My first real attempt with hornresp - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 05:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok , I have been trying to get my head wrapped around hornresp.
I would like for you guys who know it pretty well to check this out and inform me if I am going about this correctly.




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post #2 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 06:00 AM
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I am still kind of new at it too so good chance I am wrong, but your segments are going from large to small. I don't know if its calculating correctly when it does that.
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post #3 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 06:20 AM
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Looks very good, but it's a tapped TQWT (tapered quarter wavelength tube) rather than a tapped horn, because the flare goes the other direction. Might be interesting to see how it performs when built. Been thinking of using Hornresp for a similar design or two.

Compression ratio is high at the tap though (S3 - I'm getting above 6:1).
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post #4 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 06:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonnash View Post

I am still kind of new at it too so good chance I am wrong, but your segments are going from large to small. I don't know if its calculating correctly when it does that.

It is calculating correctly assuming the design is a reverse tapered pipe.

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post #5 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 06:36 AM
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like brandon said, your design is unconventional as it goes from large to small. as a result, who can say how it will perform.

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post #6 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 07:10 AM
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RB,

I'd say it's worth a shot at a build.... but the last length segment is maybe too small in length to fit the driver......

What's the excursion look like?

Good stuff!

JSS
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post #7 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

It is calculating correctly assuming the design is a reverse tapered pipe.

I see. I thought he was going for a tapped horn though.
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post #8 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 08:11 AM - Thread Starter
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post #9 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 08:12 AM - Thread Starter
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I was going after a tapped horn but like I said , this is really my first attempt with hornresp.
Please feel free to give me pointers.

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post #10 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 08:33 AM
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To make it into a tapped horn, just switch S1 and S4 around... then go into the loudspeaker wizard (or TH wizard if you still have the older Hornresp), set S2 to variable, and the program should correct the rest of the parameters. You can then tweak from there.

If leaving it the way it is now, try increasing S4 to 200 in the wizard, and then L12 and L34 to match at 20cm for easier folding... the graph doesn't look as nice, but the compression ratio at the front of the diaphragm is healthier.

Not sure if the impulse and phase response looks good for this type of design or not (someone with more knowledge than I will have to help there), but the response still looks pretty decent even if it is a little bowed in the middle.
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post #11 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 08:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the pointers wolf. Hornresp is a little harder for me to grasp than the normal box programs.

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post #12 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 08:50 AM
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You'll get the hang of it... all it takes is hours and hours of obsessing over the very smallest of horn tweaks
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post #13 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 10:05 AM - Thread Starter
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thats what I was afraid of lol

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post #14 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 10:19 AM
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First - if it is a TTQWT, take a look at the impulse response.

That should be more than enough to make you look at design alternatives.

Second - and far more significant - get the latest version of Hornresp - Major upgrade released today.

It is COOL - sliders are supported for all sorts of different designs now!!!
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post #15 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 10:21 AM - Thread Starter
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lilmike ,
I have the new version.
Now , I need to work on learning some more because I actually want a tapped horn.
Pointers and critique are most welcome.

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post #16 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 10:59 AM
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General pointers:

S1 = Sd/3
S4 = Sd * 2

Total length = (344/Fs)/4 X 100
L12 = driver diameter/2
L34 = adjustable for tuning
L23 = what's left

Seriously - mess around a bit with Hornresp, then read through the tutorials thread again - the basics are explained pretty well there in the first couple of posts, then we get into more detail. Things will make more sense as you work with it.

The new version is slick - makes lots of designs go much quicker.
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post #17 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 11:09 AM
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+1 on the tutorials... they help a lot. I did a little tweaking in there to see if I could come up with something, and the woofer does seem to have some potential, though like most woofers I try to model a TH with it could always be better in one way or another.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lilmike View Post

The new version is slick - makes lots of designs go much quicker.

The expanded loudspeaker wizard is a godsend... I was waiting for him to add more functionality to that. All it needs now is a folding wizard

Too bad I don't remember enough of my computer programming training, or my high school geometry training, or I'd try to whip one up myself.
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post #18 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 11:19 AM - Thread Starter
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The woofers I am trying to model for a tapped horn are the Eminence made buyouts that PE had a while back. This is the 12 inch DVC model which is sold out but the 10 inch is still available.
These were only 30 bucks so its a cheap way to play around with new alignments.

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post #19 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 12:06 PM - Thread Starter
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I am going back to re-read the tutorial and hopefully I will retain a little more of it.

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post #20 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 12:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok , after further reading I decided to try again. Of course this still needs plenty of tweaking but perhaps I am headed in the right direction.






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post #21 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 01:00 PM
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So do horns/tapered horns start to fall apart at 100-120hz and above?
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post #22 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stgdz View Post

So do horns/tapered horns start to fall apart at 100-120hz and above?

Tapped horns do. The trick is to get at least 95dB sensitivity in half space from the driver Fs to at least 100 Hz. It's not easy, and requires a very good match of driver and horn.

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post #23 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 01:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rightbrained View Post

Ok , after further reading I decided to try again. Of course this still needs plenty of tweaking but perhaps I am headed in the right direction.
---

Looks like a tapped horn this time. Now - try changing some things to kill that big dip in the response at 60 Hz. (I'd start with L34)

In most cases, dips are worse than peaks in the passband.
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post #24 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rightbrained View Post

Ok , after further reading I decided to try again. Of course this still needs plenty of tweaking but perhaps I am headed in the right direction.

Getting close to what I was doing with it earlier - that big dip at 60Hz can be tamed a bit too by increasing the mouth size (S4) to somewhere around 2000. But then it gets to be a real big horn.

L12 and L34 need some tweaking yet too. I find that I can just about tell when I have a good phase and impulse response by looking for the slinky effect in the wizard's response screen. If the waveform looks like it does a smooth boing-boing-boing down a set of imaginary stairs with no jaggies sticking out, I find when I go check the actual impulse and phase response it's getting close
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post #25 of 25 Old 02-02-2010, 01:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Cool , thanks for the tips. I am doing taxes right now so I will play with hornresp a little later.
I have 2 of these drivers so I may see what they will do together in one horn.

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