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post #91 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 08:58 PM
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I would definitely vouch for Robert (VE) as well. You can't go wrong ordering from him!

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post #92 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 08:59 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I am only speculating, but I believe we will see improved image quality with the XA2 through the HDMI output and even more image quality improvement through component for SD and HD DVD discs.

The Silicon Optix Reon processor and the built-in calibration tools will give us the power to peak the performance of this HD player. Toshiba's product specialists, testers and engineers are very happy with how the G 2 machines turned out and are very impressed and proud of the flagship XA2.

Once we have HDMI 1.3 receivers and displays we will see the benefits of the full color palet of "Deep Color".

-Robert
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post #93 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 09:16 PM
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Robert, I noticed some forum members that pre ordered received an e-mail today. Did e-mails go out to all those who pre ordered or just for those that will have theirs shipped on the 3rd?

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post #94 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 09:23 PM
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Robert,

Don't know if you're aware but you've been quoted here:

http://www.engadgethd.com/2006/12/28...until-january/

Would really appreciate it if you could find out when Europe might see the release of the XA2 since that engadget report is vague in stating: "rest of the world should still see this hardware later on in the year".
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post #95 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 09:47 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Burk View Post

Robert, I noticed some forum members that pre ordered received an e-mail today. Did e-mails go out to all those who pre ordered or just for those that will have theirs shipped on the 3rd?

Clark,

We are shipping all open orders completely. If you did not get an email from me tonight, we either have a incorrect email address or it may be in your spam folder.

-Robert
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post #96 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 10:22 PM
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Let's see, a 1080p projector that accepts 24 hertz, an XA2, and a ISF calibration to take advantage of all those nifty tweaks it has. Oh boy 2007 is going to be an expensive year!
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post #97 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 11:19 PM - Thread Starter
 
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^^ Yes sir!

-Robert
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post #98 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

The Silicon Optix Reon processor and the built-in calibration tools will give us the power to peak the performance of this HD player. Toshiba's product specialists, testers and engineers are very happy with how the G 2 machines turned out and are very impressed and proud of the flagship XA2.
-Robert

You are saying that the HD-XA2 will be using the same Reon processors as the Denon DVD-2930Ci that I just paid $850 for? Of course, the Denon has other audio benefits, but if that is the case I will try to return my Denon and put in a pre-order for the XA2. The Reon is simply awesome.
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post #99 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 11:39 PM
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The thing I am wondering about is if Deep Color will be effected through hardware or software? I was told that HD-DVD abd BD are 8bit color standards just as DVD, so the "Deep Color" information is not present on the discs, with an HDMI 1.3 display and the XA2, will hardware based scaling effect color quality despite the source not being up to par? I was actually in a big arguement in the past on if color would be scaled in a similar fashion how resolution is scaled or how aliasing is done in effect to completly obliterate posterization or overall color quality, but was argued it was purly software based and without the color information the display had nothing to work with to display the expanded color space.

So any information anyone could give on that would definatly push me greatly torwards an XA2, aswell as the showing and pricing on HDMI 1.3 displays come CES.

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post #100 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 11:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I Superman I View Post

The thing I am wondering about is if Deep Color will be effected through hardware or software? I was told that HD-DVD abd BD are 8bit color standards just as DVD, so the "Deep Color" information is not present on the discs, with an HDMI 1.3 display and the XA2, will hardware based scaling effect color quality despite the source not being up to par? I was actually in a big arguement in the past on if color would be scaled in a similar fashion how resolution is scaled or how aliasing is done in effect to completly obliterate posterization or overall color quality, but was argued it was purly software based and without the color information the display had nothing to work with to display the expanded color space.

So any information anyone could give on that would definatly push me greatly torwards an XA2, aswell as the showing and pricing on HDMI 1.3 displays come CES.

Only speaking from the meager knowledge I've scraped together from listening in to conversations that have taken place on this forum on the subject, I've got the idea that if a manufacturer was so inclined to include all the features necessary in the HDMI 1.3 DC compatible 1080p TV, the TV would be able to "upscale" an 8bit source to "Deep Color", which would help with tricky gradations of color and nix the banding that will pop up occasionally in some animated and other material, among just making it look "better" I guess. Not that that really helps you, since we're pretty much in the same position knowledge-wise on the subject. Hopefully more information re displays that feature DC will come out at CES.
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post #101 of 516 Old 12-28-2006, 11:53 PM
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The XA2 is sounding pretty awesome from a spec sheet standpoint. I can't wait to read some reviews and thoughts on its performance.

