Wolfhorn SDX Design Finished - Page 10 - AVS Forum
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post #271 of 351 Old 06-12-2012, 05:18 PM
 
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Just watched your vid on a TH. Funneeeey wink.gif

Shoot me a note offline regarding your impedance measurement.....

deon.bearden@gmail.com
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post #272 of 351 Old 06-12-2012, 08:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Found a leak. A small one. Leak fixed, and here's the re-measured impedance graph:

wolfhornsdximpedancewithphase-leaksealed.jpg
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post #273 of 351 Old 12-06-2012, 07:15 PM - Thread Starter
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I've been meaning to do an X months later update on this build, so I might as well do it now. lilmike's comments about bracing in the F-20 thread reminded me I'm a bit late in doing this.

I am currently at 18 months with the sub, give or take a few days. Learned a few things since the build about what to do and not do when it comes to building these, and I wanted to share my thoughts about it.

First, I am upgrading this unit from "bracing optional" to "bracing strongly recommended." I have not had any problems with this bad boy due to the lack of bracing (and I've not heard of the other builders having any problems), but I do know it is not the sub it could be were it completely braced. The driver baffle does flex ever so slightly at high SPL. We don't want that if we are running this box at full blast consistently, thus my change in the recommendation. You can get by without it, mine is proof of that, but it's something I'd like potential builders to start considering. It won't give you its full potential without bracing.

Second, before you build one of these, take the factory gaskets off the SDX drivers first. Those gaskets promote leaks, as I found out the hard way. We don't want that. Best to use the duct seal putty alone.

That's it for now. It's still a low end monster in my home theater... I've lost a few more pieces of stone off the wall by the fireplace since I first fired it up biggrin.gif

To date, best SPL with both horns in use is still 124dB at listening position. I won't let them exceed that. I like having the ceiling above my head, thank you very much.
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post #274 of 351 Old 12-07-2012, 03:31 AM
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Oklahoma Wolf, really nice design and results!

Am I the only one who feels a little down seeing old Kryptonitewhite posts? I never met him but still sucks he's gone.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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post #275 of 351 Old 12-07-2012, 06:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, it's really sad the way it turned out for him frown.gif
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post #276 of 351 Old 12-10-2012, 04:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Just wanted to do a quick update with some bracing suggestions. If you do brace this horn, here's how I would currently do it:



Light colored wood is the vertical bracing, green is the horizontal bracing. Blue is removable horizontal bracing in the mouth... this will allow you to pull the brace out so you can install the drivers. I'd window the horizontal braces the same way the vertical ones are.

You don't have to do it exactly as I have... you can make it stronger as desired (like adding a removable vertical brace right at the mouth in front of the drivers, or corner bracing), but I wouldn't make it weaker. If you brace nothing else, get the mouth and throat segment done... in other words the areas on either side of the drivers. Don't add too much of it, or the response will deviate too much from the model. 1/2" plywood should be enough... that's all I used in my Tang Band horn IIRC.

Attached is the revised Sketchup file.

SDX 3L.zip 39k .zip file
Attached Files
File Type: zip SDX 3L.zip (39.3 KB, 17 views)
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post #277 of 351 Old 12-16-2012, 11:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Psst! Looks like Bob's put the SDX10 on sale for $139 for the holiday season: http://creativesound.ca/details.php?model=SDX10
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post #278 of 351 Old 01-21-2013, 08:00 AM
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Anyone else build one of these babies?

What happened to kryptonitewhite?

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post #279 of 351 Old 01-21-2013, 10:48 AM
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Unfortunately KW took his own life.

RIP bud

dbl

Let's all go to the lobby
....Let's all go to the lobby
........Let's all go to the lobby
............To get ourselves a treat!
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post #280 of 351 Old 01-21-2013, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbldare View Post

Unfortunately KW took his own life.

RIP bud

dbl

OMG!
That is terrible! Wow, can't quite process that...tragic.

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post #281 of 351 Old 01-21-2013, 11:47 AM - Thread Starter
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I've had a couple more people asking me about it, but nothing yet.

That reminds me - it's looking like the ACI SV10 is another alternate that will work. It's not the best match for the design, but it's not bad. The biggest issue with that one is that it has a low-ish Xmax figure and I have no idea where Xmech is. It may give up some top end SPL to the SDX drivers. Models show those drivers hitting Xmax at around 150W or so... should have the box doing around 117dB at a meter in room.

