Hey guys...we need a little rallying here... - Page 286 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 117Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #8551 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 06:51 AM
Advanced Member
 
Sepen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 711
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 17
I am interested in the smaller surrounds. Have any teaser pics?
Sepen is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #8552 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 07:17 AM
Member
 
HT cOz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Houston
Posts: 162
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by btinindy View Post

Erich, just my quick opinion here...I think the way you are doing it is working quite well. I think you should start requiring some pre-order money on some of these new designs before you build them out.

Also, I think you should start leveling out what you are designing. What I mean is, I hear a lot of comments here and elsewhere that someone really wants to try the SEOS, but they are waiting for the "New designs" to come out. You get busy at your day job, and the newer stuff gets delayed and they don't buy anything while all the stuff you have invested in sits there. Most don't want to buy because they think they might miss the newest "Better" designs.

You have done so much in a short period of time. I hate to hear that you have so much invested at risk based on what people say they wanted. It is time to make people put their money where their mouth is prior to you putting your money at risk. With all that I hear about all these new designs coming out, what is your plan to get rid of all that you already have?

This has been such a benefit for enabling DIY'ing, and I don't want to see it fade away. All that you have brought together has been unbelievable. What can we do to help? I am sure you have a plan, but it concerns me that you may have six figures tied up in not a business, not making money. You deserve to make something off of all this effort.

I actually do not feel really good about you not making money when I am buying something from you.

Erich,

I want to follow up on these sentiments. Make sure you have the correct legal structure for this venture and that you have insurance for the inventory. I would also consider crowed source funding. People really support what you are doing and would be willing to help get you going. I'm all for complete speakers!!!
HT cOz is offline  
post #8553 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 07:24 AM
Member
 
rsvr79's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 56
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
I'll add a +1 to btinindy's comments as well. You've got too much tied up in this to risk people being flaky once the product comes in.
rsvr79 is offline  
post #8554 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 07:34 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Erich H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cincinnati OH
Posts: 5,147
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 428
Quote:
Originally Posted by btinindy View Post

Erich, just my quick opinion here...I think the way you are doing it is working quite well. I think you should start requiring some pre-order money on some of these new designs before you build them out.

Also, I think you should start leveling out what you are designing. What I mean is, I hear a lot of comments here and elsewhere that someone really wants to try the SEOS, but they are waiting for the "New designs" to come out. You get busy at your day job, and the newer stuff gets delayed and they don't buy anything while all the stuff you have invested in sits there. Most don't want to buy because they think they might miss the newest "Better" designs.

You have done so much in a short period of time. I hate to hear that you have so much invested at risk based on what people say they wanted. It is time to make people put their money where their mouth is prior to you putting your money at risk. With all that I hear about all these new designs coming out, what is your plan to get rid of all that you already have?

This has been such a benefit for enabling DIY'ing, and I don't want to see it fade away. All that you have brought together has been unbelievable. What can we do to help? I am sure you have a plan, but it concerns me that you may have six figures tied up in not a business, not making money. You deserve to make something off of all this effort.

I actually do not feel really good about you not making money when I am buying something from you.

Keep in mind, I truly enjoy what I'm doing here, and would like to expand this even more. I really mean that. I have had help packaging the larger flat packs and needed to mark up things like the big subwoofer boxes to help cover the help. So I can't say those are direct price from the CNC company. That was discussed in the other thread. I was hoping my sister could help with those larger boxes, but they're too heavy for her to lift.

Most people would probably be surprised at how big this project has gotten and what it took to get it just to this point. But I was willing to give it a shot. The money circulating came from that initial $35k that I sat aside for group buys a couple years ago. Remember the 15" MFW subwoofers, and then that JBL group buy came at the same time? eek.gif That money just kept getting rolled over into other things. I added in a bit more for the SEOS project, then sold a work truck that was rarely used to help fund the plastic SEOS-12. Added in some more for the compression drivers. Then the SEOS-10 and 15 needed to be done in plastic. Preorders on those were a bit low compared to the 12 simply because the 12 is already here, which makes sense. I had just purchased a car last year, so I got rid of my personal truck around March and that went to help fund those 2 plastic models. Then came the Anarchy woofers with a 500 minimum order.