I'm curious what are some of your thoughts on the possible improvements in picture quality the XA2 can provide over the HD-A1 & 360 drive on a 720P 3LCD set? I am not familiar with the Reon chipset at all.

Thanks Richard

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post #102 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 12:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capek View Post

Only speaking from the meager knowledge I've scraped together from listening in to conversations that have taken place on this forum on the subject, I've got the idea that if a manufacturer was so inclined to include all the features necessary in the HDMI 1.3 DC compatible 1080p TV, the TV would be able to "upscale" an 8bit source to "Deep Color", which would help with tricky gradations of color and nix the banding that will pop up occasionally in some animated and other material, among just making it look "better" I guess. Not that that really helps you, since we're pretty much in the same position knowledge-wise on the subject. Hopefully more information re displays that feature DC will come out at CES.

Wouldn't it depend on whether or not the original DVD was encoded in "deep color?"

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post #103 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 12:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

Wouldn't it depend on whether or not the original DVD was encoded in "deep color?"

It seems like it would to some degree at least, but that is not the impression I have gotten from following the discussions that take place here between people who are much more well informed then me. And logically it makes sense that a DC display would be able to "upconvert", because otherwise, with the only content even has the potential to be encoded in deep color being maybe possibly so really first tier PS3 release, why would display manufacturers even bother implementing it at all into their displays? Unless to just have another empty marketing gimmick?

There have been some pretty technical discussions re the potential benefits of "upconverting" an HD optical disk to deep color in the display that have made my eyes glaze over, but the impression I got was that there would be a real world benefit, and the assumption was that a deep color capable display would be able to do said "upconversion".
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post #104 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 12:39 AM
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Can someone clarify what "Deep Color" means? Is this a Toshiba buzz word or a universal standard? by definition does it mean the colour depth has been up-sampled from 8 bits per pixel to say 10, creating many more intermediate shades that didn't exist on the source material? A bit like oversampling DACs (that this player also features for it's component output)? How many bits per pixel will "Deep Color" on this player up-sample to?
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post #105 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 12:45 AM
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Robert,

Will this player decode Dolby TrueHD and DTSHD (7.1) and pass it via HDMI1.3 cable to a compatible receiver?

Thanks
Prabhat

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post #106 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 12:47 AM
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Capek,

I guess there is no way to know how deep color will actually benefit us until its fully implemented in displays and source devices.

Sure would be good to know how much of the banding we see is in displays is signal related versus hardware.

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post #107 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 12:57 AM
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Yes!!!

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This translates to better PQ & AQ.
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post #108 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 01:57 AM
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@Robert, could you please try to find out whether 1080p60 (and later 1080p24) output is generated directly from the 1080p24 encoding *WITHOUT* going to 1080i60 in between? You know, the Samsung and Panasonic go 1080p24 -> 1080i60 -> 1080p60 which is really bad. It's important to me to know whether the XA2 will skip the 1080i60 step, like the Sony and Pioneer do. Thanks!
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post #109 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 03:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reio-ta View Post

There is practically zero point of 1080p24 output with this player. SO products are more than capable of taking 1080p24 source to 1080i60 telecine. The only problem is if your television can't reverse what the SO chip did. Given that the 1080p24 source is on the disc, you'll have no artifacts. 1080p24 to 1080i60 telecine can be, and is 100% reversable 100% of the time if done properly. SO chips are more than capable of doing this. The only reason for 1080p24 output is if your set can't convert 1080i60 encoded 24p material back to 24p properly.

Thanks for the effort, but I do have some serious knowledge in the video processing area, so you're not telling any news to me. Actually, I'm running an external video processor, so 1080i60 is an "ok" solution for me. But I definitely don't want the source device to do ANY video processing to the source material. Having a 1080i60 step in the processing chain doesn't necessarily have to harm the video quality (as you correctly state), but it *CAN* harm, if there's any part of the processing which is not working perfectly. E.g. CUE could be introduced (several HD-DVD and Blu-Ray player do have this problem!), vertical filtering and similar things. There's a reason why Joe Kane is strongly demanding a pure 24p output for every HD-DVD and Blu-Ray player.

Quote:
Originally Posted by reio-ta View Post

This situation is highly unlikely given that if the set can do some form of 24p as either 48p, 72p or even some as high as 120p, is in only the best of the best televisions, which have no problem extracting properly encoded 1080i60 as 1080p24 material.