As always, workability of those drivers is entirely dependent on how accurate the specs are. I haven't measured them, so I don't know for sure. Anybody trying one of the alternates does so at his own risk. The only one I can speak for firsthand is the SDX10 wink.gif
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post #282 of 351 Old 01-21-2013, 11:49 AM
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It really a sweet design and a relatively easy/straightforward build. cool.gif
Great job, I hope you are still enjoying yours. smile.gif

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post #283 of 351 Old 01-21-2013, 11:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Let's put it this way - I have no need of any more bass. I could hit 125dB at listening position with these beasts if I wanted to, but they break other objects in the room at that level. Not to mention flapping the projector screen around to the point it gets distracting.
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post #284 of 351 Old 01-21-2013, 12:04 PM
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I hear ya. I am in the same boat, but can never leave well enough alone. I may have to build something soon...I am getting the itch!eek.gif

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post #285 of 351 Old 01-21-2013, 12:35 PM - Thread Starter
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I do have another tapped horn design planned for this year if I can get around to it, but no promises. Money's tight.

Basically, I'm looking to get 120dB at a meter half space to 30Hz from four 5" drivers. In a cabinet less than 8" deep.

Figured if I don't need anything more for movies, I might as well do a nice loud one for music.
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post #286 of 351 Old 01-21-2013, 12:43 PM
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That sounds interesting if even for just the thinness of the enclosure. That would be very useful in many situations.
Cool, I hope you can find the resources to tackle it. I always enjoy seeing new and different designs.cool.gif

I am using and Exodus Anarchy 25 for my outdoor system now. However, I could use something with a little more oomph.

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post #287 of 351 Old 02-08-2013, 07:41 PM
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Ok Wolf,

Did you ever use a minidsp or a high pass filter on this one ? Curious what you used to dial in EQ if anything...

Also, the guy who used his as seat risers doesnt seem to respond to that thread anymore, curious if you have any opinions on the orientation of the mouths. I wanted to do a similar setup as his, but I have an open back that goes out to a bar/sitting room. I was considering having one mouth pointing forward and another facing backwards out to the bar. Total airspace is a little over 3000feet^3

Im thinking having the mouths spaced apart would help with seat to seat response.
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post #288 of 351 Old 02-08-2013, 09:19 PM - Thread Starter
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There is a highpass via my Reckhorn B2 centered at about 12Hz or so. Took a lot of trial and error adjustments to do that because the B-2 is rather imprecise to set up. I did want a MiniDSP at one point, but decided it was hard to justify the cost when I was already pretty flat at LP using the B-2. There's not much EQ beyond the standing wave correction applied by MCACC in the receiver and a slight 17-18Hz boost by the B-2.

As is the case with any other design, the room really determines the best placement for these - that's why I usually suggest building one first and then experimenting with placement options to find the best way to fire the mouths before doing anything permanent with them as risers. In FUN4ME's case, he has the mouths coupled together and placed nearfield... two of these would get insanely loud at LP like that because listening position is right there on top of the mouths. You likely could also use traditional subs to sort of get an idea how it would turn out... just put them where you figure the horn mouths would end up, and see what it sounds like at your planned listening position.

In other words, I really can't say for sure how well that placement would work in your room without actually trying it. In my case, I already knew where the best placement would be, because I'd already had subs there before. I call it the magic corner wink.gif
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post #289 of 351 Old 02-08-2013, 10:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpmst3 View Post

Anyone else build one of these babies?

I did and I am very happy with them. Build is in Sig line
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathanc View Post

Ok Wolf,


Also, the guy who used his as seat risers doesnt seem to respond to that thread anymore, curious if you have any opinions on the orientation of the mouths.

Im thinking having the mouths spaced apart would help with seat to seat response.
If that was me sorry if I didn't see your post. I tried multiple orientations and liked the way I placed them best. Any questions just ask
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post #290 of 351 Old 02-09-2013, 09:20 PM
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Fun4Me: No worries, I figured perhaps you weren't getting notifications. That is such an ideal seating arrangement, I love it.

OklahomaWolf: Any reason why you laid out the plans in metric ? I suppose it doesn't really matter, but even in Canada most lumber materials are all imperial measurements at the store. By the way, I live in Grande Prairie, not too far from you if you're in SK.

