Pacific Rim 2D and 3D Blu-ray Comments - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 24 Old 10-08-2013, 12:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Watched the 2D Blu-ray last night and later skimmed through the 3D br.

I originally saw it during it's theatrical release in IMAX 3D and visually, the movie is extremely impressive. The Blu-ray transfer perfectly replicates the beautiful, saturated colors and the intricate details of the production design are a feast for the eye. Probably one of the overall best looking Blu-ray releases I've seen in some time. The 3D disc on my Panny 65VT50 looks amazing - one of the best 3D Blu-rays I've yet seen.

The audio is powerful and fully exploits either the 5.1 or 7.1 DTS-MA surround soundtrack choices, but has a bit of a muddy low end, imo. It actually was a bit of a fatiguing listen by about 2/3rds through.

The extras are pretty much wrapped into a multi-chaptered, approx 10 minute per featurette "Focus Points" which can be played individually or as a whole 1 1/2 hour program program. The 4 deleted scenes run a total of less than 5 minutes.

The movie itself is a mixed bag. As put forth by Del Toro, it's supposed to be a homage to old school Japanese giant monster/mecha films and at times wildly succeeds. However, the overall plot (it seems more like part 3 of a trilogy), some rather dumb situations and predictable, flat one-dimensional lead characters significantly impact the film.

My two biggest beefs with this film is the fact all the major monster vs mecha fights are staged in rainy, night time settings or underwater shrouded in the dark. For the centerpiece battle in Hong Kong surrounded by the primary neon colors of the city, it mostly works but else ware, it's frustrating to watch.

The other and imo, biggest problem with this film is the lazy, forgettable music score. Something that many fans don't realize that's a key part of the classic Japanese giant monster films, especially from the 50's through the early 70's was the often epic and exotic soundtrack scores, best exemplified by the work of Toho Studio's Akira Ifukube in films like "Godzilla," "Mothra vs Godzilla" and "Atragon." Pacific Rim's music is mostly anonymous sounding techno hard rock with almost no memorable themes (there's one 2-note bit heard during the beginning of the pre-credits battle that comes and goes never to be heard again).

For comparison, the last big gasp of the giant monster "Kaiju" genre, 1990's Japanese Gamera film trilogy, especially the last film "Gamera 3 Awakening of Irys" produced at a tiny fraction of Pacific Rim's gigantic budget pushed and expanded the boundaries of this kind of film in intelligent and exciting ways that Pacific Rim unfortunately fails to do.

Still, for it's flaws, Pacific Rim *is* an entertaining and technically beautiful film presented on Blu-ray and well worth checking out. And perhaps best of all, there's none of the obnoxious, smug humor and already dated quick cut shakey-cam photography that makes any of the Transformer's movies so difficult to stomach.
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post #2 of 24 Old 10-08-2013, 02:28 PM
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Thankfully, Warner is giving us the option of buying just the 2D version if we are so inclined. The 3D version was a post-conversion option that was imposed upon del Toro and he wasn't exactly happy about it. The movie wasn't shot with 3D in mind, and as a result some of scenes don't compose well when the artificial depth is applied.

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post #3 of 24 Old 10-08-2013, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by KingLeerUK View Post

Thankfully, Warner is giving us the option of buying just the 2D version if we are so inclined. The 3D version was a post-conversion option that was imposed upon del Toro and he wasn't exactly happy about it. The movie wasn't shot with 3D in mind, and as a result some of scenes don't compose well when the artificial depth is applied.

He agreed to the 3D conversion if they would give him more of a budget. He ultimately said he changed his mind about the conversion process when he realized it wouldn't change the scope of his film.

