Tosh HD-XA2 1080p HD DVD - First End User Reports!: USERS ONLY PLEASE! - Page 6 - AVS Forum
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post #151 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 07:51 AM
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Thank goodness, I'm not the only one having this problem. I'm running the XA2 through my Sony 5200ES. Using HDMI, I can only get PCM output, with weak tinny bass.

The only "fix" has been using the optical out on the XA2.

Kevin

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Originally Posted by thebland View Post

Today I got an HD-XA2 (well borrowed from DIY GUY..and look for some HDA2 v. HDXA2 screen shots tonight!!!)....

Exact same audio issues with not being able to get BITSTREAM out of BOTH players thru HDMI that I had with the HD-A2. No matter what I did with both machines in the audio set up menu, my processor OSD shows DIGITAL PCM no matter what the configuration. When I put audio on BITSTREAM, PCM, AUTO, etc, I only get 2 channel LPCM which my processor matrixs to prologic. The TOSH should be sending BITSTREAM over HDMI. I cannot get a 5.1 bitstream out of either HD DVD player. 2 channel LPCM also explains the thin bass as there is no LFE in 2 channel LPCM.

FWIW: When playing audio via HDMI, the player says DIGITAL BITSTREAM though my PROCESSOR says it is receiveing DIGITAL PCM (incorrect). When via TOSLINK, player says DIGITAL BITSTREAM and the processor is reading DIGITAL BITSTREAM (all correct).

I talked to my dealer about it thinking perhaps it is my processor that i the issue but he said that his sources have told him that the new HDA2 and XA2 use the same AUDIO BOARDS. These AUDIO BOARDS are different from the ones in the HD-A1 (and would explain why there was no audio issues with the A1 and XA1). Many folks cannot get 96 KHz multi channel out of either Toshiba either.

He said, TOSHIBA should soon have a firmware update (next week).

That said, Using the TOSLINK for audio, I do get bitstream from the Toshiba and solid, issue free audio track..

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post #152 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 07:54 AM
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m apologies in advance, but could someone, maybe thebland, explain to me what the issue is with passing 'bitstream' over hdmi is as it relates to a2/xa2?

what i am a bit confused about is that unless the movie has legacy dd or dts, passing the 'bitstream', which is the compressed, non-decoded audio stream, is not possible unless you have 1) an outboard avr/processor that ITSELF can DECODE the advanced audio encoded using either dd+, dd-thd or dts-hd ma ... these don't exist yet AND that outboard audio processor also has hdmi 1,3.

so the only option would be to output lpcm, which results in the player decoding the dd+, dd-thd, or dts-hd ma and sending it over hdmi as uncompressed (ie, decoded) lpcm.

from what i know, most titles use at least dd+ and rarely simple dd or dts.

so, it would seem to me that at the present time it would be impossible to pas the 'bitstream' of any title that uses one of the advanced audio codecs...??
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post #153 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 08:06 AM
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This is a great player with an excellent upscaler especially. But here are a few of my glitches/issues after 3 days.

1. When I switch from watching something in SD-DVD to HD-DVD, I sometimes get a message that the unit will restart playback to ensure proper resolution. It then kicks back to the very beginning (to the start-up studio logo). The player does not seem to like jumping between SD and HD without begin fully turned off. One time I got this message twice in the middle of playback within 10 minutes. I had to completely unplug the unit annd then turn it back on. But I have never gotten this problem in SD-DVD playback.

2. The Frame by Frame command on the remote seems only to work in SD-DVD titles. It worked briefly with one HD-DVD and has not come back since. After this, I started getting the playback glitch mentioned above.

3. The XA-2 will not read DVD+Rs discs finalized by my Panasonic DVD recorder. Can anyone tell me if they have played DVD-Rs finalized by a recorder (not a PC) in the XA-2 ?

4. The subwoofer volume in the test pattern is way too low - so much so I didn't even hear it the first time and thought there was a problem. I have to jiggy all the db levels just to hear the sub. I am not sure what to make of this.

5. The display pop-up needs to be seriously improved. It blocks a big part of the screen, so it is intrusive during playback. Ridiculously, it does not toggle between how time has elapsed and how much is left. Instead, to see how much is left, you have to engage the display on the screen (with time elapsed) and then look at the device front panel itself, which toggles from time elapsed to time left only when you hit display. In effect then, you can't use the total dimmer and discover time left simultaneously, much less read tiny digital print 12 feet away. Grr. Compare this to the far less intrusive but similarly informative display key on the PS 3.

I have played two HD-DVDs on it - Troy and the Last Samurai. Both are Warner titles, so I thought perhaps their software might be glitchy.

I am connecting to an HP MD6580N DLP via HDMI at 1080p, with 5.1 audio out to my receiver.

