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post #1 of 79 Old 01-14-2013, 09:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Yul's silvery contacts used to freak me out.

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post #2 of 79 Old 01-14-2013, 11:56 PM
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Nice. Not a bad price either. I see they have Futureworld listed as well.

http://www.amazon.com/Futureworld-Blu-ray-Peter-Fonda/dp/B00AJXO3S8/ref=pd_bxgy_mov_img_y

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post #3 of 79 Old 01-15-2013, 08:12 AM
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Nice.

I might have to get this. I went for the European version which came out first last year, but it seems to have lip sync issues. Hope this one doesn't.
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post #4 of 79 Old 02-27-2013, 11:19 AM
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lOOks (ha, ha!!/& sounds) like a winner:
http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Westworld-Blu-ray/43537/#Review
although no direct comparison too the R2 Blu version there are two pics of the R1 DVD under "screenshots" link in the review that shows where this release is coming from.

"I wonder if any of the releases had slipcovers though."
"Are these comfirmed to have slipcovers?"
"They look nice in those slips."
"This slipcover looks too good to pass up."
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post #5 of 79 Old 02-27-2013, 10:22 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG ED View Post

lOOks (ha, ha!!/& sounds) like a winner:
http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Westworld-Blu-ray/43537/#Review
although no direct comparison too the R2 Blu version there are two pics of the R1 DVD under "screenshots" link in the review that shows where this release is coming from.

This release looks just like the film looked. The End. If you want it to look like previous substandard video releases, go for it.
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post #6 of 79 Old 03-02-2013, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG ED View Post

lOOks (ha, ha!!/& sounds) like a winner:
http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Westworld-Blu-ray/43537/#Review
although no direct comparison too the R2 Blu version there are two pics of the R1 DVD under "screenshots" link in the review that shows where this release is coming from.
DVD Beaver has a comparison: http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film3/blu-ray_reviews56/westworld_blu-ray.htm

Obviously Beaver's grabs should be taken with the usual pound of salt, but if we assume that the pictures from each release is equally filtered, then the Aventi edition certainly has better detail. And I agree with Gary Tooze that the Warner edition looks stretched.
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post #7 of 79 Old 03-03-2013, 08:18 PM
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Dang!
I think the new Blu is stretched!!
Ugh.
I like the color of the French better too; except for the cap of the tourist knight.
Too me, the burning terminator, um, I mean robot seals it w/the flames lOOking much more natural on the import.

Butt, yeah, it's The Bev, worse HD caps site I know of...

"I wonder if any of the releases had slipcovers though."
"Are these comfirmed to have slipcovers?"
"They look nice in those slips."
"This slipcover looks too good to pass up."
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post #8 of 79 Old 03-13-2013, 09:55 AM
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You can go too caps-a-holic & stretch Yul's head back & forth for fun w/this new Blu,
I'll give you three guesses what color the gun & sky is on the pic of Yul's closeup on the US Blu...
butt you'll only need one!rolleyes.gif

On that cap I like the detail on the non-overblown DVD on Yul's hands...
sooooo sadd!!

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post #9 of 79 Old 03-13-2013, 11:13 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Steen DK View Post

DVD Beaver has a comparison: http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film3/blu-ray_reviews56/westworld_blu-ray.htm

Obviously Beaver's grabs should be taken with the usual pound of salt, but if we assume that the pictures from each release is equally filtered, then the Aventi edition certainly has better detail. And I agree with Gary Tooze that the Warner edition looks stretched.