Do you have a cut list ? I see the sketchup file which I've loaded, but I am unsure how to figure out the size of each piece. Also, when you place the sections down on the bottom sheet, do you screw them in place to hold them vertical or use glue and a camp or what. My woodworking is limited to building large skateboard and bmx ramps when I was a teenager, as well as basic wood and steel framing. Never tried a more complex project like this so im unsure of the techniques used to hold everything straight and true. I'm most likely going to get home depot to cut the plywood for me as they will do it for .25c a cut.
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post #291 of 351 Old 02-09-2013, 09:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Cutlist diagram is in post 125. I probably still have the file on the computer somewhere. Otherwise, you can get all the dimensions you need out of the Sketchup file in the first post. The tape measure tool and a little math is all you need. Uses 18mm thick (3/4") wood.

Metric's just easier to deal with. I'd rather deal with millimeters just so I can be as exact as possible. Exactness with the saw matters with this build... that one sheet of ply had very little scrap left over.

I bought a couple plastic sawhorses to build it on. That helped a whole lot, being able to get underneath and go to town with the drill. I started with the innermost panels first, and just kind of worked my way outwards. I would measure where the panels were supposed to be on each end, mark their positions, then screw them in from underneath. Never used any clamps because I don't really have any big enough.

At any rate, I mostly figured things out as I went. As long as you're careful and patient with the measuring and don't spare the PL Premium, it's not too hard to put it together right. You might want a helper to put that last side panel in place though. I did it by myself, and thought my back was going to go out.

Edit - cutlist has been added to the zip file in the first post.
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post #292 of 351 Old 02-09-2013, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathanc View Post

.....I'm most likely going to get home depot to cut the plywood for me as they will do it for .25c a cut.

Don't leave the cutting to the lumberyard.

They can't cut it accurately enough.

A circular saw, a simple saw guide, and some scrap dimensional lumber to cut on top of is all you need to do all the cuts. You can make the guides out of scrap plywood, or you can go upscale and buy a system like my EurekaZone setup. I built a LOT of subs and speakers with two shop-made plywood guides though.
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post #293 of 351 Old 02-09-2013, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilmike View Post

Don't leave the cutting to the lumberyard.

They can't cut it accurately enough.

A circular saw, a simple saw guide, and some scrap dimensional lumber to cut on top of is all you need to do all the cuts. You can make the guides out of scrap plywood, or you can go upscale and buy a system like my EurekaZone setup. I built a LOT of subs and speakers with two shop-made plywood guides though.

I'd second that. Only time I have HD cut lumber is when I need a rough cut to load into my truck easier. All critical cuts need to be made by you.

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post #294 of 351 Old 02-10-2013, 06:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Missed that part. Yeah, it's best to do the cuts yourself.

My longer two piece saw guide was cheap (Home Hardware probably still carries them), and when I learned to use it properly I was making cuts with it that were only about a millimeter off. The trick with it is to use a clamped perpendicular piece of scrap wood in the middle to keep it from bowing as you cut.
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post #295 of 351 Old 02-11-2013, 07:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bass addict View Post

I'd second that. Only time I have HD cut lumber is when I need a rough cut to load into my truck easier. All critical cuts need to be made by you.

Same here. Their blades generally suck and some of the people that attempt to measure are not that swift either.

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post #296 of 351 Old 02-17-2013, 07:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Added my list of alternate drivers to the first post. Remember... try these at your own risk. I have not verified their parameters, and I have no way to do so, so it's a gamble.

The most recent addition to that list is the TC Epic 10, which is actually the best one I've seen for this design if the published parameters are valid. The stronger motor does a lot to control reactance. I don't know why I didn't model it in here before... I've modeled designs with that driver before. Probably the price... these drivers aren't that cheap.

Will add more drivers as I find them.
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post #297 of 351 Old 02-21-2013, 09:20 AM
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Wolf, don't you think it is time for a dual 12" TH design!?!?wink.gif

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post #298 of 351 Old 02-21-2013, 10:34 AM - Thread Starter
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If the SDX12 were a bit more affordable, I'd have already gotten started wink.gif

Otherwise, check out the AlpineGeist instead. I personally love that one. I could do one based on the newer Alpine Type R's, but I tend to be more interested in stuff nobody's done yet.

Like maybe a design with a pair of Sundown 15" Zv3's... can we say huge SPL? Sure we can.
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post #299 of 351 Old 02-21-2013, 10:38 AM
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I understand. Money always has to rear its ugly head.

I always enjoy following the designs around here and am envious of the know how too. smile.gif

I am looking forward to your next creation. I did check out the AlpineGeist, pretty wicked!cool.gif

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post #300 of 351 Old 02-21-2013, 11:26 AM - Thread Starter
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That it does, and I still make a 4 figure yearly income. Bills come first. Often, they come last too frown.gif

By the time I get the cash for any dual 15" design, the drivers may be off the market.
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