Comments would be appreciated.

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post #154 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackman View Post

Run the Tosh straight into the Mits and see what happens. That way you'll know if some corruption is occurring in the HDMI transition in the Denon.


I tried this last night and i get the same issues. I even tried different HDMI cables.
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post #155 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phrynichus View Post

This is a great player with an excellent upscaler especially. But here are a few of my glitches/issues after 3 days.

1. When I switch from watching something in SD-DVD to HD-DVD, I sometimes get a message that the unit will restart playback to ensure proper resolution. It then kicks back to the very beginning (to the start-up studio logo). The player does not seem to like jumping between SD and HD without begin fully turned off. One time I got this message twice in the middle of playback within 10 minutes. I had to completely unplug the unit annd then turn it back on. But I have never gotten this problem in SD-DVD playback.

I have the same issue when the player is set to 1080p and I try switching to a different input. But I don't get the issue when I have the player set to 1080i. Try setting the player to 1080i and see if the problem persists.

For me, great player and great HDMI sound, but a number of issues:

1. Aforementioned playback interruption when switching sources while set to 1080p.

2. Glitchy and inconsistent compatability with U-Control discs like Miami Vice. Watched Vice last night. Overlay menus were sluggish and there was a slight glitching of video very much like early Samsung BD players with DTS BDs. Rebooting the player resulted in smooth, normal playback.

3. A high-pitched digital squeal sometimes that can be corrected by rebooting the player or reloading the disc.

4. When I press eject on the remote towards the end of the movie, maybe over end credits, without hitting stop first, the disc stops playing, the display says STOP, but the disc never ejects. Hitting eject again doesn't help. Player is unresponsive. Hard reboot of the player is the only remedy. This has happened a few times.

5. This morning, player locked up with King Kong disc when trying to go from Universal screensaver back to main menu. Had to reboot the player.

Again, love the PQ/SQ, build quality and styling, but should I have these many issues after four days? Why am I always the one?
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post #156 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 08:49 AM
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Jeff,

Can you explain how you are converting 1080i out of the player to 1080p24sf on the Qualia? I am awaiting the new Lumagen Scaler (March) to do the same myself. What are you using?

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post #157 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bferr1 View Post

4. When I press eject on the remote towards the end of the movie, maybe over end credits, without hitting stop first, the disc stops playing, the display says STOP, but the disc never ejects. Hitting eject again doesn't help. Player is unresponsive. Hard reboot of the player is the only remedy. This has happened a few times.

I have had this problem too - but only with the Troy HD-DVD, not with the Last Samurai. (Those are the only two I own at the moment.)

I also find that a hard reboot (unplug, short delay, turn on) seems to clear most issues. Maybe the firmware update will help us?

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post #158 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 09:18 AM
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Lets hope all these bugs/glitches can be fixed via firmware--thank you to the early adopters to find these problems, makes things easier for those of us waiting a bit longer!
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post #159 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 09:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

Exact same audio issues with not being able to get BITSTREAM out of BOTH players thru HDMI that I had with the HD-A2. No matter what I did with both machines in the audio set up menu, my processor OSD shows DIGITAL PCM no matter what the configuration. When I put audio on BITSTREAM, PCM, AUTO, etc, I only get 2 channel LPCM which my processor matrixs to prologic. The TOSH should be sending BITSTREAM over HDMI. I cannot get a 5.1 bitstream out of either HD DVD player. 2 channel LPCM also explains the thin bass as there is no LFE in 2 channel LPCM.

FWIW: When playing audio via HDMI, the player says DIGITAL BITSTREAM though my PROCESSOR says it is receiveing DIGITAL PCM (incorrect). When via TOSLINK, player says DIGITAL BITSTREAM and the processor is reading DIGITAL BITSTREAM (all correct).

I talked to my dealer about it thinking perhaps it is my processor that i the issue but he said that his sources have told him that the new HDA2 and XA2 use the same AUDIO BOARDS. These AUDIO BOARDS are different from the ones in the HD-A1 (and would explain why there was no audio issues with the A1 and XA1). Many folks cannot get 96 KHz multi channel out of either Toshiba either.

He said, TOSHIBA should soon have a firmware update (next week).

That said, Using the TOSLINK for audio, I do get bitstream from the Toshiba and solid, issue free audio track..


I think this is a problem of HD DVD authoring. Since HD DVD format is mandatory to have minimum of DD+ (not understood by any current AVR yet), and most or all HD DVDs are authored using "advanced" encoding, the player ALWAYS interprets the DD+ (or TrueHD, etc.) and mixes it with the menu beeps and outputs it as PCM over HDMI, irregardless of the audio menu setting. For TOSlink, it internally converts the audio to DTS @ 1509kbps, which is a bitstream your receiver can understand. If the disc wasn't authored using the "advanced" coding, and had only DD (non-plus), and you set the audio output to bitstream, then I think you would see Dolby Digital output on your OSD of your AVR over HDMI connection.

