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post #10951 of 12190 Old 08-03-2014, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by antisuck View Post
Clearly you should pay no attention to that tuxedocivic fella, he has no idea what he's talking about.

And yes, waiting for input from the gurus (tux or others) is a good plan.
I do appreciate your input because you sounded perfectly acceptable

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post #10952 of 12190 Old 08-04-2014, 11:23 AM
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Are we expecting any updates to the Fusion 8 anytime soon?

Dude, are you made of leprechauns? Cause that was awesome!

The Plains Theater Has Begun
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post #10953 of 12190 Old 08-04-2014, 12:38 PM
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Are we expecting any updates to the Fusion 8 anytime soon?
The center channel and dual woofer towers just hit. I think bagby expanded that line some... But the original single driver is solid, I don't think it needs changes. It's getting brothers and sisters though... Seems like all the variations of that (towers, center, MTM, MMT, single woof etc) design are winners. Nice speaker for the cost and size. Amazing really.
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post #10954 of 12190 Old 08-05-2014, 09:54 AM
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Outdoor resistance

Is there anybody here who made a pair of SEOS equipped speakers for outdoor use?

I do not mean open sky, but I see a possibility to integrate the Fusion-12 Tempest in the roofed terrace adjacent to the HT. It's still the outdoor atmosphere ofcourse with misty humid conditions sometimes. I'd make the cabinet out of weatherproof plywood and oil it with the same black oil as the rest of the wood cladding. Two sides are open air, one is glass, which leaves one cladded wall to play with.

They would be the same baffle width, but reduced depth and longer height to arrive at the same net volume, while not sticking out to much.

Tell my if I am crazy or not? I presume the Eminence is up for it. How about the DNA-360?

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post #10955 of 12190 Old 08-05-2014, 10:06 AM
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An earlier picture. I can remove the slats where the speakers would integrate.

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post #10956 of 12190 Old 08-05-2014, 10:13 AM
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open picture in separate browser or browser tab and copy the URL adress for it... then past it into thread with [img] before and [/img] after for image codes.

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/attach...5&d=1407254758

Take that and add the [IMG] and [/img]


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post #10957 of 12190 Old 08-05-2014, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erwinfrombelgium View Post
Is there anybody here who made a pair of SEOS equipped speakers for outdoor use?

I do not mean open sky, but I see a possibility to integrate the Fusion-12 Tempest in the roofed terrace adjacent to the HT. It's still the outdoor atmosphere ofcourse with misty humid conditions sometimes. I'd make the cabinet out of weatherproof plywood and oil it with the same black oil as the rest of the wood cladding. Two sides are open air, one is glass, which leaves one cladded wall to play with.

They would be the same baffle width, but reduced depth and longer height to arrive at the same net volume, while not sticking out to much.

Tell my if I am crazy or not? I presume the Eminence is up for it. How about the DNA-360?
Paper cones are asking for trouble. Looks for something that's not so moisture effected. With waveguide if you angle and set up right so water never goes into the CD (use gravity) you probably be ok. But not a paper cone, get another driver.

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post #10958 of 12190 Old 08-05-2014, 10:19 AM
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Most of the pro drivers are paper cone, and I agree with Mfusik about them. But a lot of them are treated for weather use also. Just look for that and as long as you're careful and don't expect 50 years of service you'll probably be ok. I think cobwebs, termites, woodpeckers, etc would be a bigger issue in the long run than moisture.
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post #10959 of 12190 Old 08-05-2014, 10:29 AM
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I have an infinity 1260 sub outdoors that gets wet and it likes it. Near pool and it gets wet. Plays fine. Saw my dad washing with power-washer and basically over spray directly onto the cone. I laughed. For $60 driver I can replace it in a couple years anyways. Keep this kind of attitude with outdoor speakers you'll be ok. $300+ kits are not advised.

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post #10960 of 12190 Old 08-05-2014, 10:41 AM
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I'd like to see, or really hear, a woodpecker vs a Dayton UM sub.

Mike
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post #10961 of 12190 Old 08-05-2014, 11:27 AM
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I'd like to see, or really hear, a woodpecker vs a Dayton UM sub.
Woodpecker is probably not used to something that pecks back.
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post #10962 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 04:06 PM
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http://www.parts-express.com/wet-loo...clear--340-510

Some people report that they applied a protective coat to paper cones, such as Wet Look Pint Clear. Anyone has experience with it?

