My IFA 2006 HD-DVD photos......... - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 01:24 PM - Thread Starter
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After an extremely rainy day in Berlin, I´ll hope you can use my photos from the show. Not much new, exept the two darlings from Toshiba, the HD-E1 and HD-XE1.

I was amazed how small these players are, and surpriced that the XE1 got 1080P out.

Here´s the first pictures, tomorrow I´ll upload some more, including scans from the brandnew German main catalog, with detailed info on the two babes.

Frontview Toshiba HD-E1.:

http://img133.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_532lo.JPG

Frontview Toshiba HD-XE1.:

http://img124.imagevenue.com/img.php..._123_436lo.JPG

Rearview of the HD-E1.:

http://img133.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_430lo.JPG

Other pictures.:

http://img159.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_390lo.jpg

http://img102.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_328lo.jpg

http://img130.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_381lo.jpg

http://img151.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_478lo.jpg

http://img102.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_431lo.jpg

http://img23.imagevenue.com/img.php?..._122_537lo.jpg

http://img7.imagevenue.com/img.php?i..._122_435lo.jpg

http://img142.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_553lo.jpg

http://img151.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_349lo.jpg

Scans from the new German catalog, incl technical data.:

http://img37.imagevenue.com/img.php?..._122_359lo.jpg

http://img21.imagevenue.com/img.php?..._122_492lo.jpg

http://img145.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_327lo.jpg

http://img155.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_444lo.jpg

http://img153.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_533lo.jpg

http://img133.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_403lo.jpg

http://img121.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_580lo.jpg
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post #2 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 01:30 PM
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snap, that looks like a nice player. I want one....I'm guessing that is what the next player here in north america will look like.
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post #3 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 01:36 PM
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Looking at that last picture makes me wonder why they bother with the composite and s-video outputs. Is there any situation where someone would use them? Seems like this is just begging for people to hook them up SD style and then complain that the PQ isn't better than DVD.
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post #4 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 01:52 PM
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every body take another good look at the last image and notice theres no 6 channel (5.1 )
analog output on this the cheaper of the two HD-DVD players. Exactly how is anyone suppos to get DD+,Dolby True HD with out that output. Theres no receivers with built in decoders yet and the cheapy player does not have HDMI 1.3 either.
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post #5 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevron07
Looking at that last picture makes me wonder why they bother with the composite and s-video outputs. Is there any situation where someone would use them? Seems like this is just begging for people to hook them up SD style and then complain that the PQ isn't better than DVD.
Yeah. A few weeks back I posted the same objection. Makes no sense whatsoever to put low level signal outputs on such a high end player. My head was served on a platter shortly thereafter.
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post #6 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 02:16 PM
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yeh thats the ist thing i noticed 2 ch analog outputs in the rear no 6 ch analog ,whats tos thinking!!! lets hope that was a proto type ,or im gonna get a a1 with fw and have a better player then whats coming out. i heard on this forum that the hd a2 will cost the same as the a1,lets hope tos doesnt go cheap on us now and open the door for blu-ray.
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post #7 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 02:23 PM
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Nice. I'm feeling the XE1 more in this generation. Bring'em stateside boys.
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post #8 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 02:25 PM
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I presume that with the HDMI 1.3 they are telling you (with the E1 model) that you will have to hook that up to your Receiver (what company has 1.3 integration already??) Anyone else living on this edge of thinking?

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post #9 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b.ramos
every body take another good look at the last image and notice theres no 6 channel (5.1 )
analog output on this the cheaper of the two HD-DVD players. Exactly how is anyone suppos to get DD+,Dolby True HD with out that output. Theres no receivers with built in decoders yet and the cheapy player does not have HDMI 1.3 either.

the machine decodes the audio, and passes it a pcm out the HDMI for the true HD, just like the current players do
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post #10 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 02:36 PM
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for the audio, as others have stated, you simply either use PCM over HDMI to get full DD+/TrueHD/DTS-HD or use the optical out for DTS re-encoded audio (which I have been using since day 1 and sounds terrific and is definitely a great improvement over sd dvd audio)...i think they did it right in EU, the lower end model is actually distinguishable from the higher end model with actual, meaningful differences.

btw, that XE1 would look purrrrrrfect in my a/v rack...maybe i'll take the family to eu for the holidays if they don't announce it here in the usa at cedia for the u.s. holiday season :D
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post #11 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 02:48 PM
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Wow, no SCART port. Great to see that Europe is perhaps finally going to grow out of this antiquated standard (TVs here still only have 1 Component input and 2 interlaced-standard-def-only SCART ports!!)

Doesn't explain why Composite and S-Video are there though.

Anyway. MUCH better looking player, it's tempting to get rid of my US imported unit...

