Stripped Hurricane Nut Problem - AVS Forum
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Old 11-02-2008, 09:08 PM - Thread Starter
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The final assembly of my sub went well except for one issue. One of the screws won't tighten, and won't release. I'm assuming that either something is stripped, or the hurricane nut is spinning. The screw goes in but won't tighten, nor can I get it to release even with up pressure. The question is, should I risk cutting it off and try to repair it, or should I leave it be?
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Old 11-02-2008, 09:12 PM
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any pictures of sub so we can see the problem first hand?

couple of ideas, but better served if we can see what is up.

Good luck,

Robert


Hurricane nut or tnut?
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Old 11-02-2008, 09:23 PM
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Why are the hurricane nuts so popular over the T-nuts?

If you have access to the inside of the sub box, then why wouldn't you drill out the screw? That is what I would do, assuming I'm understanding your problem correctly. Then I would replace the hurricane nut with a T-Nut. There is no way a T-Nut is going to slip. At least not the type sold at Home Depot.

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Old 11-02-2008, 09:32 PM
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It's very risky working with sharp objects so close to the driver..

The only way to get at it is to remove the rest of the screws and then try to pry the driver slowly upwards so it can create pressure on the offending H-nut and maybe then you can get at it.Have someone give you a hand.

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Old 11-03-2008, 06:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CZ Eddie View Post

Why are the hurricane nuts so popular over the T-nuts?

If you have access to the inside of the sub box, then why wouldn't you drill out the screw? That is what I would do, assuming I'm understanding your problem correctly. Then I would replace the hurricane nut with a T-Nut. There is no way a T-Nut is going to slip. At least not the type sold at Home Depot.

I don't have access to the inside of the box because the speaker is in place and the one screw won't come out, nor will it tighten enough to exert pressure on the gasket.
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Old 11-03-2008, 06:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanaris View Post

It's very risky working with sharp objects so close to the driver..

The only way to get at it is to remove the rest of the screws and then try to pry the driver slowly upwards so it can create pressure on the offending H-nut and maybe then you can get at it.Have someone give you a hand.

I was thinking of cutting the head off with bolt cutters, and then removing the speaker. I could then try to remove the offending H-nut, and epxoy a new one in it's place. Otherwise I could fill the old holes, rotate the hole pattern and drill all new holes.
Major PITA.
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Old 11-03-2008, 06:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swampfox View Post

I was thinking of cutting the head off with bolt cutters, and then removing the speaker. I could then try to remove the offending H-nut, and epxoy a new one in it's place. Otherwise I could fill the old holes, rotate the hole pattern and drill all new holes.
Major PITA.

Hi Swampfox,

Don't mess around... drill it out or cut it off, whichever works best for the amount of screw exposed. Drilling out carefully usually leaves the least likelihood of damaging the driver. After you get it out, epoxy in a new one, and when you re-mount the driver, get that one threaded first. You could also switch that T-nut to a 3-4 prong one if the hurricane nut won't grab well enough. I would put a dab of epoxy on the inside of the flange in either case since it's DIY and not worth the hassle of it popping out again.

Anyone who hasn't had a T-Nut/insert of some kind cross thread and pop out just hasn't used them enough.

No type gives 100% confidence, although some methods are better than others for different materials. That said, I've seen two common faults which can be checked and vetted before you have the other 7 screws tightened (it's always the last one! ). Before dropping in the driver, thread a screw all the way through and back out of each T-Nut. While doing so, check that the screw sits straight up and down, and fix it if it doesn't. The T-Nut being slightly off is often what causes cross threading, which is the most common cause for popping out a T-Nut.

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Old 11-03-2008, 07:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CZ Eddie View Post

Why are the hurricane nuts so popular over the T-nuts?

If you have access to the inside of the sub box, then why wouldn't you drill out the screw? That is what I would do, assuming I'm understanding your problem correctly. Then I would replace the hurricane nut with a T-Nut. There is no way a T-Nut is going to slip. At least not the type sold at Home Depot.


You say there is NO WAY A T-NUT IS GOING TO SLIP.

What was this supposed to be? A joke

T-Nut teeth will bend ansh shave the wood/MDF/ply you name it when the thread is not great and forced.

Hurricane or T-Nut makes little difference.When the bolt is stuck,a metal on metal scraping puts alot more resistance you will get from wood.Plain logic







To answer the original question,you can "pull" the bot as far out as you can(stay safe) and with a Dremel cut off the head of the bolt. I used a plastic protector on the driver so the sparks do not fly on the sourrounds.

