Just got into Vinyl and boy am I happy! - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 245 Old 06-20-2007, 06:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Well I just pulled my fathers old LP's out of a closet and hooked up his old turntable to my new receiver and all I can say is wow! The difference on my home theatre setup compared to MP3's is amazing. I really believe that most people today have no idea what music is supposed to sound like and are seriously missing out.

No real purpose to this post other than that I find it funny that even with the thousands of dollars of high tech equipment in my HT room and the 40 year old Garrard turntable and LP's hold there own.

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post #2 of 245 Old 06-20-2007, 10:29 AM
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wait till you try a MC cartridge with a good rigid arm and a separate phono preamp.

what you hear from speakers is the sound being analog. nothing wrong with using analog as source all the way

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post #3 of 245 Old 06-20-2007, 12:20 PM
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We all know that MP3s are inferior. You're not doing a fair comparison here.

"Vintage" is good for wine, not for A/V equipment.

-Dan D.
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post #4 of 245 Old 06-20-2007, 01:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonoMan View Post

We all know that MP3s are inferior. You're not doing a fair comparison here.

He'd probably have the same observation versus CDs.

There's a reason why vinyl is still around and has made a comeback. A lot of stuff is being reissued on high-quality vinyl.

For example:

http://www.elusivedisc.com/

http://store.acousticsounds.com/store.cfm?section=none

Both these sites sell a lot of vinyl.

I bet THIS sounds awesome. A 30th Anniversary "Aja" remaster that's only available on vinyl.

(I can only hope and pray that a multichannel, hirez version is forthcoming. I see that Elliot Scheiner is invovled in this remaster.)

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post #5 of 245 Old 06-20-2007, 03:21 PM
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Elusive Disc is a great site! I just picked up 3 Built to Spill limited edition LP's that were just released yesterday and they arrived at my doorstep this morning! Now to get a nice turntable... Any suggestions in the $300-600 range? I've looked at offerings by Music Hall, Rega, and Pro-Ject.

Thanks,

J.

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post #6 of 245 Old 06-20-2007, 03:23 PM
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MP3s are lossy and there's no telling how badly compressed yours were until, well, you tell us. Use a better compressed format such as Ogg Vorbis or even better, something lossless like FLAC and then see if you can tell a difference.
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post #7 of 245 Old 06-20-2007, 03:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EcceCapsa View Post

MP3s are lossy and there's no telling how badly compressed yours were until, well, you tell us. Use a better compressed format such as Ogg Vorbis or even better, something lossless like FLAC and then see if you can tell a difference.

Of course you can tell a difference. Vinyl has a particular sound that NOTHING else has.

"All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it."
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post #8 of 245 Old 06-20-2007, 11:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sivadselim View Post

Of course you can tell a difference. Vinyl has a particular sound that NOTHING else has.

Like pop-pop-click-pop-scratch-skip-pop-pop... I for sure do not miss that when playing a CD/SACD.
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post #9 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 05:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Well MP3's may not be a fair comparison but I just compared Pink Floyds "The Wall" on CD to the Vinyl version and ill take the vinyl version. This is one of my favorite albums and even though I have listened to the CD hundreds of times the vinyl was like a whole new experience. I heard things I never new where there.

And as far as the clicking and popping go I think people exagerate how bad it is. The LP's I am using are in very good condition and you barely hear any static or skipping.

One quick question:

There is a very low humming noise when the records are playing. Its something I can live with but can anybody help me out with any ideas how to eliminate it? The ground is connected with a clean connection and thats the only thing I knew to check so any help is apreciated. Thanks.

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post #10 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 07:06 AM
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You might be hearing the motor noise/vibration being picked up by the needle. I'm not familiar with your Garrard, but judging by its age, it's probably not designed the same way that modern higher-performance turntables are. Most are designed so that the motor is either isolated from the platter and drive system or at least decoupled or suspended so that there's little or no vibration.

It might be some sort of ground loop issue, though it sounds like you've explored that possibility. It might also be your receiver or AVR. Some of the less expensive gear doesn't fare well with turntables...

