Marantz CD6004 HDCD decoding? - AVS Forum

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marko7's Avatar marko7
01:56 PM Liked: 10
post #1 of 13
03-11-2013 | Posts: 29
Joined: Sep 2011
I have a Marantz CD6004. I would like to know whether it can decode HDCD discs (properly). Does anyone know?

Thanks
glangford's Avatar glangford
04:06 PM Liked: 55
post #2 of 13
03-11-2013 | Posts: 1,806
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The marantz website says nothing about it so, I'm guessing no, it probably just reads HDCD as a 44.1/16 bit recording.
JA Fant's Avatar JA Fant
11:16 PM Liked: 65
post #3 of 13
03-13-2013 | Posts: 614
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Either in the owner's manual or on the cd player itself, there will be the HDCD logo.
Selden Ball's Avatar Selden Ball
11:36 AM Liked: 490
post #4 of 13
03-15-2013 | Posts: 7,575
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When a player can't decode HDCD, it needs to be decoded in the receiver or pre/pro that it's connected to. Unfortunately, however, HDCD support seems to be unavailable in most current generation audio equipment. A few universal players, like those from Oppo, and some dedicated CD players can still decode it, but I don't know of any almost-reasonably-priced current model receiver or pre/pro that does, not even the top-of-the-line Marantz AV8801. frown.gif
arnyk's Avatar arnyk
11:35 AM Liked: 1178
post #5 of 13
03-19-2013 | Posts: 14,387
Joined: Oct 2002
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

When a player can't decode HDCD, it needs to be decoded in the receiver or pre/pro that it's connected to. Unfortunately, however, HDCD support seems to be unavailable in most current generation audio equipment. A few universal players, like those from Oppo, and some dedicated CD players can still decode it, but I don't know of any almost-reasonably-priced current model receiver or pre/pro that does, not even the top-of-the-line Marantz AV8801. frown.gif

It seems like one approach would be to decode the HDCD on a PC using a decoder program such as:

http://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_hdcd

or

http://www.roomyshare.com/File/bfk808lao09pg#

and then burn a regular CD from it.
SoNic67's Avatar SoNic67
03:37 PM Liked: 29
post #6 of 13
03-19-2013 | Posts: 722
Joined: Aug 2005
That will do nothing good, since the 20 bit HDCD extension, burned on a CD will be truncated to 16 bit.

Now, true, some of the current HDCD recordings (like Lady Antebellum - Own The Night) don't use the range extension of HDCD, they record the CD trough HDCD mixer board just for the filters quality. But that is just a particular case, not the norm.

PS: Denon older top-line CD/DVD players and AVR's have also HDCD deconding.
JA Fant's Avatar JA Fant
05:41 PM Liked: 65
post #7 of 13
03-19-2013 | Posts: 614
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IME, both older NAD & ROTEL gear had the most success w/ HDCD.
arnyk's Avatar arnyk
07:37 AM Liked: 1178
post #8 of 13
03-20-2013 | Posts: 14,387
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoNic67 View Post

That will do nothing good, since the 20 bit HDCD extension, burned on a CD will be truncated to 16 bit.

Now, true, some of the current HDCD recordings (like Lady Antebellum - Own The Night) don't use the range extension of HDCD, they record the CD trough HDCD mixer board just for the filters quality. But that is just a particular case, not the norm.

PS: Denon older top-line CD/DVD players and AVR's have also HDCD deconding.

You've missed the point. Dithering HDCD recordings down to 16 bits can be easily predicted to do no sonic harm to them.

Ever heard of a level-matched DBT showing that HDCD actually made an audible difference with real world music?

Neither did I.
glangford's Avatar glangford
09:47 AM Liked: 55
post #9 of 13
03-20-2013 | Posts: 1,806
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But then why would he need to decode it and burn a regular cd? A regular cd player will still play the hdcd without decoding the extra 4 bits. The process you suggest is not necessary.
arnyk's Avatar arnyk
10:51 AM Liked: 1178
post #10 of 13
03-20-2013 | Posts: 14,387
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glangford View Post

But then why would he need to decode it and burn a regular cd? A regular cd player will still play the hdcd without decoding the extra 4 bits. The process you suggest is not necessary.

The HDCD is not decoded exactly right when you play it on a regular CD player. What I'm suggesting is decode it exactly right, and then remove the low order bits in a way that preserves low level detail, which a Red Book player by definition can't do.
SoNic67's Avatar SoNic67
04:40 PM Liked: 29
post #11 of 13
03-28-2013 | Posts: 722
Joined: Aug 2005
The only way to decode it 'right' is to play on a HDCD enabled CD/DVD/AVR player. Like Denon DCM-380, DVD-2910, 2930, 3930, AVR-3805 from my collection (just an example)...
Sure, the best way is to use a player with the 'official' PCM100 filter, but those tend to be expensive today.

Foobar2000 can decode it from any wav or flac file but it is not known how accurate it is since kode54 didn't disclose how he got the algorithm. WMP can decode it from CD's only (and since MS owns the HDCD logo now so it might be correct). But running those via crappy internal on-board sound card is an exercise in futility.
arnyk's Avatar arnyk
06:58 AM Liked: 1178
post #12 of 13
03-29-2013 | Posts: 14,387
Joined: Oct 2002
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoNic67 View Post

The only way to decode it 'right' is to play on a HDCD enabled CD/DVD/AVR player. Like Denon DCM-380, DVD-2910, 2930, 3930, AVR-3805 from my collection (just an example)...
Sure, the best way is to use a player with the 'official' PCM100 filter, but those tend to be expensive today.

Foobar2000 can decode it from any wav or flac file but it is not known how accurate it is since kode54 didn't disclose how he got the algorithm. WMP can decode it from CD's only (and since MS owns the HDCD logo now so it might be correct). But running those via crappy internal on-board sound card is an exercise in futility.

The fallacy here is the idea that something has to be flawed if we don't know exactly how it works.

Now if you had a technical test or a reliable listening test to back up your claim...
SoNic67's Avatar SoNic67
02:00 PM Liked: 29
post #13 of 13
03-29-2013 | Posts: 722
Joined: Aug 2005
No, you have to prove that the unknown/reverse engineered source of that app is working as described by HDCD specs.

I don't need to prove the negative of something that you said in the first place.
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