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post #12 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 03:07 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighDeff
After an extremely rainy day in Berlin, I´ll hope you can use my photos from the show. Not much new, exept the two darlings from Toshiba, the HD-E1 and HD-XE1.

I was amazed how small these players are, and surpriced that the XE1 got 1080P out.

Here´s the first pictures, tomorrow I´ll upload some more, including scans from the brandnew German main catalog, with detailed info on the two babes.

Frontview Toshiba HD-E1.:

http://img133.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_532lo.JPG

Frontview Toshiba HD-XE1.:

http://img124.imagevenue.com/img.php..._123_436lo.JPG

Rearview of the HD-E1.:

http://img133.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_430lo.JPG


More later :D
Did you say 1080P OUTPUT???
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post #13 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 03:12 PM
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Yes. The high-end Euro model is 1080p, HDMI 1.3

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post #14 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 03:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lyris
Yes. The high-end Euro model is 1080p, HDMI 1.3
But HOW does it get to 1080P ??? Does it come native off of the disk this way ? Or is done the way the Sammy does ?


Big Difference....

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My Collection
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post #15 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 03:44 PM
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I have no idea, sorry!

Whatever the method, most people wanting to buy this sort of thing will know that 1080p means "the best kind of HD" so it'll be a selling point.

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post #16 of 47 Old 09-01-2006, 04:12 PM
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all those bd brain-washed best buy drones will have to adjust their sales pitch drastically when these hit the u.s. shores.

i can just see them now trying to tell the average consumer about higher bandwidth and more capacity.
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post #17 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 02:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevron07
Looking at that last picture makes me wonder why they bother with the composite and s-video outputs. Is there any situation where someone would use them? Seems like this is just begging for people to hook them up SD style and then complain that the PQ isn't better than DVD.
They do come in handy when you're trying to set the machine up though. Especially with this handshake rubbish.
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post #18 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 03:29 AM
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Wow - they've hit a home run with these - or as they say here, they've knocked it for six!

They have moved swiftly to the 2nd generation players very adroitly!

And finally there is an appreciable difference between the low-end and top-end players.

A few observations:

1) HDMI 1.3 with 1080p on the XE1 - very nice. Low end E1 stays at 1.2 1080i - very smart, considering it'll be the price-leader and those users that have the equipment to support 1.3 or 1080p inputs will likely be able to afford the difference. Also, nice to see HDMI 1.3 on HD DVD when blurray is still on first-gen.

2) DTS-HD (without asterixes) for BOTH players - and TruHD of course. Full decoding of all advanced audio formats now looks to be the standard for all HD DVD players as of today. Very nice. The lack of analog 5.1 output on the E1 is not an issue in my opinion - users can still get re-coded 5.1 audio over the SPDIF port and HDMI will give LPCM decoded audio, so all's fine. ***EDIT*** A PDF document says DTS core, so this may not be the case yet...

3) Nice designs - much smaller. Does anyone know the startup times? I'll bet they are WAY faster now.

4) No DVD-Audio? Bummer. I guess that pretty much rules out any hopes for future DVD-A playback from the A1 and XA1. That's really a shame, since HDMI is the perfect delivery vehicle for DVD-Audio content. I'd really like to get rid of my Denon 3910 (and also upgrade my AMP), which is ONLY still here because of my DVD-A discs. I'm tired of proprietary Denon-link type solutions. Come on guys! At least give it to us on the XE1!

5) Nice risers on the XE1. I know it seems like a silly little detail, but they look high enough to allow some decent airflow from my under-shelf fans.

6) Geee... I just couldn't HELP but notice that 45 Gig triple-layer disc sitting pretty on the display rack! Wouldn't it be rich if this hits the market before Sony can get their Dual-layer disc sorted out? :D

7) I like it - I see five (5) HD DVD drives for computers there...

When can I buy the XE1?? I have my credit card out!!

Oh - and fellas? Could you make sure that you have a remote code to allow NTSC playback also, so I can free up some rack space here?
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post #19 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 05:40 AM
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Blue halos and counter lights?
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post #20 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 06:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevron07
Looking at that last picture makes me wonder why they bother with the composite and s-video outputs. Is there any situation where someone would use them?
I have my player hooked up with HDMI, as well as S-Video.

When playing non-anamorphic widescreen SD DVDs, the RCA HD DVD player picture boxes the movie (black bars on all sides). If I switch to S-Video, my TV can do a 16:9 zoom so I can see the picture without bars.

Sounds silly, but my TV won't zoom a 1080i or 480p source.

-John
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post #21 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 07:34 AM
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Quote:
Oh - and fellas? Could you make sure that you have a remote code to allow NTSC playback also, so I can free up some rack space here?
It should definitely play NTSC, because remember that Japan uses NTSC and is also on Region 2, same as Europe.

It's the Regional Lockout we need a workaround for. Hopefully someone will come out with a mod chip.