If you're really enjoying the vinyl, it might make sense to shell out a couple hundred bucks on a decent entry-level turntable. I'm still up in the air as to which one I'll purchase, but I'll certainly post once I make up my mind.

J.

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post #11 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 08:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the help. I am thinking about picking up a new turntable now that I have heard some of these records. I dont want to spend to much but any suggestions on some decent entry level turntables.

Also I have about 10 unopened needles and about 3 unopened cartridges for the garrard. Are the needles diffrent for every player or would I be able to use these in a new turntable. They where pretty high end for there time and I would like to use them if possible. Trying to learn everything I can about this so thanks again for the help.

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post #12 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 08:37 AM
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Not sure about your needles and cartridges, but here are 3 pretty good looking entry-level offerings in the $250-350 range: Music Hall's MMF-2, Pro-Ject's Debut III, and Rega's P1. I actually just pulled the trigger on a Music Hall MMF-5 for just under $600 shipped. General consensus from the places I called around to seemed to be that the MMF-5 was the choice player in the $500-700 range. FWIW, the 3 entry level tables that I inquired about seem pretty comparable. The Pro-Ject and Music Hall are made in the same factory, and the Rega didn't seem to come out on top of the other two tables.

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post #13 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 08:43 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sivadselim View Post

He'd probably have the same observation versus CDs.

No, he wouldn't. He only heard an improvement because mp3 is an inferior medium. CDs are much better than vinyl. To prove it, record the best LP you can find (using the best turntable you can find) onto CD. Now play it back. You will not hear a difference because CD captures every nuance.
The illusion that LPs can sound better results from the fact they they are sometimes mastered better.
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post #14 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 09:03 AM
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Sounds like a good conversation for a new thread...

J.

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post #15 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PULLIAMM View Post

No, he wouldn't. He only heard an improvement because mp3 is an inferior medium. CDs are much better than vinyl. To prove it, record the best LP you can find (using the best turntable you can find) onto CD. Now play it back. You will not hear a difference because CD captures every nuance.
The illusion that LPs can sound better results from the fact they they are sometimes mastered better.

Do you even own ears?
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post #16 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 09:24 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Harrypt View Post

Do you even own ears?

Better than yours, obviously. Try the experiment, then maybe you will have something useful to say.
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post #17 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 09:28 AM - Thread Starter
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JasonColeman thanks for the information. I think ill look into your suggestions but unfortunatly ill have to do with what I have for now as I just spent a bunch of money on my new reciever and must pay some bills first before i go spend more money on a new toy..

As for the debate: to each his own I guess but for me so far with comparing the LP's to the CD version i feel the LP just sounds better. I dont know how to describe it but the LP just sounds more like the artist is actually standing in my room.

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post #18 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 09:46 AM
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What new receiver did you pick up?

BTW, there's always a naysayer or party-pooper in every crowd...just enjoy what you're enjoying and leave it at that. Don't feel the need to justify your appreciation to others...especially when they're just not hearing it.

J.

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post #19 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 10:35 AM - Thread Starter
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I just picked up the Yamaha RX-V661. It did wonders for my home theater setup. In fact it happened to have a phono input which is what got me started on the vinyl kick as I figured always good to try new things.

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post #20 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 10:59 AM
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Vinyl is fun, bottom-line. Enjoy! I like to I keep my old NAD 314 integrated around just for the phono stage, plays well with my Rega P2.
Funny how phono inputs seem to be coming back...don't recall seeing them for a while. A backlash against low-resolution, 16/44 digital, perhaps?

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post #21 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 11:17 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Gilvey View Post

Vinyl is fun, bottom-line. Enjoy!

Absolutely! I agree with that 100%, and it is a valid reason for getting into vinyl. Just don't claim that it sounds better. (I know it doesn't because I used to have a big collection of LPs before CDs made them obsolete.)
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post #22 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 11:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Another quick question for you guys. Does anybody have a website where I can learn how to set the tracking? I know it may be diffrent for every turntable but I am hoping I can get an idea of what to do since as of now I have just been kind of winging it. Thanks.