You can see that running up into the six figure range is quite easy. biggrin.gif Luckily I was able to do it over the course of a couple years, and also had the extra space to store things. And I'm glad that I did. You really wouldn't believe what my shop looks like right now. wink.gif

My current idea is to keep the kits going and remove ones that don't get ordered very often. It would make sense to turn some new kits into completed speakers so that more people would order them. It could raise revenue to put up some advertising. Then hopefully everything would move a little faster so that the money invested could be rolled over into new projects much easier.

I agree with you about people waiting for the next 'thing' to come out and that does worry me a bit. And I'm also seeing that just because people say they really want to see a certain product done.....doesn't mean very many will want it once I get it done. Then again, without advertising, people don't even know some of this exists.

There's a project that MTG90 and I were discussing that looks absolutely nuts, but the parts alone are $1200 or more per speaker. There's nothing else like it anywhere, but dropping $1200 for a single speaker sample probably isn't the best way to spend the group buy funds. Maybe we'll do a mock up to show you guys what we were thinking. Actually, it was MTG90 that thought it up when he saw an interesting woofer I had sitting over in the corner.
Erich H is offline  
post #8555 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 07:49 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Erich H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cincinnati OH
Posts: 5,147
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 428
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sepen View Post

I am interested in the smaller surrounds. Have any teaser pics?

No pictures yet. But believe it or not, these could be used for more than surrounds. They really pack a punch with the proper power. MTG90 was running one channel of his Behringer A500 amp through it, and I believe that was with a slightly cut full range signal.......in a fairly large room at the shop. I was in the next room and came over to see what he was playing because all we had set up were small speakers at the time. This is one design that just came together perfectly. But we did spend months discussing what parts to use, and looking for the right sized waveguide.

The size makes it perfect for a completed speaker. But I'm just not sure what to do right now. We are working on other small designs, and we will be posting photos once things are caught up. It's a little hectic around here right now because we're designing boxes, gluing them up, organizing things, etc. And keeping up with packaging.

By the way, MTG90 really knows his stuff........and makes me look like ignorant on the scientific parts of audio. And he could likely assemble a speaker box with his eyes closed. It's pretty obvious he's been doing this for quite some time.
Erich H is offline  
post #8556 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 07:56 AM
Member
 
rsvr79's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 56
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

Then again, without advertising, people don't even know some of this exists.

What about putting together some genuinely pretty speakers and sending them out for official reviews done through magazines or sites? That would help get the word out to the masses.
rsvr79 is offline  
post #8557 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 08:40 AM
Senior Member
 
mmarki's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SW Burbs of Chicago
Posts: 465
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 18
Just to echo what everyone else has said, Erich, you have done so much for the DIY community, I would hate to see this go away. What can we do to help? You should be making some money on this venture. I also don't feel good about you not making money on purchases. What might have started out as a "hobby" seems to have gotten a lot bigger and more expensive. I don't think anyone would balk at you charging more for speakers. I think they are a tremendous value and you could/should charge a little more. More money for your time, help you have to hire out, future projects, money to designers for their work, advertising, whatever.

Maybe completed speakers will help too? They could appeal to those that don't feel like the have the skills to complete a build or maybe people don't have the time to do it. I don't know, just my thoughts.

Thanks for all you do, Erich.

Matt
mmarki is online now  
post #8558 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 09:13 AM
AVS Special Member
 
HopefulFred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 2,688
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 94 Post(s)
Liked: 183
I'm sure Erich has to watch his tax liabilities and so forth, so there may be other things for him to consider if making a profit. Still, it seems reasonable to take compensation for the two used vehicles already "donated" to all of us - to say nothing of the space used and the fuel and time burned doing this.