No, it's the French that's stretched and the Beaver offers that as a possibility. The French is simply stretched up and down - if you've ever seen Richard Benjamin in any other film, it's really obvious. But when you put these caps together, which is one of the reasons these stupid caps comparisons are so odious, the eye plays tricks. And, of course, everyone is judging JUST caps not the transfer itself, which is just about a perfect representation of the film called Westworld. The French is sharpened and is off the same fading internegative as the previous US DVD release. Warners obviously went back to the negative and did this lovely new transfer and, as always, the people who do this harm of judging only screen caps (does anyone actually buy the discs?) take them to task. They simply cannot win. They deserve kudos and if you search any other board for this film, the people who've actually seen the disc all say they are VERY pleased with it, as they should be.
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post #10 of 79 Old 03-14-2013, 01:23 AM
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For the hell of it, I showed my wife the screenshot comparison. I didn't say anything other than one is the US version and the other was French. She said the French version looked stretched and the colors were better on the US.

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post #11 of 79 Old 03-14-2013, 04:37 AM
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Originally Posted by haineshisway View Post

No, it's the French that's stretched and the Beaver offers that as a possibility.
As did I. You'll notice that I wrote "it looks stretched" not "it is stretched".
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And, of course, everyone is judging JUST caps not the transfer itself, which is just about a perfect representation of the film called Westworld.
Yes, we should all just buy every blu-ray that comes out and if it turns out that it looks like crap and that people like you (who, for example, cannot tell what's wrong with tthe Zulu BD - which makes you slightly less than trustworthy) are wrong, well, that's just too bad. We'll really teach those studios not to release crap BDs by purchasing them all.

But I think it's nice that you have purchased both the Warner and the Aventi. I just don't have money to burn like that.
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post #12 of 79 Old 03-15-2013, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by haineshisway View Post

No, it's the French that's stretched and the Beaver offers that as a possibility. The French is simply stretched up and down - if you've ever seen Richard Benjamin in any other film, it's really obvious. But when you put these caps together, which is one of the reasons these stupid caps comparisons are so odious, the eye plays tricks. And, of course, everyone is judging JUST caps not the transfer itself, which is just about a perfect representation of the film called Westworld. The French is sharpened and is off the same fading internegative as the previous US DVD release. Warners obviously went back to the negative and did this lovely new transfer and, as always, the people who do this harm of judging only screen caps (does anyone actually buy the discs?) take them to task. They simply cannot win. They deserve kudos and if you search any other board for this film, the people who've actually seen the disc all say they are VERY pleased with it, as they should be.

FWIW, when the comparison between the Warner and Aventi discs was first posted, it was immediately obvious to me that it was the French transfer that had problematic geometry. I didn't post my opinion because I just don't have the energy anymore to have to justify what I find obvious to those that don't.

Obviously this new disc from Warner does not look like a film from last year, because it is not a film from last year. Westworld is not a title that will warrant a multi-million dollar restoration like a Ben-Hur or Wizard of Oz. Given the practical realities that a studio considers when making these decisions, this disc is a treat for fans of the film. Why this is lost on so many people who make value judgments based on the unreality of screen caps on computer monitors speaks to another current thread in this section of the forum.

The one about why this forum is less active than it once was.
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post #13 of 79 Old 03-15-2013, 02:28 PM
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I've see the US BD only but the screen caps from the beaver looks true to what I saw. Comparing this to the French version, the US looks stretched,contrast boosted ,filtered and less pleasing color wise (although I don't know what it was supposed to look like I bet one of my nuts the French is more accurate to the original film). I still enjoyed it but I'd rather have the French version now that i see this comparison.

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post #14 of 79 Old 03-15-2013, 02:36 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post

I've see the US BD only but the screen caps from the beaver looks true to what I saw. Comparing this to the French version, the US looks stretched,contrast boosted ,filtered and less pleasing color wise (although I don't know what it was supposed to look like I bet one of my nuts the French is more accurate to the original film). I still enjoyed it but I'd rather have the French version now that i see this comparison.