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post #23 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellsya69 View Post

Thanks for the help. I am thinking about picking up a new turntable now that I have heard some of these records. I dont want to spend to much but any suggestions on some decent entry level turntables.

Also I have about 10 unopened needles and about 3 unopened cartridges for the garrard. Are the needles diffrent for every player or would I be able to use these in a new turntable. They where pretty high end for there time and I would like to use them if possible. Trying to learn everything I can about this so thanks again for the help.

At one point the Garrard had tremendous support, especially in the UK, with replacement plinths and upgraded arms readily available.

I don't know what country you're in, but if you're in the EU look for a Rega Planar 3 with the RB300 arm. Also consider a Dual 505, once the VW bug of turntables, but the Rega is IMO better overall.
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post #24 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PULLIAMM View Post

.......................... before CDs made them obsolete.

So, what do we have to do to convince you that there is a thriving, extremely vibrant, vinyl "scene" occurring right now? And it's been occurring for several years, now, whatever the reason. Call it nostalgia if you want, but, to me, there's obviously something more than that that's going on. Vinyl is NOT obsolete.

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post #25 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 11:48 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sivadselim View Post

So, what do we have to do to convince you that there is a thriving, extremely vibrant, vinyl "scene" occurring right now? And it's been occurring for several years, now, whatever the reason. Call it nostalgia if you want, but, to me, there's obviously something more than that that's going on. Vinyl is NOT obsolete.

Oh, I certainly know that there is such a "scene", but so what? The preceding observation that vinyl is fun is sufficient to explain that.
What is funny to me is that young people who grew up with CDs are "discovering" vinyl, which was the best medium available when I was their age, and treating it as a revelation. I remember what a huge improvement in SQ CDs were, so I know better. It is like kids who grew up with modern cars "discovering" the Model T.
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post #26 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PULLIAMM View Post

.............................. but so what?

Oh, yeah. Your MO. Let's just summarily dismiss it. "I'm not into it, so therefore it must be $h!t."

"All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it."
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post #27 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 12:08 PM
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There are classic systems that can be had for relatively little coin nowadays; I'm talking full systems from scratch if anyone is interested. Ex:

Dual 505 - NAD 302 - KEF Coda
Rega Planar 3 - Naim Naitt - Linn Kan

up to stuff like

Oracle Delphi - Meridian pre - Nakamichi Stasis PA-7 power - B&W 801FS and so on.

I think that those rediscovering a massive vinyl collection ought to just invest in the best table they can immediately, while those starting off with $1 records at swap meets and club events could look into an entry level table until they figure out if it's their game or not. $50 can get anyone started, just don't put rare collectible vinyl on a low end table.
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post #28 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 12:08 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sivadselim View Post

Oh, yeah. Your MO. Let's just summarily dismiss it. "I'm not into it, so therefore it must be $h!t."

Learn to read with comprehension. My"so what" referred to the fact that the existence of a scene does not prove that vinyl sounds better, any more than the existence of true believers proves that UFOs are real. (There is a scene of people playing music on old Casio toy keyboards. That does not mean that they sound better than todays professional keyboards.)
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post #29 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 12:30 PM
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Just wondering, PULLMYFINGER:

Is your current audio system better than what you had 20 years ago? Yes.

Have you EVER had a quality turntable/cartridge connected to your current system so that you could hear what a brand-new LP may sound like? No.

So how can you come to any meaningful conclusion about the merits of vinyl in 2007?

I mean, you just said today:

Quote:
Originally Posted by PULLIAMM View Post

One of the few things that just about everyone here agrees on is that auditioning is the only way to know what you like.

So practice what you preach. You really shouldn't offer opinions upon that which you have no experience, whatsoever.

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post #30 of 245 Old 06-21-2007, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PULLIAMM View Post

Better than yours, obviously. Try the experiment, then maybe you will have something useful to say.

Care to put your money where your mouth is?
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