Big time thanks!
HopefulFred is online now  
post #8559 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 03:10 PM
Member
 
RyanCo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24

Thought you all might want to see this, thanks to chopshop and Erich for making the 24's happen!-

 

Been getting these all setup...note the extra "B" Truextant Be frams right out of the box...

 

 

From what was pretty big (seos 18/ba750):

 

To something way bigger (951pb+b/seos 24):

 

 

First I put about 20lbs of rope caulk on the back there (cant hurt):

 

 

Then taped it over.  Did some basic tuning with REW and am getting a little listening time in.  I need to boot to a backup partition that's all setup with wine bottler to run arta, but I set the XO right around 400hz (a tad lower) as that was about as low as I could go without starting to hear barely audible distortion on a sine.

 

I can certainly say that the sweet spot from this combo is MUCH larger then the already very big sweet spot from the BA/18 combo.  Dynamics are of course stunning, they are pretty dang flat right out of the box, this took very little EQ to hit +/- 1.5dB in the listening position (was able to *almost* get there by ear).  I could only compare the image size to 3 speakers I've heard.  802d's, tracktrix loaded B&G neo8's and Quad ESL's...although all of them would only sound this good in a much bigger room than mine.

 

Top octave extension needs a little eq help, but it is very very good in the room.  I won't be adding a supertweeter.  The NHT's used to still reveal a little bit of info that the 18s/BAs weren't telling me, but now they just sound bad, even level matched and within the dB range they can handle...

 

I'll post some disto plots a little later, wont be able to do polars anytime soon (live in the noisy city, and all my gear is racked up).  They certainly look imposing:

 

LTD02 likes this.
RyanCo is offline  
post #8560 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 04:37 PM
AVS Special Member
 
cuzed2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Chicago Area
Posts: 4,403
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 63
WOAH - that is awesome! Thanks for sharing
and the midbass woofers are NS6s?

Cuzed2
Check out a video of my theater here
CuznEddy Cinema
Officially Hanesamatized on 8/1/09

cuzed2 is offline  
post #8561 of 10763 Old 11-02-2013, 08:14 PM
Member
 
RyanCo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Yeah ns6 shaded passively Malcolm style, I also was messing with delay shading (setup 4 way active originally) to bend the horizontal line inwards, but it doesn't work well with the woofers sharing the same box, so I just hung a coil off the outside pair.

The ns6s do have one issue which seems to be a frame resonance at the Eb below middle c (350 Hz iirc). I need to get them mounted a little better to be sure...eventually I will be looking to upgrade that part to b&c 6s or maybe td6ms then finish the tops with the 24s and the 6s mounted in a phenolic baffle/box that extends up to the ceiling.

The corner subs are almost done also, w15gti's. I may have to unwire everything to install the subs though- that patchbay is 288 points about 80% populated...which makes for a big enough job that it would make the most sense to rebuild some stuff in the control room....

Didn't get to arta today (just rew), but this setup definitely doesnt require a super tweeter. Also wasn't able to measure any throat compression in the lowest octave until the sweeps got too loud to take with earplugs in. That answers two big questions...
cuzed2 likes this.
RyanCo is offline  
post #8562 of 10763 Old 11-03-2013, 08:25 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cuzed2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Chicago Area
Posts: 4,403
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanCo View Post

Yeah ns6 shaded passively Malcolm style, I also was messing with delay shading (setup 4 way active originally) to bend the horizontal line inwards, but it doesn't work well with the woofers sharing the same box, so I just hung a coil off the outside pair.

The ns6s do have one issue which seems to be a frame resonance at the Eb below middle c (350 Hz iirc). I need to get them mounted a little better to be sure...eventually I will be looking to upgrade that part to b&c 6s or maybe td6ms then finish the tops with the 24s and the 6s mounted in a phenolic baffle/box that extends up to the ceiling.