Many have speculated that del Toro was pushed into releasing the film in the 3D format. But now, speaking with Shock Til You Drop, the director explains how certain factors made him change his mind concerning 3D.
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"What happened was, in the weeks and months following Comic-Con, what I asked from the studio was to agree to four points that I wanted to do," he says. "The more the ILM shots arrived, the more I realized that there were only a few shots that would miniaturize. I asked the studio, number one, that we would not hyper-stereo-lize the thing. That we would not force 3D on the beauty shots. That we would keep the giant dimensions. They agreed. Number two, they agreed to something very unusual. Normally a conversion takes a few weeks. I asked to start it immediately so we could take the full 40 weeks to do the conversion. As an example, 'Titanic' took about 50 weeks to convert. The final thing that I asked that they agreed to, which was amazing, was that I asked them to give me an extra budget, which is considerable, to actually have ILM composite the shots that are CG native 3D. We're not giving elements. ILM is giving the composite in 3D from the get-go. That's a huge, huge element. Now I'm going to be involved in supervising it. What can I tell you? I changed my mind.
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post #4 of 24 Old 10-08-2013, 09:31 PM
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The Blu-ray is truly breathtaking in my opinion. One of the best I've ever seen. It and Oblivion are my new favorite reference films for video quality.

Man I'm a fan of these 4K cameras! I believe this one was shot with the Red cameras and Oblivion was shot with the Sony F65 4K camera.

Thanks!
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post #5 of 24 Old 10-08-2013, 09:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Gamereviewgod View Post

Agree with everything you said, except this. The score is simply outstanding. It's distinctly American, more video game/Halo than anything, but has themes for both Jaeger and kaiju. They're outstanding. It works differently than Ifukube because it's such a different film. They can't be compared.

This is hardly anonymous, but filled with outstanding build-up and orchestration which fits scale, mood, and intensity: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DABGdvCOs4

I read your review and agree %100 about the (two) scientist characters, especially Day's character. Like nails on chalkboard.

I gotta hold my ground regarding my opinion about the score and chalk it up to different personal tastes. To expand my comment about that, probably the closest to a "modern" score in a "kaiju" movie that I like is the mostly electronic score for 2001's "Godzilla GMK All Monsters Attack." Otherwise, I have to concede I'm pretty much an old school kinda guy regarding my giant monster flick soundtracks.

I think you'll be very impressed with the 3D Blu-ray.
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post #6 of 24 Old 10-08-2013, 11:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post

I read your review and agree %100 about the (two) scientist characters, especially Day's character. Like nails on chalkboard.

I gotta hold my ground regarding my opinion about the score and chalk it up to different personal tastes. To expand my comment about that, probably the closest to a "modern" score in a "kaiju" movie that I like is the mostly electronic score for 2001's "Godzilla GMK All Monsters Attack." Otherwise, I have to concede I'm pretty much an old school kinda guy regarding my giant monster flick soundtracks.

I think you'll be very impressed with the 3D Blu-ray.

I'm certainly old school too. I couldn't take Godzilla Final Wars for example. I just couldn't. It was loud, abrasive, and had no grounding. When I think modern, that's what comes to mind.

GMK was great, especially the more somber piano stuff. Pacific Rim HAS those elements though, even a guttural four note horn cue for most of the kaiju. I would have adored some Ifukube references, but that's something Del Toro wanted to avoid explicitly.

BTW, for those interested in a brief introduction, Del Toro's commentary runs through the original Godzilla's creation, events leading up to it, and the style, plus all the key players you need to know. Nice mainstream intro to the genre.
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post #7 of 24 Old 10-15-2013, 11:55 PM
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I bought the 3D "Pacific Rim" Blu-Ray... The 2D disc plays perfectly fine. But when I play the 3D disc, I am constantly getting audio dropouts every several seconds. Here's the weird part, I get the dropouts no matter which audio track I select, English DTS HD Master 5.1, 7.1, Portuguese, Spanish, Thai, etc. Some of the sound tracks are just plain DD 5.1 and I still get the dropouts. I never had this happen before.

I am using a Sony BDP-S5100 and it is hooked up to my Panasonic plasma set...

Any ideas?

