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post #3511 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 04:41 AM
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Hi @AustinJerry , i followed your "Using the MiniDSP 2x4 to Time-Align Multiple Subs on a Single Output Channel" guide.
Is there a way to manual adjust the frequency after you Import REW File to MiniDSP?


Thanks
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post #3512 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 07:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by femi View Post
Hi @AustinJerry , i followed your "Using the MiniDSP 2x4 to Time-Align Multiple Subs on a Single Output Channel" guide.
Is there a way to manual adjust the frequency after you Import REW File to MiniDSP?


Thanks
Femi
I'm sure Jerry will provide a better answer...but if I need to modify the filters, I usually do it within REW and then re-send the filters to the MiniDSP. This way I have an exact record (saved in the MDAT) of what filters were used.
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post #3513 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 07:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by femi View Post
Hi @AustinJerry , i followed your "Using the MiniDSP 2x4 to Time-Align Multiple Subs on a Single Output Channel" guide.
Is there a way to manual adjust the frequency after you Import REW File to MiniDSP?


Thanks
Femi
I think Alan's approach is the best, because you have a better view of what your changes will look like. But if you want to adjust manually, you could do either of two methods. The REW filter export is a text file, which can be opened and edited in any text editor. The second way is within the Plug-in itself:



You can select the EQ band by clicking a radio button on the left. Then place the cursor in the box that is showing the numeric values assigned to the filter and change them to whatever you want. Finally, click the Process button to apply the changes, and view the results in the graph above.
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post #3514 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 08:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
I'm sure Jerry will provide a better answer...but if I need to modify the filters, I usually do it within REW and then re-send the filters to the MiniDSP. This way I have an exact record (saved in the MDAT) of what filters were used.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
I think Alan's approach is the best, because you have a better view of what your changes will look like. But if you want to adjust manually, you could do either of two methods. The REW filter export is a text file, which can be opened and edited in any text editor. The second way is within the Plug-in itself:



You can select the EQ band by clicking a radio button on the left. Then place the cursor in the box that is showing the numeric values assigned to the filter and change them to whatever you want. Finally, click the Process button to apply the changes, and view the results in the graph above.
How do you guys do it within the REW? I could never figure it out.

Thanks
Femi
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post #3515 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by femi View Post
How do you guys do it within the REW? I could never figure it out.

Thanks
Femi
Well, there are a number of parameters in the EQ tool:



Changing the values of these parameters would result in different filters. Isn't that what you want to do?
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post #3516 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 10:01 AM
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I use the EQ filters panel to make any manual changes (after using the auto-EQ settings that Jerry posted above).

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post #3517 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 10:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
I use the EQ filters panel to make any manual changes (after using the auto-EQ settings that Jerry posted above).

stupid question here...how do u get to that screen(EQ filters panel)?

Thanks again
Femi
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post #3518 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 10:37 AM
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Fellas, I could use some on advice on which minidsp unit I should purchase. I'm going to setup subs in all 4 corners of my room and my processor has 2 sub outputs. The rear ones will definitely be closer to the main listening position, but the front and back pairs will not quite be equidistant to the mlp. They'll be close the right wall is about 3' further away than the left. Should I use 2 balanced 2x4's, a 4x10 or a 10x10?
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post #3519 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 10:46 AM
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I don't see why you would need 2 units.
One balanced 2x4 would do the trick, no?
2 inputs and 4 outputs?
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post #3520 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 10:59 AM
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Another thing to consider is the maximum delay you'll need. This is determined by measuring the distance from the MLP to the most distant and closest subs and taking the difference. For example:

Most distant sub = 14 feet away from MLP
Closest sub = 4 feet away from MLP
Difference in distance = 10 feet

The delay needed is computed from this distance difference and the speed of sound, which is 1126 feet/second. So in this case, the delay needed is:

delay = (10 feet) / (1126 feet/sec) = 0.00888 seconds = 8.88 msec

The regular 2x4 miniDSP units have a maximum of 7.5 msec delay, so you wouldn't be able to get optimum performance in this case. The safest bet would be the 2x4 HD version. The HD version has a huge 80 msec maximum delay and RCA connectors with a maximum output voltage of 2 Volts RMS, so it will drive just about any power amp to full power. It is a safe bet for any application with 4 subs or less.

If the 7.5 msec maximum delay of the normal 2x4 is enough for you, you could get the balanced 2x4. The unbalanced 2x4 (non-HD version) does not have enough output voltage to drive many pro amps to full power, but the balanced one does.
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post #3521 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 11:05 AM
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Really hope someone gets real world experience with the 2x4HD soon.