I think the audio setting, PCM vs. bitstream, is only relevant for regular DVDs? In that case, the bitstream of regular DD or DTS gets directly output to the receiver. I've never tried this, but if you set the setting to PCM and put a SD DVD in there, i think the player would decode the bitstream and output it as LPCM over HDMI even for SD DVDs. I always use bitstream for this, but don't watch much SD DVDs on my player anymore.

Also, I've read the new players only output 48kHz instead of 96kHz. Not sure if this is a bug, or if they just opted to output at lower frequency. I haven't seen any higher than 24-bit/48kHz source anyway, then the 96kHz was overkill and wouldn't sound any better. Unless there is perhaps a music video with TrueHD done @ 24/96, or perhaps DTS 24/96 (would firmware read this, or does this exceed "core" DTS), it wouldn't matter. Maybe firmware would boost this back to 96KHz, but it never may - perhaps they are using cheaper audio boards in second generation than first?
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post #160 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 09:56 AM
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Finally received mine after missing Fedex on Friday.

Just looking at a few quickly before going to work.

Using HDMI/DVI into a Panasonic 65" 1080p Plasma (TH-65PF9UK), audio into a Yamaha YSP1100.

The picture is absolutely beautiful, no glitches yet.

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post #161 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 09:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drhollen View Post

I think this is a problem of HD DVD authoring. Since HD DVD format is mandatory to have minimum of DD+ (not understood by any current AVR yet), and most or all HD DVDs are authored using "advanced" encoding, the player ALWAYS interprets the DD+ (or TrueHD, etc.) and mixes it with the menu beeps and outputs it as PCM over HDMI, irregardless of the audio menu setting. For TOSlink, it internally converts the audio to DTS @ 1509kbps, which is a bitstream your receiver can understand. If the disc wasn't authored using the "advanced" coding, and had only DD (non-plus), and you set the audio output to bitstream, then I think you would see Dolby Digital output on your OSD of your AVR over HDMI connection.

The only caveat to the above is that there were no such issues with the HDA1 or XA1. Audio issues only started in the second gen players.

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post #162 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BenDover View Post

m apologies in advance, but could someone, maybe thebland, explain to me what the issue is with passing 'bitstream' over hdmi is as it relates to a2/xa2?

what i am a bit confused about is that unless the movie has legacy dd or dts, passing the 'bitstream', which is the compressed, non-decoded audio stream, is not possible unless you have 1) an outboard avr/processor that ITSELF can DECODE the advanced audio encoded using either dd+, dd-thd or dts-hd ma ... these don't exist yet AND that outboard audio processor also has hdmi 1,3.

so the only option would be to output lpcm, which results in the player decoding the dd+, dd-thd, or dts-hd ma and sending it over hdmi as uncompressed (ie, decoded) lpcm.

from what i know, most titles use at least dd+ and rarely simple dd or dts.

so, it would seem to me that at the present time it would be impossible to pas the 'bitstream' of any title that uses one of the advanced audio codecs...??

This sounds dead on, and is my understanding as well. I would expect most all receivers/audio processors to not understand the new format codecs over bitstream at the current time.
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post #163 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 05:20 PM
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I had same issue with Miami Vice.
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post #164 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 05:31 PM
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I had same issue with Miami Vice.
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post #165 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 05:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dllewel View Post

This sounds dead on, and is my understanding as well. I would expect most all receivers/audio processors to not understand the new format codecs over bitstream at the current time.

True. Bitstream over HDMI is used for legacy DD and DTS in todays world (as there are no 1.3 processors / receivers). However, the Tosh is sending PCM (2 channel in my case) over HDMI and cannot be forced to output bitstream for these legacy formats.

FWIW: My Panasonic Blu Ray player, JVC D-VHS player, & Pioneer 59 AVi all [properly] send bitstream over HDMI - not PCM. It is only the HD-A2 that fails to properly do this.