If it's not a BIG screen, it's not a theater...
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post #8 of 24 Old 10-15-2013, 11:58 PM
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Check your player for any relevant updates needed maybe? Return the disc as defective otherwise....

"I realize that somebody playing free music isn't as commercial as a hamburger stand. But is it because you can eat a hamburger and hold it in your hand and you can't do that with music? Is it too free to control?" - Don Van Vliet (aka Captain Beefheart) discussing commercial success in the music biz


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post #9 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 07:39 AM
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Watched the 3D version last night and it was fantastic with great depth throughout most of the film. More proof that 3D conversions have come a long way since Clash of the Titans! The image is bright with eye-popping colors - probably one of the best looking 3D discs in my collection.
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post #10 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 08:00 AM
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*I assume your AV receiver is 3D compliant/compatible?

I believe 3D requires higher bandwidth, which means you better have good HDMI cables to and from your AV receiver.
The length of the HDMI cables may come in to play.

Also, turn off BD Live and unplug your Ethernet cable or turn off the player WiFi if applicable.
This sometimes causes issues as the player communicates with the mothership online.

2014
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post #11 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 09:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post

My two biggest beefs with this film is the fact all the major monster vs mecha fights are staged in rainy, night time settings or underwater shrouded in the dark. For the centerpiece battle in Hong Kong surrounded by the primary neon colors of the city, it mostly works but else ware, it's frustrating to watch.

I heard that the 3D is brighter than the 2D, perhaps to compensate for the loss of brightness with a 3D display.

Do you think that watching the 3D version as 2D might make the darker scenes less frustrating?

I have always thought that 3D discs should always give the customer the option to watch as 3D or 2D.
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post #12 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 09:10 AM
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I think people have experienced dropouts in the past when bitstreaming titles when the studio authors the disc as a number of fragments: moving from fragment to fragment does not always seem seamless. It is quite possible the 3D has been authored as a number of fragments, perhaps in an attempt to make life difficult for the rippers.

A fix that sometimes works for these dropouts is to decode the audio to multichannel LPCM in the player, instead of bitstreaming. Generally this does not result in quality loss: you are simply moving the decode point from the receiver to the player.
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post #13 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 09:33 AM
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Watched and really enjoyed the 2d version last night (3d version is up next!). Excellent PQ and POWERFUL audio track. This thing is LOADED with LFE/bass which I did not find muddy at all like the OP. Just a FUN HT ride all around! cool.gif

JVC 3D: Been there, done that, bought a DLP
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post #14 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 10:08 AM
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Merged into discussion thread.

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post #15 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon S View Post

I bought the 3D "Pacific Rim" Blu-Ray... The 2D disc plays perfectly fine. But when I play the 3D disc, I am constantly getting audio dropouts every several seconds. Here's the weird part, I get the dropouts no matter which audio track I select, English DTS HD Master 5.1, 7.1, Portuguese, Spanish, Thai, etc. Some of the sound tracks are just plain DD 5.1 and I still get the dropouts. I never had this happen before.

I am using a Sony BDP-S5100 and it is hooked up to my Panasonic plasma set...

Any ideas?

Figured out the problem... It's a Darbee video processor I have in line with the player... If I take it out of the loop, the audio is fine... It's the first time this has happened...

If it's not a BIG screen, it's not a theater...
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post #16 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by JayF View Post

Watched the 3D version last night and it was fantastic with great depth throughout most of the film. More proof that 3D conversions have come a long way since Clash of the Titans!

While the live action photography in the movie was converted from 2D, all of the CGI was natively rendered in 3D by ILM. Guillermo del Toro initially resisted 3D for the movie, but acquiesced to the studio's wishes on the condition that all CGI be native 3D.

It's really not fair to compare this to other movies that are 100% converted from 2D. Other recent 3D conversions such as G.I. Joe: Retaliation and Star Trek into Darkness, while far better than the Clash of the Titans fiasco, have still been pretty underwhelming, IMO. I haven't watched Iron Man 3 yet, but have heard a lot of complaints about that one too.