Art

Well, you couldn't be more wrong, Art. See the post above yours. It's just shocking and you'd be out one of your nuts. The French is taken from the same transfer as the last DVD of Westworld in the US - fading negative. It's stretched up and down. When, oh, when will you stop playing this silly screen caps game. You say you've seen the Warners Blu-ray? And? You only have a problem when you compare it to SCREEN CAPS of it and the French disc? If you can't see how wrong that is, no one here is going to be able to help you. The US is NOT stretched, there is not one iota of contrast boosting, filtering (do you even know what 70s movies look like???), and the color on the Warners is completely accurate. Save your nuts, Art. What's nuts is what you're doing. smile.gif
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post #15 of 79 Old 03-15-2013, 02:37 PM
 
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FWIW, when the comparison between the Warner and Aventi discs was first posted, it was immediately obvious to me that it was the French transfer that had problematic geometry. I didn't post my opinion because I just don't have the energy anymore to have to justify what I find obvious to those that don't.

Obviously this new disc from Warner does not look like a film from last year, because it is not a film from last year. Westworld is not a title that will warrant a multi-million dollar restoration like a Ben-Hur or Wizard of Oz. Given the practical realities that a studio considers when making these decisions, this disc is a treat for fans of the film. Why this is lost on so many people who make value judgments based on the unreality of screen caps on computer monitors speaks to another current thread in this section of the forum.

The one about why this forum is less active than it once was.

Well, we're alone in the wilderness with all these armchair experts who know everything based on screen caps. Happily, I don't live in that world smile.gif
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post #16 of 79 Old 03-15-2013, 02:58 PM
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That's all I said. There is no doubt that if the French cap is accurate to the French BD then I stand by what I said. The french has more detail throughout,looks more evenly graded as far as intrascene contrast and the flesh tones look less like the characters are painted in orange makeup. If the French cap is inaccurate to the French BD then as I said that is my reference. What part of the French caps is inaccurate to the French BD ?



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post #17 of 79 Old 03-15-2013, 05:24 PM
 
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That's all I said. There is no doubt that if the French cap is accurate to the French BD then I stand by what I said. The french has more detail throughout,looks more evenly graded as far as intrascene contrast and the flesh tones look less like the characters are painted in orange makeup. If the French cap is inaccurate to the French BD then as I said that is my reference. What part of the French caps is inaccurate to the French BD ?



Art

I don't do screen caps. I have both discs. The French is exactly what I said it was in terms of what it was transferred from. The Warners is a fresh new transfer. The French has most obviously been sharpened, hence why you are seeing supposed "detail" that doesn't exist. Did you or did you not watch your Warners Blu-ray and can you honestly sit there and say you thought it was problematic - because it's gotten just about unanimous praise from those who've actually seen it and not made pronouncements based on screen caps. The Warners has plenty of detail, save for the film's many opticals - obviously those are soft and always have been and always will be. The color is accurate on the Warners and not on the French. It doesn't really matter which you prefer - all that matters is what's correct.

So, did you actually watch the disc and, if so, why are you looking at screen caps - I can tell you that in motion the Warners disc looks only about 1000% better than the ill-taken screen caps at the DVD Beaver and elsewhere. This is, I'm afraid, a losing game and one that should stop.
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post #18 of 79 Old 03-16-2013, 06:12 AM
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I don't do screen caps. I have both discs. The French is exactly what I said it was in terms of what it was transferred from. The Warners is a fresh new transfer. The French has most obviously been sharpened, hence why you are seeing supposed "detail" that doesn't exist. Did you or did you not watch your Warners Blu-ray and can you honestly sit there and say you thought it was problematic - because it's gotten just about unanimous praise from those who've actually seen it and not made pronouncements based on screen caps. The Warners has plenty of detail, save for the film's many opticals - obviously those are soft and always have been and always will be. The color is accurate on the Warners and not on the French. It doesn't really matter which you prefer - all that matters is what's correct.

So, did you actually watch the disc and, if so, why are you looking at screen caps - I can tell you that in motion the Warners disc looks only about 1000% better than the ill-taken screen caps at the DVD Beaver and elsewhere. This is, I'm afraid, a losing game and one that should stop.