The corner subs are almost done also, w15gti's. I may have to unwire everything to install the subs though- that patchbay is 288 points about 80% populated...which makes for a big enough job that it would make the most sense to rebuild some stuff in the control room....

Didn't get to arta today (just rew), but this setup definitely doesnt require a super tweeter. Also wasn't able to measure any throat compression in the lowest octave until the sweeps got too loud to take with earplugs in. That answers two big questions...

I've got a BigMAL, & immediately took notice of your config. So between the corner subs and extending a baffle to the ceiling your corners will disappear completely?
Looking forward to more, especially the implementation of your subs and some response sweeps. Keep up the good work & Thanks for sharing

Cuzed2
Check out a video of my theater here
CuznEddy Cinema
Officially Hanesamatized on 8/1/09

cuzed2 is offline  
post #8563 of 10763 Old 11-03-2013, 01:13 PM
Member
 
RyanCo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24

Yeah that's the idea, floor to ceiling corner horns= only 1/4 space radiation for everything.  I get some disto and sweep tests up soon...

RyanCo is offline  
post #8564 of 10763 Old 11-04-2013, 11:09 AM
Senior Member
 
rajacat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Washington State
Posts: 298
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanCo View Post

Yeah that's the idea, floor to ceiling corner horns= only 1/4 space radiation for everything.  I get some disto and sweep tests up soon...

I have thought about building my SEOS18/ BA/TD15M's into the corners of my living room. Hmm... would this interfere with with ambient reflections so that the holographic imaging would be disturbed? Lack of soundstage depth? It seems most speakers sound best if place a distance from the wall. When you hear a live band, it projects sound 360 degrees although most of the sound is projected towards the audience there still is a backwave that bounces around the backstage. Of course, all the cues are on the original master but in the translation do the speakers need to project towards the back as well as forward?
Corner horns are nice in that they would be out of the way, use little functional floor space and be relatively easy to build. You could make the corners very dead, very cheaply using multiple layers of sheetrock with Green Glue for damping. A corner location would nicely provide the optimum 45 deg. toe in. OTOH once you build the speakers in, you're stuck with them and can't tweak their location.
rajacat is offline  
post #8565 of 10763 Old 11-05-2013, 12:00 AM
Member
 
RyanCo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24

Hmmm, well there is a lot of stuff in that post that is hard to respond to because some of it wanders outside of the world of acoustics and into the world of man-made defacto standards and some into the philosophy behind making records in general.

 

I think when you have control over the crossover and the voicing of the speakers it gives you more ability to make adjustments than moving them around, if you also intend to make adjustments to the rooms acoustics itself it gives you more ability to achieve a consistent response around the room, which makes tuning the speakers to the room a more realistic proposition.   Wall/soffit/corner mounted speakers have a lot of benifits; they almost completely eliminate SBIR, edge diffraction and baffle step loss.

 

I would hazard to guess that the main reasons that people experience a increase in image width and depth from pulling speakers out into the room is simply because against the wall they have more bass, enough to shift the tonal balance a bit darker and mask some info up higher.  Brightness is like salt, for whatever reason humans just cant get enough of it until it's almost painful...then again so is loudness so if you move your speakers around to compare don't touch the volume knob or your ruin it.

 

But the other thing that happens is if you have a room with 50 acoustic problems, fixing 40 can actually subjectively make it worse, as the remaining ones are no longer masked/mitigated by all the other ones.

 

I'm doubtful there is any real benifit or need for reflections behind the speakers per-se, but what we want in *good reflections* are non-specular, non-repeating reflections that are outside the ITD gap (IE haas window vs frequency)...so by default anything bouncing around behind the speakers rather safely fits into that category (still for treble they have to bounce off something else first to get there, and that reflection is likely to be inside the ITDG...).  But the speakers size, even when built into a wall/corner rarely if ever are going to have a big impact total potential for reflective surface area that can be outside the ITDG...I wouldn't think at least.