My Panasonic 50PHD8 plasma can accept and natively show its native resolution in 48p, but it doesn't do inverse telecine for HD content. Doesn't matter for me, personally, though, as I'm using an external VP (as said above).

Quote:
Originally Posted by reio-ta View Post

What you should care about and why the HD-XA2 is such a deal, is because of the SO Reon.

The Reon is nice, but only:

(1) if your display is worse at video processing compared to the Reon *AND*
(2) if you don't have an external video processor which is equal or better compared to the Reon.

In my case, the Reon is pretty useless (YMMV, of course). What I want is a pure digital output of the video stream without the XA2 doing any processing to it.
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post #110 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 04:07 AM
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My biggest pet peve with the XA1 is the speaker setup/bass management that is TOTALLY messed up. If they have fixed it in this model, I will jump in a heartbeat.

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post #111 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 04:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post

@Robert, could you please try to find out whether 1080p60 (and later 1080p24) output is generated directly from the 1080p24 encoding *WITHOUT* going to 1080i60 in between? You know, the Samsung and Panasonic go 1080p24 -> 1080i60 -> 1080p60 which is really bad. It's important to me to know whether the XA2 will skip the 1080i60 step, like the Sony and Pioneer do. Thanks!

madshi,

don't get your hopes up. The decoder of the XA2 is decoding into an 1080i/60 stream. The REON chip is doing the IVTC for 1080p/60 output -> THAT's the reason Toshiba included the Silicon Optix chip in the first place. You know me - I keep pushing for "native, untouched, unprocessed,... " 1080p/24 output for months now. And I would much prefer the 1080p/60 output to be done without 1080i step (frame rate conversion of the native 1080p/24 stream) - but I don't see it happening with HD-DVD in the forseeable future - this has been discussed many times and is discussed right now in the insider thread again, so I don't want to argue here.

That being said I think Toshiba made the very best decision given the lack of native 1080p/24 decoding. They integrated a "state-of-the-art" (+ much hyped ) Silicon Optix solution to do the IVTC (among other "important" features like selective color correction to finally make the skies in Seabiscuit as blue as I ever wanted them to be ) - which is about the best solution they could have come up with. So I guess I will stop complaining, accept that there will not be a native 24p/60p decoding/output path with HD-DVD (for some time) and just ENJOY the XA2. My educated guess is that it will be the best next generation HD player on both sides of the fence yet - it has all the bases covered -> complete next generation audio decoding (including DTS-HD MA decoding per firmware update in spring), "crooked" 60p/24p output, Silicon Optix filter like detail enhancement, great looks and material/build quality and above all much improved responsiveness compared to G1. I'm looking forward to it.
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post #112 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 04:19 AM
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@TheLion, agreed. I was just hoping...
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post #113 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 04:42 AM
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@TheLion

So do you mean, that the XA2 is not capable of doing a direct 1080p/24-Output? This means what? Is it really a problem and will this show any visible disadvantages?

The 7G Plasmas from Pioneer can make an inverse telecine of 1080/60i, is this comparably to the process that you speak of?
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post #114 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 05:36 AM
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What would be the advantages to buy the XA2 with the Reon Chip and not the A2? Like you said, the Reon must be superb, so the overall picture quality should be a lot better? Does the A2 doesn't have an equal video processor?
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post #115 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalMovie View Post

@TheLion

So do you mean, that the XA2 is not capable of doing a direct 1080p/24-Output? This means what? Is it really a problem and will this show any visible disadvantages?

The 7G Plasmas from Pioneer can make an inverse telecine of 1080/60i, is this comparably to the process that you speak of?

I have a Pioneer 1540 HD plasma, debating whether or not to go with the A2 or the XA-2. Do you think I would see any benefit with the XA-2???
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post #116 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 05:57 AM
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Quote:


I am only speculating, but I believe we will see improved image quality with the XA2 through the HDMI output and even more image quality improvement through component for SD and HD DVD discs.

So should I hook the XA2 up through component and not HDMI to my TV?
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post #117 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 05:58 AM
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Is there an HDMI cable included?
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post #118 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 06:06 AM - Thread Starter
 
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^ No HDMI cable.

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post #119 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 06:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lastxbr960 View Post

Is there an HDMI cable included?

The email I received from Robert mentioned there is no HDMI cable
included.

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post #120 of 516 Old 12-29-2006, 06:39 AM
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I'd like to know if this unit has the low audio issues that is plaquing HDMI audio users with the HD-A2....


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