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post #10963 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 04:06 PM
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http://www.parts-express.com/wet-loo...clear--340-510

Some people report that they applied a protective coat to paper cones, such as Wet Look Pint Clear. Anyone has experience with it?

Building a HT with 7.2.4 layout and ◤SEOS-24◥ LCR.
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post #10964 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 04:32 PM
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I'd be afraid changing the weight of the speaker cone would change the sound. You have better options, like a cone that is not paper.

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post #10965 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 05:17 PM
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Outdoor audio is not about critical audiophile listening, it's about clarity and reasonable accuracy over LONG distances, the "home turf" of compression horn drivers.

I would be very comfortable building an outdoor speaker using that "wet look" polymer on a coaxial speaker cone inside a properly sealed, marine-grade box.

Will they last forever?

No, the weather takes its toll on everything outside, but if they're shaded and protected from the wet and the cold, you'll get almost as much use out of them as purpose-built "marine/exterior-grade" drivers.

Look up "wakeboard tower speakers" for enclosure ideas, or just use a cheap polyethelene water tank stuffed with filling:

http://www.polytanksales.com/media/c.../sp0016-mm.jpg



Add a grill, and you're good to go:

http://www.parts-express.com/steel-m...black--260-426


Last edited by BeeTL; 08-06-2014 at 05:29 PM.
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post #10966 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 05:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeTL View Post
Outdoor audio is not about critical audiophile listening, it's about clarity and reasonable accuracy over LONG distances, the "home turf" of compression horn drivers.

I would be very comfortable building an outdoor speaker using that "wet look" polymer on a coaxial speaker cone inside a properly sealed, marine-grade box.

Will they last forever?

No, the weather takes its toll on everything outside, but if they're shaded and protected from the wet and the cold, you'll get almost as much use out of them as purpose-built "marine/exterior-grade" drivers.

Look up "wakeboard tower speakers" for enclosure ideas.
Thanks!

I agree about the difference of outdoor listening vs indoor.

The specs of the Fusion-12 are so impressive... No real outdoor speaker can approach that. 12" has 4 times the cone surface of a typical 6" outdoor speaker.

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post #10967 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post
I'd be afraid changing the weight of the speaker cone would change the sound. You have better options, like a cone that is not paper.
Another woofer would dictate another crossover, no? I would prefer a proven design. Where could I find one?

I read elsewhere that the sound doesn't differ noticeably after putting on the coat.

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post #10968 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 05:32 PM
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You should decide what is important to you. There is plenty of pro audio level outdoor speakers that get loud and sound pretty good. I've seen them at all the high end beach bars I drink at

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post #10969 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 05:36 PM
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You should decide what is important to you. There is plenty of pro audio level outdoor speakers that get loud and sound pretty good. I've seen them at all the high end beach bars I drink at
I didn't think about pro audio. Good idea! I will browse that tomorrow.

One thing: my design would be bespoke and integrated with the exact finish as the wood cladding.

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post #10970 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 05:38 PM
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The Fusion 12 is a pro-audio speaker with above average components and an exceptionally well designed crossover.
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post #10971 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 05:47 PM
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But it has a paper cone and not made to be outside in elements. Some other pro audio speakers are designed to be played full tilt in the rain. I'd opt for that.


http://www.parts-express.com/prv-aud...-ohm--294-2741

Use something like that instead of a paper driver ^

or just buy something like these:

http://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio..._u/?mode=model


I have 8 zones of outdoor speakers, (polk, infinity, smaller Yamaha, Jensen, and Dayton) and non of mine sound like those^ My buddy has a set by his pool. They are awesome.

Or go all the way:

https://www.jblpro.com/www/home

Most football stadiums and such run that kind of stuff ^

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post #10972 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 06:19 PM
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Take a wild guess as to what makes that PRV speaker "waterproof"...

Hint:

http://www.parts-express.com/wet-loo...=1008un8vkufq3

Have you ever disassembled an "outdoor speaker"?

It's all about the enclosure.
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post #10973 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 06:23 PM
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Yeah for sure if you go the route of the FUSION 12 you'll want to treat the cone to protect it.