I guess you have a problem reading posts before you respond.biggrin.gif Did you see the film recently ? I stand by what I said.

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post #19 of 79 Old 03-16-2013, 10:02 AM
 
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I guess you have a problem reading posts before you respond.biggrin.gif Did you see the film recently ? I stand by what I said.

Art

Of course you do. So, you've seen the disc, but not the French disc. But what you saw doesn't matter, it's only the caps that tell you true. I get it. And I stand by what I said. And there are many more of us, I'm afraid, people who know this film and know what it should look like. Thank heaven for that smile.gif So, we'll enjoy the excellent job that Warners did on this Blu-ray, and you can think whatever you like.
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post #20 of 79 Old 03-16-2013, 10:54 AM
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Of course you do. So, you've seen the disc, but not the French disc. But what you saw doesn't matter, it's only the caps that tell you true. I get it. And I stand by what I said. And there are many more of us, I'm afraid, people who know this film and know what it should look like. Thank heaven for that smile.gif So, we'll enjoy the excellent job that Warners did on this Blu-ray, and you can think whatever you like.

Do you just read the first few words of my postsd then respond ? Thanks for allowing me my thoughts.rolleyes.gif

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post #21 of 79 Old 03-18-2013, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by BIG ED View Post

You can go too caps-a-holic & stretch Yul's head back & forth for fun w/this new Blu,
I'll give you three guesses what color the gun & sky is on the pic of Yul's closeup on the US Blu...
butt you'll only need one!rolleyes.gif

On that cap I like the detail on the non-overblown DVD on Yul's hands...
sooooo sadd!!
Got it!
Thanks Amazon.
So, the "circles (starting w/the MGM logo), o's, zero's, barrels, buttons, whatever are ROUND on this release!
So, maybe instead of this Blu being stretched the old DVD was an anamorphic squeeze job!!
Don't you just luv the Internet!!!

The BIG thing for me was the sound, great stereo separation w/the score; really sounds like they spent some $$$ on this back-in-the-day.
And as well as the film holds up for me [totally understand if it doesn't for others] the funky sound effects do as well (IMO).

The scene w/the closeup w/Yul & the gun does have some weird blu on the rifle, however not the sky as much as the cap mentionED above.
The detail isn't blown out anywhere near as badd playing this Blu comparED too the cap either.

Not perfect, yet certainly not the grave "Modern Video Revisionism" we've been subjected too w/previous Blu catalog titles.
I say if your a fan get it.
If not a fan, it's no 'must buy for demo quality disc' for sure!!!! tongue.gif

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post #22 of 79 Old 03-18-2013, 09:10 PM
 
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Originally Posted by BIG ED View Post

Got it!
Thanks Amazon.
So, the "circles (starting w/the MGM logo), o's, zero's, barrels, buttons, whatever are ROUND on this release!
So, maybe instead of this Blu being stretched the old DVD was an anamorphic squeeze job!!
Don't you just luv the Internet!!!

The BIG thing for me was the sound, great stereo separation w/the score; really sounds like they spent some $$$ on this back-in-the-day.
And as well as the film holds up for me [totally understand if it doesn't for others] the funky sound effects do as well (IMO).

The scene w/the closeup w/Yul & the gun does have some weird blu on the rifle, however not the sky as much as the cap mentionED above.
The detail isn't blown out anywhere near as badd playing this Blu comparED too the cap either.

Not perfect, yet certainly not the grave "Modern Video Revisionism" we've been subjected too w/previous Blu catalog titles.
I say if your a fan get it.
If not a fan, it's no 'must buy for demo quality disc' for sure!!!! tongue.gif

Yes, as has been repeated everywhere ad nauseum, the DVD was stretched up and down as was the French Blu-ray, which used the old DVD transfer. The Blu-ray gets everything right, and at least you admit that the caps are completely off and therefore ridiculous. That doesn't stop the game, sadly.
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post #23 of 79 Old 03-20-2013, 03:10 AM
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Incidentally, here's a bit of a lecture for those of you who thinks it is possible to do a screen capture from a blu-ray disc:

The reason it can't be done is much the same that you can't pause an LP record and get a sound. When the record is paused, the pick-up is not moving across the surface and therefore you get nothing but silence. In much the same way, when you pause a BD, there is no image. The image that you DO see on your TV or projector screen is actually a kind of afterglow stored in the TV and has no real resemblance to the moving image that is stored on the disc.

