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post #211 of 224 Old 01-05-2011, 04:08 AM
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Originally Posted by JorgeLopez11 View Post

Thanks Jose. I've just downloaded the paper. I'll go through it and come back with comments.

Hi Jorge, that paper only tells what would happen if there were any jitter.

SPDIF signal fed into Benchmark using a BestBuy cheap DVD player:

SPDIF signal fed into Benchmark using a Hiface:


I think it's quite obvious that the claim "jitter free" isn't true when using a BestBuy DVD player, even with Hiface there's a little bit of jitter.

Those measurements and more will be soon available at http://www.mundohi-fi.com (only in Spanish, sorry)
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post #212 of 224 Old 01-05-2011, 05:18 AM
 
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Originally Posted by jose almagro View Post

At the test made by Matrix both sounded the same for me but I made more DBT, OK?

Now that you've mentioned for the first time here about the additional DBT, can you post more on the details of it, i.e., what was the result and how was the room condition and ...etc.?

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I know an awarded sound engineer who told me "my work is dealing with blind tests every day". Of course he didn't mean surrounded by guys dressed in black trying to make your ass look like a Japan flag.

I was asking you if DBT is part of formal ear training method used in audio industry.
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post #213 of 224 Old 01-06-2011, 05:52 AM
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Originally Posted by geekhd View Post

Now that you've mentioned for the first time here about the additional DBT, can you post more on the details of it, i.e., what was the result and how was the room condition and ...etc.?

I'm not submitting a paper about that, I don't want to demonstrate anything and specially I don't want an endless argument so I'd agree I was very lucky those days if it makes you happy.

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I was asking you if DBT is part of formal ear training method used in audio industry

I don't know, I don't belong to audio industry. My field is NVH and of course we work with DBT and that's getting easier with auralizations, anyway it's not easy and it's time consuming.
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post #214 of 224 Old 01-06-2011, 09:14 AM
 
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Originally Posted by jose almagro View Post

I'm not submitting a paper about that, I don't want to demonstrate anything and specially I don't want an endless argument

Then why mention it from the first place?

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I don't know, I don't belong to audio industry. My field is NVH and of course we work with DBT and that's getting easier with auralizations, anyway it's not easy and it's time consuming.

So, your assumption, "DBTs are a nice way of training your ears" was to marginalize the value of DBT on picking out the audio components. Why, because the results didn't agree with your view? And your view came from a secret DBT you've done on your own? Are there other level matched DBTs of DACs that contradict Matrix's results?
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post #215 of 224 Old 01-06-2011, 09:16 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jose almagro View Post

I think it's quite obvious that the claim "jitter free" isn't true when using a BestBuy DVD player, even with Hiface there's a little bit of jitter.

Are you saying that the difference is audible to you or someone else?
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post #216 of 224 Old 01-06-2011, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geekhd View Post

Then why mention it from the first place?


So, your assumption, "DBTs are a nice way of training your ears" was to marginalize the value of DBT on picking out the audio components. Why, because the results didn't agree with your view? And your view came from a secret DBT you've done on your own? Are there other level matched DBTs of DACs that contradict Matrix's results?

Nice detective work, Sherlock. Any other conclusions you want to jump to?
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post #217 of 224 Old 01-07-2011, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by geekhd View Post

Then why mention it from the first place?

I was invited to explain my opinion about an acoustic report (written by me) and being completely objective:

1) Frequency response is far from any recommendation
2) Reverberation times are far from any recommendation
3) Early reflections aren't terrible but doesn't comply with EBU 3276
4) Background noise was NC 40, 25 dB higher than EBU recommendations even asking people to shut up while I measured!!!

http://tech.ebu.ch/docs/techreview/trev_274-hoeg.pdf
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Background noise
The sound pressure level (SPL) of the continuous
background noise should not exceed the ISO
Noise Rating Curve, NR 15, and should preferably
not exceed NR 10. It should not be perceptibly
impulsive, cyclical or tonal in nature.

If you can't stand me saying that DBT was rubbish how can I tell you I found differences in several tests? I just want to avoid reading that one of the devices was broken, the levels weren't matched, 6 over 6 aren't enough or that I'm lying. I prefer to say you are right and everything sounds the same.
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post #218 of 224 Old 01-07-2011, 01:30 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jose almagro View Post

I was invited to explain my opinion about an acoustic report (written by me) and being completely objective:

1) Frequency response is far from any recommendation
2) Reverberation times are far from any recommendation
3) Early reflections aren't terrible but doesn't comply with EBU 3276
4) Background noise was NC 40, 25 dB higher than EBU recommendations even asking people to shut up while I measured!!!

http://tech.ebu.ch/docs/techreview/trev_274-hoeg.pdf


If you can't stand me saying that DBT was rubbish how can I tell you I found differences in several tests? I just want to avoid reading that one of the devices was broken, the levels weren't matched, 6 over 6 aren't enough or that I'm lying. I prefer to say you are right and everything sounds the same.

You seem to have misunderstood the group here or have a misconceptions about them. I and others have seen / read about DBT of DACs with same results (undistinguishable) here and there. I would be (I'm sure others too) delighted to read about level matched DBT of DACs which produced contrasting results. Please share some details with us.
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post #219 of 224 Old 01-08-2011, 10:03 AM
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Guys, I need your help. Anyone here who can chime in and provide me a cd player or transport with the lowest jitter rate? I am planning to go the route of a two-box system transport and external dac. Probably, sub $1,000 cdp or transport. ty.
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post #220 of 224 Old 01-08-2011, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catmonv View Post

Guys, I need your help. Anyone here who can chime in and provide me a cd player or transport with the lowest jitter rate? I am planning to go the route of a two-box system transport and external dac. Probably, sub $1,000 cdp or transport. ty.

Here's a list of a few compared. Seems a Sony Blu Ray player has lower jitter than many high end players:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...ghlight=jitter
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post #221 of 224 Old 01-08-2011, 04:41 PM
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Quote:


WilliamZX11 Quote:

Here's a list of a few compared. Seems a Sony Blu Ray player has lower jitter than many high end players:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...ghlight=jitter

TY. This helped a lot and made my research done right now.
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post #222 of 224 Old 01-08-2011, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catmonv View Post

Guys, I need your help. Anyone here who can chime in and provide me a cd player or transport with the lowest jitter rate? I am planning to go the route of a two-box system transport and external dac. Probably, sub $1,000 cdp or transport. ty.

I'm just curious catmonv; why did you decide the tail-end of a discussion about the $5k Berkeley Audio DAC, was the right place to post about a sub-$1k transport?

Forget the prices; why come out of the blue, and ask about transports...in the middle of a post about a particular DAC?

CD

Music is a moral law. It gives soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination, and charm and gaiety to life and to everything. -Plato
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post #223 of 224 Old 01-08-2011, 06:47 PM
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Sent PM to you CD
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post #224 of 224 Old 08-21-2013, 09:47 AM
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Where are those comparisons on the amps. With a choice of Macintosh or Bystrom. It depends on what music I like to listen to. I believe the choice is more subjective.
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