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post #166 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 06:00 PM
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My XA2 is due in tomorrow. Is it a given that I need to get "great" HDMI Cables or not? Does one really have to pay $150.00 for 4 ft cables for my DVD and CABLE box to hook them up to my Sony STR0DA5200ES receiver. My TV installer is installing Monster HDMI from my receiver to the TV, Tosh LC52D62U, which is also 1080p. This is my first experience for HD and I joined this forum as it appears populated with very knowledgeable users.
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post #167 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 06:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfields View Post

My XA2 is due in tomorrow. Is it a given that I need to get "great" HDMI Cables or not? Does one really have to pay $150.00 for 4 ft cables for my DVD and CABLE box to hook them up to my Sony STR0DA5200ES receiver. My TV installer is installing Monster HDMI from my receiver to the TV, Tosh LC52D62U, which is also 1080p. This is my first experience for HD and I joined this forum as it appears populated with very knowledgeable users.

many of us buy from Monoprice or Blue Jeans cables (sponsor links at top of page)

a good 4 foot HDMI cable should cost around $10.00
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post #168 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 06:29 PM
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No, check out the HDMI cables at www.monoprice.com - They have different guage of cables, but for only a few feet, you could get one of the cheaper ones (although the highest price ones are more cost effective too).
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post #169 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

True. Bitstream over HDMI is used for legacy DD and DTS in todays world (as there are no 1.3 processors / receivers). However, the Tosh is sending PCM (2 channel in my case) over HDMI and cannot be forced to output bitstream for these legacy formats.

FWIW: My Panasonic Blu Ray player, JVC D-VHS player, & Pioneer 59 AVi all [properly] send bitstream over HDMI - not PCM. It is only the HD-A2 that fails to properly do this.

Okay, I understand. It is behaving like it is playing a Dolby TrueHD track, which is only supported in 2 channel only. I'm sure you've tried setting the 'Digital Out HDMI' setting from Auto to Bitstream? Very puzzling.
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post #170 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dllewel View Post

Okay, I understand. It is behaving like it is playing a Dolby TrueHD track, which is only supported in 2 channel only. I'm sure you've tried setting the 'Digital Out HDMI' setting from Auto to Bitstream? Very puzzling.

Yes. No dice.

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post #171 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 08:32 PM
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Just pre-ordered this badboy from J&R. Drooool. Rigging up to a Sammy 52in LCD @ 1080p. Do i need to pick up an HDMI cable from monoPrice? Running 5.1 analog outs.

Thx!
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post #172 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 08:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpeter1093 View Post

That's exactly correct...the firmware is up to date. No firmware updates have been released for the XA2.

I know a new firmware is not out yet. But I am getting "Cannot find out server" which is telling me either something is wrong with my player connecting to the network or the out server it is referring to is not available yet.

Are others getting Firmware is up to date message?
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post #173 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 08:54 PM
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i'm a little confused. why would you want to output DD+ or True HD bitstream over HDMI if no receiver can decode it? If you want bitstream for DD or DTS why not just use the SPDIF connection?

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post #174 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlee301 View Post

I know a new firmware is not out yet. But I am getting "Cannot find out server" which is telling me either something is wrong with my player connecting to the network or the out server it is referring to is not available yet.

Are others getting Firmware is up to date message?

You're doing it wrong. When you set it up correctly then you will receive a message that your unit is already updated with the latest firmware (not exactly those words but something similar).

DHCP and DNS need to be on.

Want to laugh, I kept receiving the same error message that you're getting and even though I had both the DHCP and DNS on, it still couldn't automatically locate my network information (ie; IP address).

Want to know what I was doing wrong?

I forgot to plug in the ethernet cable (from the XA2) into the router. Once I plugged it in, bang, it worked (like duh).

Yup, that's how the most basic mistakes can screw you.

Make sure you're not doing the same thing I did.
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post #175 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 10:31 PM
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Looks like my issue may have been caused with using auto-dhcp and dns. It wasn't setting the gateway ip for some strange reason...
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post #176 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 10:51 PM
 
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Why am I not getting a LOGO on the screen for the HD-XA2?...I just have a dark screen?...The Player works when I hit play and it goes to Display and everything seems to function properly, only I have NO LOGO for the start up screen!
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post #177 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 10:52 PM
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That is bizarre. You should see the HD DVD logo. Is anyone else not seeing it?

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post #178 of 4649 Old 01-08-2007, 11:05 PM
 
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I have tried everything, I can't seem to find a way to make it show the LOGO!...Damn it!...I guess it's going back to Robert...
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post #179 of 4649 Old 01-09-2007, 06:17 AM
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Originally Posted by joffer View Post

i'm a little confused. why would you want to output DD+ or True HD bitstream over HDMI if no receiver can decode it? If you want bitstream for DD or DTS why not just use the SPDIF connection?

The receiver doesn't need to decode it - the player does that. The receiver isn't decoding DD+ or TrueHD over the 5.1 analog inputs, either.
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post #180 of 4649 Old 01-09-2007, 06:42 AM
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Originally Posted by chuckken View Post

I have tried everything, I can't seem to find a way to make it show the LOGO!...Damn it!...I guess it's going back to Robert...

What difference does it make whether the LOGO displays or not?

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