Originally Posted by armystud0911
Zjason, Pioneer receivers are known to have very low voltage outputs, several people here and all over the internet have run into this problem, so much that they have entire threads dedicated to solving and modifying devices like the ART cleanbox in order to get the most from their amps. Just last night I ran into this very problem, though I hadn't previously. I was outputting from my oppo DVD player using the 8 channel out (it is made to be used like this as it has a volume control and full calibration for each channel such as distance, level, ect.) and I could not get nearly enough juice into my EP2500, the speakers were doing fine, but the sub amp was clearly not getting enough voltage, I had max volume (or min attenuation, however you want to look at it) on everything and the sub just wasn't doing much. My plate amp sub had to be turned down considerably though when driven from the same source. All other sources I have used don't have a problem driving pro amps, but this one clearly did.
Army: Could you reference a specific model Pioneer and what is the Pioneer's specification for voltage output from the pre-outs and LFE?
On the thread about the QSC PLX-3402 fan mod you made this comment in response to Penn and his crazy voltage issue:You seem to be one of the only people with those issues, most of us are fine, I have used 4 receivers and more computers than I can count on several different pro amps from EP2500's to PLX series and never had a problem once before, amps seem to clip well before maximum gain is reached.
So you have proven your four receivers don't have voltage problems. How is your Oppo through your receiver now the receivers voltage problem?
I am not arguing the fact that people have problems, I am arguing the fact that most receivers cannot output enough voltage, that is simply not true.
Now whether the receiver IS outputting enough voltage is a completely different argument.
I tried to explain to Penn that running efficient speakers (mains, center, surround) say 89 db and inefficient subs, can result in an imbalanced system and require a boost, but not because the receiver can't output enough volts. It is a result of that specific setup is not allowing it.
Feeding even 10 watts to an 89db speaker will result in about 95db of SPL in a small room. At this setting on my AVR volume control, my sub output may be only 10%.
If my pre-out is only rated for 2V, I might only get 0.2 V input to the amp.
Still, 0.2/1.25 = 16% of rated amplifer output. For an EP2500, that would be about 100 watts (16% of 650) and will depend on your sub if that is enough. If I am rated for 4V as most are, I would get only 200 watts and 32%.
Is that enough to get 95db from your sub - I do not know, it depends.
In this case, the speakers are increasing in volume much faster than the sub and you run out of room to increase the sub to where it needs to be.
You can prove this easily by disconnecting the speakers and leave only the sub and turn your receiver volume up all the way to 0 db. Does the sub keep getting louder?
Options - cut 10 db from LCR and surrounds, boost sub by 10db so you can raise the volume level and hence the output voltage.
OR use the cleanbox / level shifters to achieve balance between sub and other speakers.