UPDATE and JUMPING WITH JOY: Triple Layer 51g on my A2 - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akbled View Post

That is a fantastic list of releases, it would be amazing if the Triple layer does come to fruition. The one title on this list that puzzles me though is Cast Away, that is already released on Blu-ray through Fox does Dreamworks hold distribution rights for this one as well? No Forrest Gump on that list is a shame too.

I wouldn't trust that list too much, it's rumor of an internal Paramount & Dreamworks email.
Toshiba is stepping up to the plate with a multi million dollar Super bowl commercial is a good sign, it means they are serious (otherwise why bother ) and since they are serious they shouldn't mind dropping some cash on their exclusive studios to publish some solid hits.
The triple layer thing has me puzzled, they were reports of this before, supposedly WB was going to release The Invasion as a Triple layer only, no dvd release (With a blu release of course). That was before they stabbed HD in the back.
It makes some sense (except for braveheart which they recently re-released), supposedly if the TLT works like it is been said to they are easy as a DVD to make. Much easier to produce than a combo disk.
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post #92 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by HB GAMER View Post

Dreamworks holds the international distribution rights to Cast Away and Universal property A Beautiful Mind.

Thanks for the quick response, another stupid question, does that mean that they share US rights with Fox?
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post #93 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 02:05 PM
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Just read a bit through the Amazon forum and came across this.

Quote: Disney caused controversy at the approval meeting by breaking ranks with the BDA and voting for these new discs (or just the TL51).

Interesting. Wonder about the truth of this and what might Disney be thinking.
Tony
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post #94 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony S View Post

Just read a bit through the Amazon forum and came across this.

Quote: Disney caused controversy at the approval meeting by breaking ranks with the BDA and voting for these new discs (or just the TL51).

Interesting. Wonder about the truth of this and what might Disney be thinking.
Tony

umm oh come on!!

Disney sometimes does cast votes in favor of a new specs for HDDVD. This does not mean they are going away from BDA! They have cast votes in favor of HDDVD specs numerous times. Even Matsushita has cast yay votes also.

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post #95 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MidnightWatcher View Post

Wouldn't going from 15GB per layer to 17GB per layer give you over a 13% increase in bandwidth?

No. Upping the spin rate would increase bandwidth, but I don't think that's in the plans along with TL51. But simply increasing the disk size has no impact on bandwidth. It just allows you to fit more stuff on the disk, but it wouldn't allow you to, say, get more lossless tracks on the disks, if the limitation in the specific context is bandwidth.
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post #96 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Doctor View Post

I wouldn't trust that list too much, it's rumor of an internal Paramount & Dreamworks email.
Toshiba is stepping up to the plate with a multi million dollar Super bowl commercial is a good sign, it means they are serious (otherwise why bother ) and since they are serious they shouldn't mind dropping some cash on their exclusive studios to publish some solid hits.
The triple layer thing has me puzzled, they were reports of this before, supposedly WB was going to release The Invasion as a Triple layer only, no dvd release (With a blu release of course). That was before they stabbed HD in the back.
It makes some sense (except for braveheart which they recently re-released), supposedly if the TLT works like it is been said to they are easy as a DVD to make. Much easier to produce than a combo disk.

I agree it's nothing more than pure speculation. Though the triple layer in either configuration would be a truly needed shot in the arm. My only hope is that they are farther along in development than those in the "know" would lead us to believe. Many of those titles though I would certainly be expecting releases for before long with the exception of course of the Speilberg related ones.
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post #97 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 02:25 PM
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Why do you need a TL51 for Sinbad:Legend of the Seven Seas???
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post #98 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBM99 View Post

Why do you need a TL51 for Sinbad:Legend of the Seven Seas???

who knows.........It is only 86 minutes long. Not long by movie standards. Hence it being a rumor and nothing more. Take with grain of salt. Like Fox, I will believe it when I see it!

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post #99 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capek View Post

No. Upping the spin rate would increase bandwidth, but I don't think that's in the plans along with TL51.

- Well the problem is that we don't know......but it's true that it could be.

In the original 45gb TL disc there was a 1.5x spin speed in the specs.

Obviously every Toshiba HD DVD player released since the 1st HD DVD drive had been developed was produced with the full knowledge of TL as a serious on-going development project and a practical possibility they were working on from day 1.

The orignal HD DVD drive - NEC HR-1100A - can be seen here with references to 45gb TL discs -
http://www.cloetens.be/custom/home/hd_dvd.pdf

I'd be very surprised if TL couldn't be read by all HD DVD players (or at the very least the very 1st gen could read the 1st & 2nd layers of them - which would merely invite imaginative organisation on the disc).

Until we get clarification either way it is perfectly possible that the 51gb disc (which was claimed to be easier to do than the old 45gb disc - it's an issue about 'through layer' interference patterns that turn out to have made 51gb (@ 17gb per layer) easier to 'do' than 45gb (@ 15gb per layer) may have kept the 1.5x spin speed.

If so the HD DVD will take the bragging rights with the higher capacity (and if it is true that Blu-ray's max practical capacity - before the error rates go stratospheric - is only 47gb then that's a handy almost DVD5 sized 4gb advantage, not just 1gb).

The 1.5x spin speed would also give HD DVD the higher raw bit-rate number too.