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post #10974 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 06:25 PM
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For a out door speaker enclosure just make it out of wood and fibreglass it.
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post #10975 of 12190 Old 08-06-2014, 06:38 PM
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A polyethylene water tank is easier, quicker and likely cheaper.

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post #10976 of 12190 Old 08-07-2014, 07:40 AM
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Ya, the Fusion 12 would be awesome outside, they can play so loud and clear. Coating the woofer would be good, wouldn't change the sound enough to notice outside. Even if you had waterproof speakers, I wouldn't let them sit out in a downpour or throw them in a pool.
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post #10977 of 12190 Old 08-07-2014, 09:19 AM
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Yeah, you might get by if you mount them high and point them down so gravity keeps water from going into the waveguide or hitting the CD, and you build an overhang or something above them to keep them safe, or if they are under a roof, mounted up in corners pointing down ... that might work.

But putting them in a wall flat where wind hits directly is asking for trouble IMO. You'd want a true outdoor solution for something like that.

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post #10978 of 12190 Old 08-07-2014, 10:08 AM
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They are indeed under an eave. The left speaker is only 4 feet horizontally covered by it (to the West side). The height of the eave is 8 feet. Putting the drivers way op there would ofcourse be best practice for protecting them, not in the least against the sun. Rain is one thing, but waterproofing doesn't do very much against the harmful sun rays. The drivers face South side, but in that direction, the eave is like 20 feet.

I'd put the woofer above the SEOS, so the acoustic center is not as high up. I will make a design for that. Very tall probably...

I also looked for weather resistant drivers. B&C claims their coaxial speakers are all treated with coating, like the 12FHX76:
http://www.bcspeakers.com/products/coaxial/12-0/12fhx76

Another good one is the Beyma 12CXA400Nd (also available as Ferro). It's specs say it goes down to 35 Hz. Would need a big cabinet to get that low, I presume.
http://www.beyma.com/products/coaxials/112CXA4ND8

Putting a grill over these would not affect the high frequencies to much?

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post #10979 of 12190 Old 08-07-2014, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erwinfrombelgium View Post
They are indeed under an eave. The left speaker is only 4 feet horizontally covered by it (to the West side). The height of the eave is 8 feet. Putting the drivers way op there would ofcourse be best practice for protecting them, not in the least against the sun. Rain is one thing, but waterproofing doesn't do very much against the harmful sun rays. The drivers face South side, but in that direction, the eave is like 20 feet.

I'd put the woofer above the SEOS, so the acoustic center is not as high up. I will make a design for that. Very tall probably...

I also looked for weather resistant drivers. B&C claims their coaxial speakers are all treated with coating, like the 12FHX76:
http://www.bcspeakers.com/products/coaxial/12-0/12fhx76

Another good one is the Beyma 12CXA400Nd (also available as Ferro). It's specs say it goes down to 35 Hz. Would need a big cabinet to get that low, I presume.
http://www.beyma.com/products/coaxials/112CXA4ND8

Putting a grill over these would not affect the high frequencies to much?
Check out this build thread:
http://billfitzmaurice.info/forum/vi...=21754&start=0

There are a number of weatherproof builds you can find on that site as they're more pro audio oriented.
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post #10980 of 12190 Old 08-07-2014, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erwinfrombelgium View Post
They are indeed under an eave. The left speaker is only 4 feet horizontally covered by it (to the West side). The height of the eave is 8 feet. Putting the drivers way op there would ofcourse be best practice for protecting them, not in the least against the sun. Rain is one thing, but waterproofing doesn't do very much against the harmful sun rays. The drivers face South side, but in that direction, the eave is like 20 feet.

I'd put the woofer above the SEOS, so the acoustic center is not as high up. I will make a design for that. Very tall probably...

I also looked for weather resistant drivers. B&C claims their coaxial speakers are all treated with coating, like the 12FHX76:
http://www.bcspeakers.com/products/coaxial/12-0/12fhx76

Another good one is the Beyma 12CXA400Nd (also available as Ferro). It's specs say it goes down to 35 Hz. Would need a big cabinet to get that low, I presume.
http://www.beyma.com/products/coaxials/112CXA4ND8

Putting a grill over these would not affect the high frequencies to much?
Check out this build thread (using PVC and protecting driver):
http://billfitzmaurice.info/forum/vi...=21754&start=0

There are a number of weatherproof builds you can find on that site as they're more pro audio oriented.
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