the end to LG and to RB.. so playing politics is what is required and that means showing RB it's in their own best interest to not just be on our side but to actively help our side.. which in turn helps them succeed in making $ in the end. Pointing out their failure in Canada as well is an excellent point to illustrate what happens if they don't support us vs the LG's of the world.. (We are not a massive market here either of course but we are enough to make a noticeable impact none the less)
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post #1374 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post
I hope what you're saying holds true .. however, disk as a physical medium is still likely to continue it's decline and eventually end up a niche / boutique market ..

Because the bulk of Consumers don't care and value convenience over quality ..
it is.. and yes physical medium is a dying species for the most part as well.. however the same basic rules still apply.. in digital downloads etc we don't want crappier ow bit rate BS.. we don't want it on a "DRM" only platform which they still have not learned is doomed to failure. we do not want their snooping in our systems.. etc etc.. and if they want to survive they had best listen.. or else the looses in sales will be even bigger.

If they had a clue at all they would take the $$$ they continue to waste on DRM etc.. and put all of that into either lowering the price or providing a better product.

it does not matter how much they try DRM insanity it will always fail and will be pirated. The fact that the pirate version works better than the "legal" in so many ways really should be an object lesson in their shoot themselves in the foot. You cannot force the consumer to buy crap.. but you can make them want to buy something by making a better product and that means abandoning all of the "anti-piracy" stupidity.

It's as big a failure as the morons that continue to try to force gun control on everyone as a very good example/comparison.. it does NOT nor will it ever work.. and it does not do what they try to claim it does at all in the first place. The public is not buying their garbage as much as they used to..(thankfully) so it's time for them to do a reality check.

ie:

DRM has never stopped piracy yet nor was it actually designed to do so. It's goal is to keep control out of the consumers hands so the studios can gouge at will. The studios are scared of ppl being able to fight back and eliminate DRM etc and therefore they try desperately to use crap like the DMCA to criminalize breaking their DRM

Gun control has never stopped a bad guy yet from doing bad things. it's only about control of the public and a disarmed public is far easier to control.. so those "in power" can get away with doing more of what they want to w/o as many ppl being able to effectively fight back. (they are scared of ppl being able to fight back).., So they criminalize as much as they can the law abiding people's ability to have access to firearms. (Canuckistan is a good example of such a pathetic and broken garbage system)

The saddest part is when you look at the 2 "things" there.. most ppl won't see the link from movies etc to firearms.. but ultimately that link is simply control of ppl and $$$. They want both and try to screw us all to get more of it in both cases.


Now all of that said your statement "Because the bulk of Consumers don't care and value convenience over quality ." is 1000000% spot on. But that same bulk of ppl can be used by us to help by way of sheer #'s and that same bulk will understand easy to use vs harder to use.. show them a region locked DVD they can't play and the very simplest of education as to why + the pirate copy of the same movie that plays perfectly w/o any such issues and they will undoubtedly understand and want the easy to use version and are willing to pay for it as well. All they need to know is right now the legal copy is NOT easy to use in that context and the studios will make it worse every chance they get.
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post #1375 of 1375 Old 09-23-2017, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by cnelson87 View Post
Yeah, I've seen rentals that don't have extras, but I wasn't aware that they sometimes use a lower video bitrate. Ugh that sucks. Do we need a new thread to discuss which which Netflix and RedBox discs have nerfed video now?
Let's not jump to that conclusion this rental title has a lower bit rate ... it is only a 102 minute movie...most likely the rental just doesn't have all the extras is all...
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