Turntable and phono preamps advice - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 10 Old 07-13-2010, 03:10 AM - Thread Starter
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I have recently got a new belt for a turntable I have at home. The turntable is old, it is a kenwood p100, and it was hardly ever used. Slowly getting back into the vinyl scene, I only have a few vinyl albums (so my only chance is to find many i am interested in off Ebay).

ANyways, with the albums I already have, a curious thing, as I notice that when I connected the turntable to my amp, I had to use alot more volume gain just to hear it.

Now this turntable has a switch that allows you to choose to use either the phono input, or a aux input on the amp.

I tried both methods and yet the volume was just alot lower (I think I needed a 15db volume increase when comparing to using the CD player).

Is this probably because I would need a external phono preamp?
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post #2 of 10 Old 07-13-2010, 05:43 AM
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Use the EQ = ON function. It has the preamp built in. Output with the stock cartridge is 200mV, so it'll need a little volume knob to get some decent level.

This is assuming it is not broken.
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post #3 of 10 Old 07-13-2010, 10:20 AM - Thread Starter
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The unit is still fine, I know I don't need a new stylus as it has been packaged away for many many years lol. And was hardly ever used.
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post #4 of 10 Old 07-13-2010, 11:07 AM
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Phono preamps, internal or external, generally don't output as strong a signal as typical line-level components (e.g., CD players), so what you're experiencing isn't unusual.

If you can't explain how it works, you can't say it doesn't.—The High-End Creed

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post #5 of 10 Old 07-13-2010, 03:32 PM - Thread Starter
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ok then cool. So in order for the volume level to be at a simialr level to a CD, then one would need some kind of signal booster of some kind if you don't want to crank up the volume high on the amp then?
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post #6 of 10 Old 07-13-2010, 09:32 PM
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Even that may not eliminate the difference entirely. Most CDs are overly "hot" and compressed, in that they are tweaked so that every sound is as loud as possible (as loud as can be encoded into a 16-bit digital sample). The song you're listening to from CD may include whispering or other portions that are intended to be soft, but they'll be made as loud as every other section of the song in a vain attempt to make the entire thing sound "loud".

This is referred to often as the "loudness wars". It results in an unnatural and fatiguing sound, and can actually cause peak sound levels to be lower because you'll be unable to turn up the volume as far. It's hated by most audiophiles, and is increasingly being recognized by others as damaging the quality of music (but not recognized as quickly as we'd like!). This overly-compressed, loud sound is also found in most television and radio broadcasts, so those will often seem 'louder' than LPs, too.

Most vinyl LPs pre-date the "loudness wars", and therefore don't suffer from this crazy push to make every note of every song sound as loud as possible. This, IMO, is the primary reason why the LP versions of classic rock albums often sound better than the CD versions -- especially when compared to recent "remastered" CD versions of those albums, which are often worse than the original CDs.

On your original topic -- when you tested the turntable with the switch in the "phono" position, I assume that you connected the turntable to a phono input on your receiver/pre-amp? (i.e. you didn't leave it connected to a CD, tape, or other aux input?). If you instead left it connected to a CD/tape/aux input with the turntable's built-in phono pre-amp disabled, then the overall volume will be extremely low and bass/treble response will also be off.
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post #7 of 10 Old 07-14-2010, 08:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Odin_Thor View Post

Slowly getting back into the vinyl scene, I only have a few vinyl albums (so my only chance is to find many i am interested in off Ebay).

Found this thread looking for pre-amp advice, but wanted to comment on this line. Ebay is far from your only chance for acquiring records, and potentially one of the worst options. Try thrift stores, yard sales, record stores (many still exist and have tons of vinyl), the old lady across the street, etc. I haven't bought much in the last few years, but amassed a collection of 1500+ records in a period of 5 years of which maybe 20-30 came from eBay. Unless you trust the seller it's easy to get screwed on condition descriptions, and why pay for shipping when you can get out there and find it yourself. If you're interests are specific rare norwegian speed jazz albums with pressings of less than 500 then it's a viable place to shop, and good luck with that. But any once common rock and roll record, for instance, you should be able to find within a half hour radius of your house. For me, getting out there and finding records while discovering new ones was the fun of it.

I also realized after writing this and looking at your user name that you might not be in the US, where it is easy to find a bunch of records. If not, then I apologize and don't mean to rub in how much vinyl we still have that is easily accessible.
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post #8 of 10 Old 07-14-2010, 02:09 PM - Thread Starter
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You are right ras, I don't live in the US, I live in Australia.

Skriefal, you do make some very good points in regards to CDs and the loudness war. I was reading up on it not too long ago. ANd I too have heard that these so called remastered CDs can be worse than the original ones.

ANd yes my connections were correct, I set the switch accordingly as said in the manual, and connect to the appropiate inputs.

Either way they both sounded similar (I am using my Yamaha 663). Don't have a proper stereo amp so have to make do. In saying that, I still think from the comparisons to some of my cd versions, the vinyl is better. And one of my other friends who has heaps of music collection, (both vinyl and cds), he too has found at times the vinyl to be the superior format.

I was at his place one day, and listened to a cd remaster of an album he has, comapred to his original tape version, the tape version was better.
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post #9 of 10 Old 03-13-2013, 09:38 AM
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Hello can you help me I recently bought a Kenwood P-100 turntable but belt has snapped and needs to be replaced. Can you tell me were you got yours from as I am having a bit of difficulty in getting one.
Thanks
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post #10 of 10 Old 03-13-2013, 10:08 AM
 
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Old thread ressurected?

Great info though about vinyl and digital

Smuffy, did you try google? I found a belt right here in about 10 seconds

http://www.lptunes.com/Kenwood-P-100-P-100-P100-turntable-belt-p/kwdp100.htm
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