 

Long story short speakers are always a balance of compromise and the speakers and room as a system only make it more complex...  I guess the simple approach would be to ask what are the dimensions of your room, are you going to do an active or passive crossover and were you considering acoustic treatment? 

RyanCo is offline  
post #8566 of 10763 Old 11-05-2013, 01:17 PM
Senior Member
 
rajacat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Washington State
Posts: 298
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 16
My room is 7'-9" x 35' x 15'. I do have some acoustic treatments and will build more if required. I plan to use an active crossover for the CD and midwoofer. I have three subs which are scattered about and plan to add one more. More subs the better so that you get the distributed sub effect. For the midwoofers, I'm reconsidering whether to go with sealed, for simplicity, or build vented boxes that will go low thus contributing to the distributed bass scenario.

I suppose I should just go ahead and build the boxes designed so that they'll fit snugly in the corners rather than commit to the build-in the corner idea. If that works out well I could fill in the remaining space to the ceiling with bass traps.

Ideally, I'd like to design the system to use as little EQ as possible.
rajacat is offline  
post #8567 of 10763 Old 11-05-2013, 06:23 PM
Member
 
RyanCo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 19
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 24

Ok here is a 10dB scale measured about 1M, inside but everything nearby damped.  The sweep measures 96dB on the SPL meter....the noise floor in here is around 35-40dB so this test may not be all that good, also I have to come really close to clipping my AD because the output of my mic pre is +4 bal, and the input -10, leaving too much overhead there seems to just look at the noisefloor of the mic pre...

 

I might mess with it a little more, but especially great D3 levels...I don't go nuts for ultra low disto alone, I like to check where it is clearly audible.

 

30dB of burst decay looks very clean, after that it gets to the room...no major ringing though:

 

RyanCo is offline  
post #8568 of 10763 Old 11-06-2013, 03:30 AM
Member
 
fakamada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Poland
Posts: 47
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Guys, I can't find any vertical off axis measurement of SEOS based 2-way speaker. I'd like to see how vertical lobes and nulls are working in practice.
fakamada is offline  
post #8569 of 10763 Old 11-06-2013, 06:43 AM
AVS Special Member
 
tuxedocivic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Ladysmith, BC
Posts: 4,349
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 149 Post(s)
Liked: 423
Check out the design write ups on the diysoundgroup forum. Each speaker behaves a little differently. But most of the time Matt and I have done verticals.
tuxedocivic is online now  
post #8570 of 10763 Old 11-06-2013, 03:57 PM
Member
 
fakamada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Poland
Posts: 47
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Got it. Thanks.
fakamada is offline  
post #8571 of 10763 Old 11-06-2013, 04:08 PM
Member
 
fakamada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Poland
Posts: 47
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I have a technical question that is intriguing me and I cannot find any answer. It's about constant directivity but in a very narrow angle. I just can't see any diffrences beetween 0, 10, and 20 degrres off axis. 30 degrees begins to differ. Something like - 1.5db?
I'll use my room as an example. If I seat in the middle of my couch, speakers would be about 10 deg. off axis.
If I move to the seat next to me (about 2 feet to the left) I'm about on axis of right speaker and about 20deg. off axis of the left speaker.
What happens to the soundstage in such situation? Maybe I just have to look at measurements with different scale/higher resolution. Does anyone have such measurements?
fakamada is offline  
post #8572 of 10763 Old 11-06-2013, 04:32 PM
Senior Member
 
antisuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 313
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by fakamada View Post

I have a technical question that is intriguing me and I cannot find any answer. It's about constant directivity but in a very narrow angle. I just can't see any diffrences beetween 0, 10, and 20 degrres off axis. 30 degrees begins to differ. Something like - 1.5db?
I'll use my room as an example. If I seat in the middle of my couch, speakers would be about 10 deg. off axis.
If I move to the seat next to me (about 2 feet to the left) I'm about on axis of right speaker and about 20deg. off axis of the left speaker.
What happens to the soundstage in such situation? Maybe I just have to look at measurements with different scale/higher resolution. Does anyone have such measurements?
I think measurements would be of limited value here, because if you are using controlled directivity speakers and if you're setting them up properly (severely toed in so they cross in front of the primary seating position) the results depend on time-intensity trading, which is a psychoacoustic phenomenon that won't be evident in measurements.

