The Wizard of Oz 3D - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 41 Old 05-07-2013, 01:36 PM - Thread Starter
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From HighDefDigest....

The classic 1939 musical starring Judy Garland will be getting a double dip in 2013.

In an early announcement to retailers, 'The Wizard of Oz: 75th Anniversary Edition' appears to be coming to Blu-ray in the near future, along with 'The Wizard of Oz - 3D: 75th Anniversary Edition' and 'The Wizard of Oz - 3D: 75th Anniversary Collector's Edition (Amazon Exclusive).'


Specs have yet to be revealed, but the releases are expected to include hours of extra content including: Sing-a-long feature with the film; Complete Magic Cloak of Oz silent shorts (60 min); All-new making-of Documentary; The Dreamer of Oz TV Special (101 min); Munchkins at the Hollywood Walk of Fame Featurette (20 min); Patchwork Girl of Oz (60 min); and a 6 hr. MGM Documentary When the Lion Roars (exclusive to Blu-Ray).

The Blu-ray 3D Collector's Edition will also include a 48 pg Hardcover Photo Book; Ruby Slippers Sparkle Globe; Collectible Award Pin Set by The Noble Collection; Journal; Frameable Map of Oz; and 4 GB "Wicked Witch of the East" flash drive (Amazon exclusive).

Suggested list price for the Blu-ray is set at $19.98, the Blu-ray 3D is $35.99, and the Amazon Exclusive Blu-ray 3D Collector's Edition is $105.43.
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post #2 of 41 Old 05-07-2013, 02:07 PM
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I placed my order for a regular 3D copy. Not going for the $100+ set.


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: The theatrical versions are the definitive versions.
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post #3 of 41 Old 05-10-2013, 07:23 AM
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Will the 2D transfer be the same as the 70th anniversary disc? Not sure how much better it can get.
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post #4 of 41 Old 05-10-2013, 08:40 AM
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I can't see how Judy Garland would be any cuter in 3D, or Margaret Mitchell any greener, as versus the 70th Anniversary 2D release. And even I can't justify springing for that Wicked Witch of the East flashdrive...

...and I need your sweet love, Latina T-Mobile girl!

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post #5 of 41 Old 05-10-2013, 09:53 AM
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Somewhat pricey, either version. Can only hope that the transfer into 3D is a lot better than Dial M for Murder 3D BR, which must be the king of ghosting and should never have been released in the 3D format. Until there are actual reviews of the 3D version, I will wait. I would be more prone to wait a couple of years and wait for the price to drop dramatically. It is not likely to be the equivalent of Titanic 3D BR.
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post #6 of 41 Old 05-10-2013, 12:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fookoo_2010 View Post

Somewhat pricey, either version.

As the release date gets closer, the price will drop. As for the quality of the conversion, they have been working on it for quite some time so I hope for the best. We will see.

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post #7 of 41 Old 05-10-2013, 06:00 PM
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"or Margaret Mitchell any greener"

Margaret Mitchell? The author of Gone With the Wind wasn't green as far as I know...
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post #8 of 41 Old 05-11-2013, 12:18 PM
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You *do* realize that 'Dial 'M' for Murder' was originally filmed and released in 3D, don't you?

A conversion of a classic film and finally releasing a 3D film in a non-anaglyph version are two VERY different things!
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post #9 of 41 Old 05-11-2013, 12:38 PM
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That, and ghosting doesn't exist in the source (I think it's actually impossible to encode it that way), it's always in the display.

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post #10 of 41 Old 05-11-2013, 02:09 PM
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DIAL M FOR MURDER has zero ghosting (like all 3D Blu-rays). Only the display causes ghosting. The reason ghosting may be more evident between films is due to the level of stereoscopicity in the original photography. Films with more depth and "pop-out" will have more ghosting on poor displays. To avoid ghosting, use DLP or a good LCD screen. Passive is preferred, though active should be fine with such displays. The worst way to watch 3D seems to be active plasma displays. DIAL M does indeed look horrendous this way, but it's the TVs fault, not the disc.
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post #11 of 41 Old 05-11-2013, 06:47 PM
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Then why don't The Creature from the Black Lagoon 3D, Avatar 3D, The Hubble 3D, Judge Dredd 3D, Titanic 3D, Top Gun 3D, The Life of Pi 3D, and Prometheus 3D look awful on a plasma?
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post #12 of 41 Old 05-11-2013, 07:58 PM
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You're making as assumption, without knowing how 3D discs are encoded. It is quite impossible for the ghosting to be "on the disc". Literally... it cannot be done. No matter how much you want to say that it's part of the encode, it simply cannot be. Period. The end. It's not the disc.