Here ends the lesson. smile.gif
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post #24 of 79 Old 03-20-2013, 06:23 AM
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But the disc does spin in pause unlike an LP displaying a single frame over and over.
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post #25 of 79 Old 03-21-2013, 06:07 AM
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Pfff! But clearly that single frame has no relationship to the actual MOVING images. The detail, colours, and contrast are completely different. As anyone who has ever paused a BD can testify. smile.gif
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post #26 of 79 Old 03-21-2013, 10:37 AM
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No relationship? That frame is not part of the moving picture at all? Then where does that frame come from if it has no relationship whatsoever to the moving picture?
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post #27 of 79 Old 03-21-2013, 11:40 AM
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Excellent, Straw-man rides in again with nothing to corroborate his absolute truths other than "I say so" with the assistance of his noble steed 'False-Equivalence', saddled with fallacious logic.

http://caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergleiche/comparison.php?cap1=20113&cap2=20121&art=full&image=6&cID=1578&action=1&lossless=#vergleich

Yup, visual information of the highlights found in the old DVD transfer, and I assume the French does as well, miraculously lost in the new 'correct to the 70s look. -With no proof in the affirmative or negative.

Now the geometry differences could be simply different optics used for the transfer and could fall into the non-issue category.

Aside note. Finally saw AGAIG and yes the screen caps are accurate to what is on the disc, overall decent transfer with portions of gaudy contrast tweaks resulting in clipping and over-saturated colors. And yes the clouds are gone on the BR.

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post #28 of 79 Old 03-21-2013, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steen DK View Post

Incidentally, here's a bit of a lecture for those of you who thinks it is possible to do a screen capture from a blu-ray disc:

The reason it can't be done is much the same that you can't pause an LP record and get a sound. When the record is paused, the pick-up is not moving across the surface and therefore you get nothing but silence. In much the same way, when you pause a BD, there is no image. The image that you DO see on your TV or projector screen is actually a kind of afterglow stored in the TV and has no real resemblance to the moving image that is stored on the disc.

Here ends the lesson. smile.gif

Wow. That's probably the most bizarre, technically uninformed thing I've ever read on this forum.
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post #29 of 79 Old 03-21-2013, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by KMFDMvsEnya View Post

http://caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergleiche/comparison.php?cap1=20113&cap2=20121&art=full&image=6&cID=1578&action=1&lossless=#vergleich

Yup, visual information of the highlights found in the old DVD transfer, and I assume the French does as well, miraculously lost in the new 'correct to the 70s look. -With no proof in the affirmative or negative.
That visual information exists does not necessarily mean that not being able to see it is a transfer issue. Camera negatives record more dynamic range than prints can reproduce (a pretty fundamental feature of the Eastman color negative process and other negative->positive processes, since it make the life of cinematographers a heck of a lot easier).

Personally I think this WB Westworld disc looks pretty nice. I'm iffy on the skin tones and it isn't terribly visually consistent, but it's a pleasing transfer otherwise.
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post #30 of 79 Old 03-21-2013, 03:37 PM
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Then from which generation print would the DVD master have been struck from for it retain the highlights whereas the new Warner one now does not?

Even though I do not think the DVD used by CAH is accurate for color and contrast it is interesting the differences and why does the new HD transfer look differently.

There are certain aspects to the changes that appear to me more modern digital tweaks than necessarily replicating the original intended look. I have nothing to corroborate that but that is the impression I am left with.

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