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post #17 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon S View Post

Figured out the problem... It's a Darbee video processor I have in line with the player... If I take it out of the loop, the audio is fine... It's the first time this has happened...
Your Darbee should be AFTER your AV Receiver so it only gets the picture.
Also make sure your AV receiver does not send sound out of its HDMI OUTPUT to the projector/Darbee.

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post #18 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 42Plasmaman View Post

Your Darbee should be AFTER your AV Receiver so it only gets the picture.
Also make sure your AV receiver does not send sound out of its HDMI OUTPUT to the projector/Darbee.

I do not have a AVR in the loop... The Sony player connects to the Darbee and the Darbee is conencted to the Panasonic display....

If it's not a BIG screen, it's not a theater...
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post #19 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 04:39 PM
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The movie is certainly visually impressive, and the 3D is top notch (I watched this on an Epson 5010 projector). Great sense of the proportions too. I would not call it a conversion though, since probably 90% of the movie is CGI and apparently they rendered the graphics in stereo from the start. However, I have to say the movie itself was a bit of a yawn for me. At about the third robot-vs-monster fight I started having trouble staying focused on the movie. It's basically one long beat 'm up with some superficial drama and silly comedy moments thrown in. I guess I was expecting a bit more.
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post #20 of 24 Old 10-16-2013, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Rigby Reardon View Post

It's basically one long beat 'm up with some superficial drama and silly comedy moments thrown in. I guess I was expecting a bit more.
That's pretty much exactly what I expected, based on reviews from other people, and that's exactly what I got. I'm okay with that. smile.gif
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post #21 of 24 Old 10-17-2013, 05:04 AM
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This movie had me by the balls as soon as GlaDOS showed up in early trailers. Del Toro and his daughter were huge Portal fans and asked Valve for the rights to use her. When it comes to giant mecha-monster mashups, I'm pretty easy to please anyway. Now if only we could get a solid film adaptation of "The Big O"...
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post #22 of 24 Old 10-20-2013, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon S View Post

I do not have a AVR in the loop... The Sony player connects to the Darbee and the Darbee is conencted to the Panasonic display....
Panasonic BDT-210 Blu-ray 3D player --->Pioneer AVR --> Darbee -->Epson 5010
No PQ or AQ issues.

PQ/AQ were both great.
I think if you liked the first Iron Man and Transformers, you would enjoy this movie.

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post #23 of 24 Old 11-15-2013, 08:16 PM
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In reference to Jon S., I had a similar problem with the audio on the 3D disc as well, though maybe not as severe. I was watching it with the 7.1 soundtrack, and around the 1 hour and 7 minutes mark, I lost all audio for about two seconds. This has never happened with any other title I own, whether 3D or 2D, and it only happened the one time on the 7.1 track. I might play it again sometime with the 5.1 track to see if it happens again, but I can't help but wonder if there was an encoding glitch.

Also, I am not using a Darbee or any other video processor with my system. I do have an HDMI switch box, since I have to share the input on my receiver with a DVD player, but that's never posed a problem, and I don't think it could be at fault for this.

Other than the audio glitch, the 3D disc was wonderful. Some of the best upconversion work I've ever seen, and the sound is very good too.

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post #24 of 24 Old 11-16-2013, 04:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathanddrews View Post

This movie had me by the balls as soon as GlaDOS showed up in early trailers. Del Toro and his daughter were huge Portal fans and asked Valve for the rights to use her. When it comes to giant mecha-monster mashups, I'm pretty easy to please anyway. Now if only we could get a solid film adaptation of "The Big O"...

I love the Big O " and much as I'd love to see a Mega Deuce on an 87ft Imax screen, lets get an adaptation "Heroic Age" The Nodost "Bell Cross" is a beast wink.gif
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