I have a denon x4000 that I'd prefer not to use for a few reasons and would switch back to my pioneer sc-25 but think the FIR loss is a bit concerning (Mcacc would be left off.)

Has anyone used the FIR function on any model yet?

If there aren't any experienced users I'm sure I'll mess it up trying on my own ha.
I still have an old unused Antimode 8033c if needed but thought I'd sell it if I could.
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post #3522 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by femi View Post
stupid question here...how do u get to that screen(EQ filters panel)?

Thanks again
Femi
By clicking the EQ Filters button at the top of the EQ panel.


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post #3523 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmryan821 View Post
Fellas, I could use some on advice on which minidsp unit I should purchase. I'm going to setup subs in all 4 corners of my room and my processor has 2 sub outputs. The rear ones will definitely be closer to the main listening position, but the front and back pairs will not quite be equidistant to the mlp. They'll be close the right wall is about 3' further away than the left. Should I use 2 balanced 2x4's, a 4x10 or a 10x10?
Andy's response was spot-on. If you decide on the balanced 2x4, there is a link to a setup guide in my sig. You do not need two units for four subs.
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post #3524 of 3798 Old 03-30-2016, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Electric Wiz View Post
I don't see why you would need 2 units.
One balanced 2x4 would do the trick, no?
2 inputs and 4 outputs?
Quote:
Originally Posted by andyc56 View Post
Another thing to consider is the maximum delay you'll need. This is determined by measuring the distance from the MLP to the most distant and closest subs and taking the difference. For example:

Most distant sub = 14 feet away from MLP
Closest sub = 4 feet away from MLP
Difference in distance = 10 feet

The delay needed is computed from this distance difference and the speed of sound, which is 1126 feet/second. So in this case, the delay needed is:

delay = (10 feet) / (1126 feet/sec) = 0.00888 seconds = 8.88 msec

The regular 2x4 miniDSP units have a maximum of 7.5 msec delay, so you wouldn't be able to get optimum performance in this case. The safest bet would be the 2x4 HD version. The HD version has a huge 80 msec maximum delay and RCA connectors with a maximum output voltage of 2 Volts RMS, so it will drive just about any power amp to full power. It is a safe bet for any application with 4 subs or less.

If the 7.5 msec maximum delay of the normal 2x4 is enough for you, you could get the balanced 2x4. The unbalanced 2x4 (non-HD version) does not have enough output voltage to drive many pro amps to full power, but the balanced one does.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
Andy's response was spot-on. If you decide on the balanced 2x4, there is a link to a setup guide in my sig. You do not need two units for four subs.
Thanks a bunch fellas. I guess I was thinking I was going to need 4 channels but I didn't think that through since I've only got two outputs from my processor.

It looks like the difference in distance between the furthest and closest will be about 7' so just under the 7.5ms max delay. I'll give the balanced 2x4 a shot. Is there any other reason to go with the 2x4HD? The $80 difference isn't a big deal if it offers something substantially better.
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post #3525 of 3798 Old 03-31-2016, 03:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
By clicking the EQ Filters button at the top of the EQ panel.


Thanks Alan P
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post #3526 of 3798 Old 03-31-2016, 03:09 PM
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Quick question, should the MiniDSP go before or after an art cleanbox?
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post #3527 of 3798 Old 03-31-2016, 03:14 PM
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Before generally
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post #3528 of 3798 Old 03-31-2016, 03:29 PM
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Before generally
Thank you
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post #3529 of 3798 Old 03-31-2016, 03:59 PM
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It's because usually you need more voltage to your amplifiers to drive them to full power. Are you sure you need one? Is your mini DSP balanced or unbalanced? The balanced version has jumpers that allow for either 2v or 4v output
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post #3530 of 3798 Old 04-18-2016, 07:21 AM
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Hey Guys,

Don't want to start a new thread so I figured i'd ask this here. I currently have PSB x2t's as my mains. Their On axis +/- 3db is 30Hz to 23000Hz. In a couple of weeks i will be picking up a Rythmik FVX15 sub from the states (I live in Toronto). I have a minidsp 2x4. Where should i set the crossover at? Is it mainly experimentation or should i be setting it at 80Hz as that seems like the common crossover value. I read a few posts saying that 80Hz isn't actually ideal so i'm not too sure what actually is.