Are you familiar with the ideas in this writeup by Bill Waslo? Take a look at the PDF provided on the linked page.
antisuck is offline  
post #8573 of 10763 Old 11-06-2013, 04:34 PM
AVS Special Member
 
chalugadp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 3,759
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 349 Post(s)
Liked: 710
Not an article but a picture Ltd showed me a couple of weeks ago and it helped. Not sure the angle.


Seos speaker on bottom
chalugadp is online now  
post #8574 of 10763 Old 11-06-2013, 05:11 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
noah katz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Mountain View, CA USA
Posts: 20,346
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 80 Post(s)
Liked: 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by fakamada View Post

What happens to the soundstage in such situation?

Per the mentioned literature, it holds up much better than for a non-CD speaker.

Noah
noah katz is online now  
post #8575 of 10763 Old 11-07-2013, 05:55 AM
Member
 
fakamada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Poland
Posts: 47
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by antisuck View Post


Are you familiar with the ideas in this writeup by Bill Waslo? Take a look at the PDF provided on the linked page.

Yes I'm aware of the idea. That is exactly why I'm having doubts. If speakers are set very wide in the room and severely toed it doesn't mean that I'm seating 30-40deg off-axis. And what I can tell from measurements below 30deg. there is not much difference. On-axis, 10deg and 20deg look almost the same, so I'm guessing the concept doesn't work in such situation?

As I said before, maybe and hopefully it is a mater of diferent scale measurements/plots.
fakamada is offline  
post #8576 of 10763 Old 11-11-2013, 02:48 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Erich H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cincinnati OH
Posts: 5,147
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 428
Does anyone know how to draw up a crossover layout to have the PCB's made up for a speaker design? I think the manufacture would need a certain file type to get them produced. If I recall, I think it's a Gerber file.
Erich H is offline  
post #8577 of 10763 Old 11-11-2013, 02:54 PM
Advanced Member
 
HFGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 556
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 16
yes they are called Gerber files, its actually several files for different layers, silkscreens ... drill patterns. The PCB artwork itself should be straight forward but picking the right packages will take some considerable back and forth with someone who actually has the components. Have you considered how much a PCB will actually cost ? A small run on PCBs is very expensive and the PCB itself will be large which will really increase the price.
HFGuy is offline  
post #8578 of 10763 Old 11-11-2013, 03:10 PM
Advanced Member
 
Carl_Huff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 616
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

Does anyone know how to draw up a crossover layout to have the PCB's made up for a speaker design? I think the manufacture would need a certain file type to get them produced. If I recall, I think it's a Gerber file.

What circuit are you looking to produce? I have the software tools, skills and owe you a favor. Send me the details of what you need and I'll turn it around for you.

_____________
Best Regards,
Carl Huff
Carl_Huff is offline  
post #8579 of 10763 Old 11-11-2013, 03:16 PM
Senior Member
 
mobeer4don's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 424
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 41
The design gurus here should be able to come up rather generic PCB layout that will work for multiple crossovers depending on how you populate it. I haven't looked at many of the crossover schematics but I bet most of the SEOS designs have rather similar topologies. Something between the ZilchLab ewave and Pi Speakers designs should be the sweet spot.
mobeer4don is offline  
post #8580 of 10763 Old 11-11-2013, 08:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Erich H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cincinnati OH
Posts: 5,147
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked: 428
The crossover designs are usually pretty different. But I'm interested in getting PCB's made up for a few of them. It shouldn't add too much to the price if enough are purchased to divide it out. Plus it should *really* help people get them assembled properly and much easier.
autox320 likes this.
Erich H is offline  
Reply DIY Speakers and Subs

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off