Small cutoff wheel works great.~5 minutes of slow cutting and its done.

I assume you take precautions as cutoff wheels can snap and fly,at the speed they turn you better have proper eye protection.

Ask yourself mortal , do you have as much displacement as me ? The answer is no unless you have a Windmere fan sub.
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Old 11-03-2008, 09:38 AM
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Been there, done that.

This is why I love wood screws w/ cap heads! How many times do you need to remove a driver? If you do, and the wood is messed up, just seal, and reclock the driver.

Lot's of low rent stuff stacked up into a medium rent pile.
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Old 11-03-2008, 10:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post

Hi Swampfox,



Anyone who hasn't had a T-Nut/insert of some kind cross thread and pop out just hasn't used them enough.

No type gives 100% confidence, although some methods are better than others for different materials. That said, I've seen two common faults which can be checked and vetted before you have the other 7 screws tightened (it's always the last one! ). Before dropping in the driver, thread a screw all the way through and back out of each T-Nut. While doing so, check that the screw sits straight up and down, and fix it if it doesn't. The T-Nut being slightly off is often what causes cross threading, which is the most common cause for popping out a T-Nut.

The sad part is that I used a bit of Gorilla glue on them when I inserted them, and I ran screws through them once the glue dried to verify that they worked.

I thank everyone for their help, I'll let you know how it turns out.
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Old 11-03-2008, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by digital desire View Post

Been there, done that.

This is why I love wood screws w/ cap heads! How many times do you need to remove a driver? If you do, and the wood is messed up, just seal, and reclock the driver.

You can also apply a little glue to the threads of the machine screws and into the pre-drilled hole, then run them in once before installing the driver and let the glue soak into the newly cut threads -- hardening them up considerably. Just make sure you use a glue that doesn't have a high bond strength on unlike materials, or the screws might be an even larger issue.
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Old 11-03-2008, 11:09 AM
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This is exactly what I feared would happen most when i built my subs and first decided to use T nuts, which I found out were pure crap. I wouldnt reccomend them period. I even gorilla glued mine and pressed them in the wood with a clamp and they would spin or pop out pretty easily. I knocked them all back out and used a peice of plywood instead. Here's a picture of what i did...

If you did this with an MDF box you would still be able to take the driver out multiple times before having to use new holes as the plywood wont strip out after one time.



The strip of plywood, before i put it in. It will go just like that only, on the inside.



The only reason i had to do this was because i had the holes drilled where my T nuts originally went so i had to make something else to screw to. I then Glued and screwed that peice in. Then to screw the driver in I used some stainless steel pan head metal screws because I couldnt find wood screws that were like that locally, The threads are a little finer but they still work great. Ive had to take one of the drivers out a few times already and they still tighten back up all the way no problem.
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Old 11-03-2008, 02:46 PM
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threaded inserts.

used them in my towers and subs.
i epoxy them in and then chase them with a tread chaser to remove any glue or burrs.
Gettin them in straight is the biggest thing.





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Old 11-03-2008, 02:55 PM
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i just tried using t-nuts for the 1st time. F those things. i'll stick to regular old wood screws. they work just fine.

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Old 11-03-2008, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by mcjasonb View Post

i just tried using t-nuts for the 1st time. F those things. i'll stick to regular old wood screws. they work just fine.

Amen to that. I have removed thousands of drivers from speakers. The only time I have ever had a problem with wood screws was on speakers using crappy particleboard (the kind that crumbles if you just look at it). With better particleboard, MDF, or plywood, I've not seen any issues using wood screws. I wish I could say the same for T-nuts! I have lost count of the number I've had to drill out because they became cross-threaded, or where I've had to go in from the amplifier hole opposite the woofer and vise-grip the loose nut so I can get the bolt out.

While I've never damaged a driver trying to remove a defective t-nut/bolt, it turns a 10 second operation into 20+ minutes, not fun.
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Old 11-03-2008, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swampfox View Post

The sad part is that I used a bit of Gorilla glue on them when I inserted them, and I ran screws through them once the glue dried to verify that they worked.

I thank everyone for their help, I'll let you know how it turns out.

That's ok, use a good epoxy and it will still hold with the Gorilla glue.
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Old 11-03-2008, 05:23 PM
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I third the wood screws. I've never had a problem in MDF with 'em.

If you predrill and use care, you can reuse without a problem.