Another question is that i am thinking of getting a Umik-1 as well. Is the cross spectrum Umik-1 worth the extra money? my room isn't treated and i'm not looking into getting into very specific room calibration. Just mainly using the minidsp to set the crossover to relieve my mains from handling the lower frequencies. Do i even need the Umik for this? I need to decide this soon so that i can place my order and be able to pick it up in a couple of weeks.

NAD D1050 > NAD C320BEE / MiniDSP 2x4 > PSB X2T's / Rythmik FVX15
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post #3531 of 3798 Old 04-18-2016, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcolaco View Post
Hey Guys,

Don't want to start a new thread so I figured i'd ask this here. I currently have PSB x2t's as my mains. Their On axis +/- 3db is 30Hz to 23000Hz. In a couple of weeks i will be picking up a Rythmik FVX15 sub from the states (I live in Toronto). I have a minidsp 2x4. Where should i set the crossover at? Is it mainly experimentation or should i be setting it at 80Hz as that seems like the common crossover value. I read a few posts saying that 80Hz isn't actually ideal so i'm not too sure what actually is.

Another question is that i am thinking of getting a Umik-1 as well. Is the cross spectrum Umik-1 worth the extra money? my room isn't treated and i'm not looking into getting into very specific room calibration. Just mainly using the minidsp to set the crossover to relieve my mains from handling the lower frequencies. Do i even need the Umik for this? I need to decide this soon so that i can place my order and be able to pick it up in a couple of weeks.
You don't need a UMIK-1 to set the crossover. Set it at 80 Hz and don't worry about it.
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post #3532 of 3798 Old 04-18-2016, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcolaco View Post



Another question is that i am thinking of getting a Umik-1 as well. Is the cross spectrum Umik-1 worth the extra money? my room isn't treated and i'm not looking into getting into very specific room calibration. Just mainly using the minidsp to set the crossover to relieve my mains from handling the lower frequencies. Do i even need the Umik for this? I need to decide this soon so that i can place my order and be able to pick it up in a couple of weeks.


You definitely don't need the mic to set crossover frequencies or program the miniDSP, however you'll need the mic if you want to tweak with the EQ and address specific acoustic characteristics of your room or your system.

Frankly for the $100 or so I believe it's an incredible resource to have the mic and is highly recommend it, but ultimately up to you based on what you'd like to do.

Like cooking a prime rib roast w/o a thermometer, you can do it but you can do it way better with measurements. HTH!
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post #3533 of 3798 Old 04-18-2016, 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by jshadzi View Post
You definitely don't need the mic to set crossover frequencies or program the miniDSP, however you'll need the mic if you want to tweak with the EQ and address specific acoustic characteristics of your room or your system.

Frankly for the $100 or so I believe it's an incredible resource to have the mic and is highly recommend it, but ultimately up to you based on what you'd like to do.

Like cooking a prime rib roast w/o a thermometer, you can do it but you can do it way better with measurements. HTH!
I agree, and with me, you definitely would be preaching to the choir. But I took the OP literally when he said he had no real interest in getting into room analysis and correction, in which case he doesn't need a microphone (for now).
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post #3534 of 3798 Old 04-18-2016, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
I agree, and with me, you definitely would be preaching to the choir. But I took the OP literally when he said he had no real interest in getting into room analysis and correction, in which case he doesn't need a microphone (for now).


Totally understood, we are in full agreement =) *thumbs up*
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post #3535 of 3798 Old 04-19-2016, 05:29 AM
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Quote:
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I agree, and with me, you definitely would be preaching to the choir. But I took the OP literally when he said he had no real interest in getting into room analysis and correction, in which case he doesn't need a microphone (for now).
Quote:
Originally Posted by jshadzi View Post
You definitely don't need the mic to set crossover frequencies or program the miniDSP, however you'll need the mic if you want to tweak with the EQ and address specific acoustic characteristics of your room or your system.

Frankly for the $100 or so I believe it's an incredible resource to have the mic and is highly recommend it, but ultimately up to you based on what you'd like to do.

Like cooking a prime rib roast w/o a thermometer, you can do it but you can do it way better with measurements. HTH!
The thing is that i do not have a dedicated listening room. I live in a condo and pretty much have 2 possible spots for the sub. Maybe 3 if i place it near my listening position. I can't treat my room either, so i'm wondering if REW would take me down a rabbit hole of chasing curves that my room would never be able to attain. It's also an L shaped room that opens into the kitchen. The right side is all windows. See the attached picture. It definitely isn't an ideal room.