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post #22 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam
Wow - they've hit a home run with these - or as they say here, they've knocked it for six!

They have moved swiftly to the 2nd generation players very adroitly!

And finally there is an appreciable difference between the low-end and top-end players.

A few observations:

1) HDMI 1.3 with 1080p on the XE1 - very nice. Low end E1 stays at 1.2 1080i - very smart, considering it'll be the price-leader and those users that have the equipment to support 1.3 or 1080p inputs will likely be able to afford the difference. Also, nice to see HDMI 1.3 on HD DVD when blurray is still on first-gen.

2) DTS-HD (without asterixes) for BOTH players - and TruHD of course. Full decoding of all advanced audio formats now looks to be the standard for all HD DVD players as of today. Very nice. The lack of analog 5.1 output on the E1 is not an issue in my opinion - users can still get re-coded 5.1 audio over the SPDIF port and HDMI will give LPCM decoded audio, so all's fine. ***EDIT*** A PDF document says DTS core, so this may not be the case yet...

3) Nice designs - much smaller. Does anyone know the startup times? I'll bet they are WAY faster now.

4) No DVD-Audio? Bummer. I guess that pretty much rules out any hopes for future DVD-A playback from the A1 and XA1. That's really a shame, since HDMI is the perfect delivery vehicle for DVD-Audio content. I'd really like to get rid of my Denon 3910 (and also upgrade my AMP), which is ONLY still here because of my DVD-A discs. I'm tired of proprietary Denon-link type solutions. Come on guys! At least give it to us on the XE1!

5) Nice risers on the XE1. I know it seems like a silly little detail, but they look high enough to allow some decent airflow from my under-shelf fans.

6) Geee... I just couldn't HELP but notice that 45 Gig triple-layer disc sitting pretty on the display rack! Wouldn't it be rich if this hits the market before Sony can get their Dual-layer disc sorted out? :D

7) I like it - I see five (5) HD DVD drives for computers there...

When can I buy the XE1?? I have my credit card out!!

Oh - and fellas? Could you make sure that you have a remote code to allow NTSC playback also, so I can free up some rack space here?

Three questions :

1. Has anyone checked the boot/diskload time on this one?
2. Is the HDCP/HDMI more robust than the HD-A1?
3. Does it play HD-DVD content burnt on DVD/R DL?

---

Note after seeing the toshiba laptop reject by hd-dvd authored on DVD/R DL, I am not assuming everything will be status quo.
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post #23 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 09:19 AM
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So are some other CE companies besides Toshiba and RCA stepping up or what?

I've heard about NEC. I've heard about Lite-On. Anyone else...preferably a little bigger and more prominent?

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
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post #24 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 09:22 AM
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The G2 player released in the US better have analog 5.1 or they can forget it. My Rotel does not have HDMI audio inputs and I am in no mood to get a new processor to be able to do so.

Louder is NOT better!
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post #25 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 09:33 AM
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Aha. The listing says that the players have DNR (Digital Noise Reduction) and Zoom. In that case it looks like we really are looking at 2G players!

Interestingly it says they DON'T support PAL Progressive Scan (576p). That can't be right.

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post #26 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CMRA
Yeah. A few weeks back I posted the same objection. Makes no sense whatsoever to put low level signal outputs on such a high end player. My head was served on a platter shortly thereafter.
I believe it is for two purposes

1. When your HDTV is in the shop getting repaired or a sdtv is the only one avialble.

2. Making (this is funny) VHS or dvd copies, I doubt if HDCP is on these outputs, and it would be cool to force a copy to the kids room tv when they are on punishment, while you watch the hi def one.
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post #27 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 10:02 AM
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is that 1080P 24-25-30-60?
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post #28 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 10:07 AM
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Do you see what I see in ths picture?

http://img102.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_431lo.jpg

Top row: Batman Begins/christmas vacation
Second row down: Harry Potter
second from bottom: troy
bottom row: V for vendetta

Wonder what is on the other side of the hddvd player/tv?

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post #29 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sikoniko
Do you see what I see in ths picture?

http://img102.imagevenue.com/img.php..._122_431lo.jpg

Top row: Batman Begins/christmas vacation
Second row down: Harry Potter
second from bottom: troy
bottom row: V for vendetta

Wonder what is on the other side of the hddvd player/tv?

From what I can tell it appears to be, or contains at least, a duplicate set of cases. If you'll notice the third case on the top row looks like Christmas Vacation. The third case on the second row is House of Wax. Both of those cases and their respective locations are in relation to the right side.


Nice post BTW HighDeff. Thanks for posting those pics.

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post #30 of 47 Old 09-02-2006, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lyris

Interestingly it says they DON'T support PAL Progressive Scan (576p). That can't be right.
With upscaling to 720p/1080i (and 1080p on XE1), I think 576p is rather redundant. ;)

Steve

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