Now, one thing that does cause ghosting are high-contrast scenes.. bright highlights against a dark background. I'm going out on a limb and saying that these are the scenes you're referring to, rather than the entire film? Something a lot of those other films, except maybe Dredd, don't have a lot of.

And really, give up with the colored text.. I don't see the need to decode what you're saying, we can all read just fine, and we know how to differentiate a film's title, thanks.

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post #13 of 41 Old 05-11-2013, 11:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fookoo_2010 View Post

Then why don't The Creature from the Black Lagoon 3D, Avatar 3D, The Hubble 3D, Judge Dredd 3D, Titanic 3D, Top Gun 3D, The Life of Pi 3D, and Prometheus 3D look awful on a plasma?

Two reasons, one of which I already addressed in my post. The level of depth and "pop out" of the 3D will create greater ghosting if your display is prone to it. DIAL M has some mega stereoscopic moments, certainly more so than most modern films, which are weak ass in comparison to what people got in the 50s (and even in the 80s). The only modern 3D film I've seen that has 3D "moments" that are as impressive as stuff in CREATURE and DIAL M, is HUGO. This also ghosts like hell on my active plasma display.

The second reason probably has a lot to do with WarnerColor. For information regarding it see this review:

http://www.3dfilmarchive.com/dial-m-blu-ray-review

Specifically the section "RESTORING HITCHCOCK’S STEREOSCOPIC VISION" about half way down.
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post #14 of 41 Old 05-12-2013, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieLarkin View Post

Two reasons, one of which I already addressed in my post. The level of depth and "pop out" of the 3D will create greater ghosting if your display is prone to it. DIAL M has some mega stereoscopic moments, certainly more so than most modern films, which are weak ass in comparison to what people got in the 50s (and even in the 80s). The only modern 3D film I've seen that has 3D "moments" that are as impressive as stuff in CREATURE and DIAL M, is HUGO. This also ghosts like hell on my active plasma display.

The second reason probably has a lot to do with WarnerColor. For information regarding it see this review:

http://www.3dfilmarchive.com/dial-m-blu-ray-review

Specifically the section "RESTORING HITCHCOCK’S STEREOSCOPIC VISION" about half way down.

Thanks for the link.
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post #15 of 41 Old 06-05-2013, 11:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Amazon now shows a Release Date of Oct 01.
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post #16 of 41 Old 09-19-2013, 09:16 AM
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Theatrical release will be Sept 20th, tomorrow. Here is an article from Variety.
http://variety.com/2013/digital/news/the-wizard-of-oz-imax-3d-conversion-1200610859/
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post #17 of 41 Old 09-19-2013, 11:12 AM
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I may be in the minority, maybe even a big stick in the mud, but I've never watched Wizard of Oz and thought, "this would be better in 3-D". It will be interesting to see what comes of it.
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post #18 of 41 Old 09-20-2013, 09:26 AM
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I'm assuming this is made from the same restoration they did for the 70th anniversary release? Or was the picture improved since that release?
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post #19 of 41 Old 09-20-2013, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WebEffect View Post

I'm assuming this is made from the same restoration they did for the 70th anniversary release? Or was the picture improved since that release?

The article makes it sound like it's a brand new transfer, but it's the same transfer and restoration they did for the Blu-ray release. The added step here, if I understand correctly, is IMAX DMR for grain removal and 3-D conversion.
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post #20 of 41 Old 09-20-2013, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by nathanddrews View Post

The article makes it sound like it's a brand new transfer, but it's the same transfer and restoration they did for the Blu-ray release. The added step here, if I understand correctly, is IMAX DMR for grain removal and 3-D conversion.

For the 70th anniversary restoration, was the film scanned in 4k, 6k or 8k?
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post #21 of 41 Old 09-20-2013, 08:28 PM
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I just got back from seeing it in IMAX. The biggest advantage I saw with the 3D is that it gives depth to the backdrops. It no longer looks like everyone is dancing towards a wall with paint on it.

I believe that the scan for the 3D version was in 8K, the 70th anniversary edition was a 4K scan. No word yet on if the 2D version is any different from the 70th anniversary Blu-Ray.
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post #22 of 41 Old 09-20-2013, 09:51 PM
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I also just saw it in IMAX 3D. I came away thinking that because of the size of the IMAX screen and most likely because it is a 2K projection, it just blew up the details and didn't look nearly as good as the existing BR on one of today's high definition 2K displays that is dramatically smaller than any IMAX screen. So, for the moment, it is questionable whether or not it is worth it to buy the upcoming 3D BR. One can only hope that the upcoming BR release is different from the previous one. If not, it is a clear pass because the 3D isn't all that impressive.
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post #23 of 41 Old 09-21-2013, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by WayneJoy View Post

I believe that the scan for the 3D version was in 8K, the 70th anniversary edition was a 4K scan. No word yet on if the 2D version is any different from the 70th anniversary Blu-Ray.