I like the way my setup sounds right now and i guess without a mic i wont know what i'm missing out on. If that makes any sense. I have a week to decide on the mic and i think i'll pick one up. I can always sell it for close to what i paid here in Toronto.
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NAD D1050 > NAD C320BEE / MiniDSP 2x4 > PSB X2T's / Rythmik FVX15
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post #3536 of 3798 Old 04-19-2016, 06:36 AM
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How do I set the gain properly on my sub amplifers using the balanced miniDSP? If the mini was not part of the equation I would be okay the issue I am having the mini has the input and output gain that is where I have the problem how do I know where to set it?? I was thinking of doing it this way:
1. Disconnect all speakers
2. Turn avr trim up on all speakers in avr
3. Play 0dbfs tone through all speakers, use "All Channel mode"
4. Crank avr to 0db (or cleanest level before distortion)
..now you have max voltage coming out of the avr's sub pre-out....
5. Turn your subs pro-amp input gain up until the indicator flickers red then goes solid red. (Note this setting, don't ever change it)
6. Rerun your room correction in the avr to set your speaker/sub trims in the avr OR use a spl meter to set your speakers and sub trims in your AVR, using your avr's built in tones so that each speaker and your sub are playing 75db at your listening position.

Once that is done then go back and adjust the input to max adjust the output to right before clipping. Really just looking for a simple way to do this thanks in advance.

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post #3537 of 3798 Old 04-19-2016, 07:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcolaco View Post
The thing is that i do not have a dedicated listening room. I live in a condo and pretty much have 2 possible spots for the sub. Maybe 3 if i place it near my listening position. I can't treat my room either, so i'm wondering if REW would take me down a rabbit hole of chasing curves that my room would never be able to attain. It's also an L shaped room that opens into the kitchen. The right side is all windows. See the attached picture. It definitely isn't an ideal room.

I like the way my setup sounds right now and i guess without a mic i wont know what i'm missing out on. If that makes any sense. I have a week to decide on the mic and i think i'll pick one up. I can always sell it for close to what i paid here in Toronto.
I grabbed mine from Solen.ca Use it all the time, soetimes i use it on my Windows 10 XPS18 tablet for a SPL meter..
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post #3538 of 3798 Old 04-19-2016, 07:24 AM
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I grabbed mine from Solen.ca Use it all the time, soetimes i use it on my Windows 10 XPS18 tablet for a SPL meter..
I just placed my order for one on CSL . It's a small price to pay for something that will always come in handy. Since i'm making a trip down to Niagara, i figured i may as well spend the little extra to get it calibrated. Not sure if i was doing something wrong but MiniDSP charges 20 in shipping? That puts it really close to the 110 including shipping that CSL charges.

NAD D1050 > NAD C320BEE / MiniDSP 2x4 > PSB X2T's / Rythmik FVX15
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post #3539 of 3798 Old 04-19-2016, 07:30 AM
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I just placed my order for one on CSL . It's a small price to pay for something that will always come in handy. Since i'm making a trip down to Niagara, i figured i may as well spend the little extra to get it calibrated. Not sure if i was doing something wrong but MiniDSP charges 20 in shipping? That puts it really close to the 110 including shipping that CSL charges.
Solen : http://solen.ca/products/electronics...uipment/umm-6/ $105 CDN, Same one as I have.

They "WERE" cheaper

What is CSL ?
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post #3540 of 3798 Old 04-19-2016, 07:44 AM
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Solen : http://solen.ca/products/electronics...uipment/umm-6/ $105 CDN, Same one as I have.

They "WERE" cheaper

What is CSL ?
I'm talking USD since I recently set up a CBIUSA mailbox in Niagara Falls. Shipped a rythmik sub there and it is much cheaper than shipping one to Toronto. It's free shipping and no taxes in NY and I just have to pay 5% duties since rythmik makes their stuff in the states.

CSL is cross spectrum. They apparently calibrate each umik individually so the calibration files are specific to your mic rather than a general one provided by minidsp. I've read that it isn't much more accurate until the higher frequencies and its usually just about 1.5db off so not that a big deal. It's 15 USD more than from minidsp when you factor shipping in so I thought it was worth it. Came up to 142 cad with our crappy exchange rate and I solen comes up to about 140 cad for the umik-1. So I went with CSL.

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NAD D1050 > NAD C320BEE / MiniDSP 2x4 > PSB X2T's / Rythmik FVX15

Last edited by dcolaco; 04-19-2016 at 07:50 AM.
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