Kg
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Old 11-03-2008, 06:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanaris View Post

The only way to get at it is to remove the rest of the screws and then try to pry the driver slowly upwards so it can create pressure on the offending H-nut and maybe then you can get at it. Have someone give you a hand.

This is what I would try, maybe you can get it out enough to cut it with a good pair of side cutters. In the future use the wood screws, if they for some reason strip thats what they make toothpics and wood glue for. Willy recommended the screws on my first sub and haven't looked back.

BR
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Old 11-03-2008, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

I third the wood screws. I've never had a problem in MDF with 'em.

If you predrill and use care, you can reuse without a problem.


Kg

and if you somehow strip out a hole you can always just rotate the driver and make new holes. as long as you have no leaks then you're all set.

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Old 11-03-2008, 06:38 PM
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I'm using the hurricane nuts myself but I too wasn't without issues.

I think socket cap screws is the way to go.
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Old 11-04-2008, 01:05 PM
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I think socket cap screws is the way to go.

Yeah, then you don't even have to get a screwdriver near the driver.
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Old 11-04-2008, 01:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by XanderMoser View Post

Yeah, then you don't even have to get a screwdriver near the driver.

Well . . . I cut off the screw with a dremel last PM. Having a cutting blade whirring at 16,000 RPM millimeters away from the driver makes a screwdriver look like a wet noodle.

The H nut fell loose as soon as the screw head was removed. I used epoxy to glue a new H nut in place. Hopefully I can get it all back together tonight.
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Old 11-04-2008, 03:00 PM
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I had issues with t-nuts as well. For my second box, I used the TC Sounds supplied hex head wood screws. Mounted an LMS and PR's with them, makes removal nice and easy, especially with a cordless drill and a hex bit.

Tuning change? 5 minutes tops. Take one PR out, and add or remove mass on both. Re-install and you are set.

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Old 11-04-2008, 03:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Repair made. It required the purchase of a new dremel tool.
Thanks for the suggestions.
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Old 11-04-2008, 04:45 PM
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You use a cutting blade and snip it off with the dremel?
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Old 11-04-2008, 07:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mynym View Post

You use a cutting blade and snip it off with the dremel?

Yes. First I tried to use a pair of bolt cutters, but it the bolt was too hard for any reasonable sized pair, and it seemed real risky to apply enough force. I was afraid that that would be the case, but I bought a dremel tool on my way home from work 'just in case'! I used a piece of cardboard as a shield and carefully cut the head off the screw with a cutting tool. Once the head was off the H-nut fell through. The remaining screw and nut were cross threaded so tight that they could have been welded together. I then placed a new H-nut in the hole but it was a real loose fit. I knew that was likely, but I had epoxy glue. I epoxied H nut to the baffle, clamped them, and let it cure for 24 hrs. I know epoxy is good for filling gaps, but I was somewhat concerned that it wouldn't hold.
Today I carefully seated the driver, and carefully inserted all the screws starting with the repair. All went well.
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Old 11-04-2008, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEAR View Post

You say there is NO WAY A T-NUT IS GOING TO SLIP.

What was this supposed to be? A joke

You're either a Moron, or you're Reading Comprehension disabled. Which is it??


There is a reason I have placed you on my ignore list. And one of these days I'll figure out how to do that at work also, where I don't log into AVS.



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Old 11-04-2008, 07:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

I third the wood screws. I've never had a problem in MDF with 'em.

If you predrill and use care, you can reuse without a problem.


Kg

+1. I have removed my driver with wood screws and MDF many times with no problems at all. I always figured that if I ever did strip out the MDF I could always then drill out the stripped hole and install some T-nuts if I had to. I have also heard that you can fix stripped out holes by breaking off some wooden match sticks or tooth picks in the hole then installing the screws back in, so the T-nuts may never be needed at all.
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Old 11-04-2008, 08:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Jerm357 View Post

+1. I have removed my driver with wood screws and MDF many times with no problems at all. I always figured that if I ever did strip out the MDF I could always then drill out the stripped hole and install some T-nuts if I had to. I have also heard that you can fix stripped out holes by breaking off some wooden match sticks or tooth picks in the hole then installing the screws back in, so the T-nuts may never be needed at all.

I hear ya. I'm going to look for good hex head wood screws. I've read of screws threaded for MDF, but don't know if it matters.
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Old 11-04-2008, 08:12 PM
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Now just think of doing these for a few days and having the same issue.

Never use them, use screws into the wood directly
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