Robert Harris claims that the 2D version is the same as the original Blu-ray. The new 8k scan was only used for the 3D version.

Edit: I've re-read Harris' comments, and I may have misread them before. Now I'm not sure whether the 2D disc is identical to the old Blu-ray or comes from a new scan.

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post #24 of 41 Old 09-21-2013, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by EddieLarkin View Post

DIAL M FOR MURDER has zero ghosting (like all 3D Blu-rays). Only the display causes ghosting. The reason ghosting may be more evident between films is due to the level of stereoscopicity in the original photography. Films with more depth and "pop-out" will have more ghosting on poor displays. To avoid ghosting, use DLP or a good LCD screen. Passive is preferred, though active should be fine with such displays. The worst way to watch 3D seems to be active plasma displays. DIAL M does indeed look horrendous this way, but it's the TVs fault, not the disc.


You are very correct in saying the movie itself has no ghosting. It's all about the technology that presents the media. There's a video player that has two screen (one for each eye) that has zero ghosting. I'd love to try or have one of those, but never actually got around to looking into it.


ANYWAY;

Alfred Hitchcock was not a fan of 3-D. In fact, he had trouble seeing 3-D. When making the movie "Dial M For Murder," he purposely made sure the optical distance between the two lens were closer together than (normal) creating a 3-D movie that limited the depth somewhat. I have read there was only one shot where the 3-D is really pronounced. At the same time, "Dial M For Murder" received great reviews for how well the 3-D was handled (and for not being gimmicky.)

The point is, "Dial M For Murder" has depth, though not so much exaggeration so anything seemed stretched, exaggerated or hard to watch. It seems to me, any display should not have too much of a hard time with "Dial M For Murder" even plasma, unless the contrast is set way too high.

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post #25 of 41 Old 09-21-2013, 03:45 PM
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I feel there still is a lot of work to do to digitally to clean the original print. So I hope when they did the 8k scan (or what ever they recently did for the IMAX release,) they really took care to touch up any and all blemishes.

As far as combining the images of the three negatives together, I feel they perfected that on the last restoration.

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post #26 of 41 Old 09-23-2013, 03:56 AM
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The IMAX DMR process took the existing 4K remaster (8K scan, 4K DI) by WB and 3D conversion done by Prime Focus and then used their temporal resolution method to maintain details after scrubbing the grain away. Since grain varies from frame to frame, they sample several frames and interpolate a single frame at a "higher resolution" . This allows them to, they claim, eliminate grain and other noise without sacrificing detail. Anyone who has ever played with upscaling software on a computer knows how this works (and that IMAX did not invent the process).
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post #27 of 41 Old 10-01-2013, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Robert Harris claims that the 2D version is the same as the original Blu-ray. The new 8k scan was only used for the 3D version.

Edit: I've re-read Harris' comments, and I may have misread them before. Now I'm not sure whether the 2D disc is identical to the old Blu-ray or comes from a new scan.

Reviews I have read have stated that it is a new scan/restoration for both 3D and 2D as they claim specific problems - little stuff here and there - were fixed in the new release, which I can believe though I certainly think it needs to be clarified by someone at WB as to what exactly is being sold here given that the previous BD release is still widely available.
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post #28 of 41 Old 10-02-2013, 08:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LexInVA View Post

Reviews I have read have stated that it is a new scan/restoration for both 3D and 2D as they claim specific problems - little stuff here and there - were fixed in the new release, which I can believe though I certainly think it needs to be clarified by someone at WB as to what exactly is being sold here given that the previous BD release is still widely available.

Conversely, I've read in other forums that the little fixes are only present in the 3D transfer but not the new 2D disc.

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post #29 of 41 Old 10-02-2013, 10:20 AM
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I'm sure I'll be in the minority on this but I watched the 3D Blu-ray yesterday with high expectations and was not impressed. There seemed to be several scenes that had a focus problem such as when Dorothy first comes out of her house (after landing on the witch) and the image changes to color and several other scenes throughout the movie. Noticed more on scenes where a there is a large group of characters in the frame. Maybe just me but I thought it would be better.
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post #30 of 41 Old 10-03-2013, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by terry2 View Post

I'm sure I'll be in the minority on this but I watched the 3D Blu-ray yesterday with high expectations and was not impressed.

I wasn't all that impressed with the 3D version, either, but I might watch it again in a few weeks to see if my opinion has changed.

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