(If the spin speed is 1.5x then it's 1.5 x 36.55 mbps = 54.825mbps = removal of the last little practical spec-based pi$$ing right Blu-ray has left - 53.95 Mbit/s raw transfer max).
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post #100 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 03:38 PM
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if its true,they should said now not in 2 or 3 months maybe they will said for the superball
.
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post #101 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBM99 View Post

Why do you need a TL51 for Sinbad:Legend of the Seven Seas???

Well there are 7 seas, and the earth is 70% water. So I'd imagine the TL51 will be as well.

This is the animated one, right? For some reason I was thinking of The Golden Voyage of Sinbad with Tom Baker
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post #102 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Doctor View Post

Well there are 7 seas, and the earth is 70% water. So I'd imagine the TL51 will be as well.

This is the animated one, right? For some reason I was thinking of The Golden Voyage of Sinbad with Tom Baker

correct

with Brad Pitt doing the voicing of sinbad.....

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0165982/

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post #103 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 11:27 PM
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This may be a stupid question, but do any triple layer facilities exist, and if so, does it cost money to upgrade them from double layer to triple layer?

It isn't the size of the disk that counts, but how you use it.

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4K cinema at 60mbps, coming soon to a kiosk near you.
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post #104 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 11:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 30XS955 User View Post

This may be a stupid question, but do any triple layer facilities exist, and if so, does it cost money to upgrade them from double layer to triple layer?

HD DVD being similar to standard DVD means that all disc's can be made at any of the existing DVD replication facilities. Adding a third layer is similar to adding a second layer to a DVD and should be cheap to do imo.
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post #105 of 111 Old 01-25-2008, 11:43 PM
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Yes, I think production facility prices is not an issue.

"never give in, never give in, never, never, never, neverÂin nothing, great or small, large or pettyÂnever give in except to convictions of honour and good sense." - W. Churchill
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post #106 of 111 Old 01-26-2008, 07:12 AM
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This is great news for us current HD DVD supporters and I personally can't wait for it to hit the shelves.

...... but it is to late to stem the Blu tide unless Toshiba can get Disney or Fox to go TL51 purple (and that is a pipe dream right now)
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post #107 of 111 Old 01-26-2008, 07:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GmanAVS View Post

This is great news for us current HD DVD supporters and I personally can't wait for it to hit the shelves.

...... but it is to late to stem the Blu tide unless Toshiba can get Disney or Fox to go TL51 purple (and that is a pipe dream right now)

Disney is the key. More than half the top selling BD discs are kids movies. Never underestimate a father's need to placate his kids as part of a purchase decision. I firmly believe Disney has been the key to Blu-ray's success.
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post #108 of 111 Old 01-26-2008, 08:33 AM
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If Disney jumped on board, I'd buy 10 of their movies DAY ONE! I can't even say that with the current movie selections on HD-DVD.

(I'm red)
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post #109 of 111 Old 01-26-2008, 10:07 AM
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I have no intention of spreading any false hope or starting a rumor, but if Disney did indeed vote for TL51's ratification, and it does indeed work on ALL generation players, I could see Disney going neutral and putting HD DVD right back in the game.

Universal and Paramount need to get on the ball, though. The releases that have come out on both formats since Christmas have been pretty poor.
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post #110 of 111 Old 01-26-2008, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GmanAVS View Post

but it is to late to stem the Blu tide unless Toshiba can get Disney or Fox to go TL51 purple (and that is a pipe dream right now)

No my friend it is not too late.
It's just some people are out making a lot of noise to persuade you as if it were.

The Blu-ray 'project hydras' are out in force at this moment trying to convince everyone that that is the case but it doesn't make it so.

Even by the BDA's recently released numbers in almost 2 years Blu-ray has sold 6 million discs to HD DVD's almost 3 million discs.

But the total annual movie disc market was 750 million+ last year alone.

Blu-ray don't even have 1% of the total movie disc market.

It's ahead of HD DVD, for now, that's true but by any credible assessment we are talking 'drop in the ocean' stuff here, not a tsunami tidal wave of anything.

This is all so very early in the day
(it's simply a fact that high def remains largely invisible to the mass-market - and even HD TVs are a minority of the total TVs out there in private hands).

HD DVD is on the right strategy now, cut prices and get the hardware out there to lure buyers with deals later.
It's not only sensible but surely sane to accept the fact that SD DVD will continue to be (by far) the biggest seller for years to come and to position HD DVD to compliment it.

HD DVD also has the ace in that the Twin disc & (to a lesser extent) the combo ensure no-one gets left behind as the move to high def happens.

The Blu-ray side pretend that doesn't matter but of course it does.
Anyone who ever took a movie round to a friend or family member's house knows it matters
(especially if it's someone almost guaranteed never to bother with high def).

Patience guys, when you're this up close to it all it can seem like things ought to be happening yesterday but in the wider market it's not like that at all.

Who remembers that Betamax was once believed to be the winner of the 1st video format war cos it had the most support from the movie studios?
They will end up following the money, regardless of their initial positioning, whatever happens.

HD DVD has plenty of practical reasons left yet for it to take off.
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post #111 of 111 Old 01-26-2008, 10:31 AM
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i see this thread has run its course also.

larry

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