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DIY Speakers and Subs

beastaudio's Avatar beastaudio
12:35 PM Liked: 1110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post
Beast, if you were going to have a small side business selling coaxial kits, and my stuff was making you mad, why didn't you send me an email and let me know? I wouldn't have sold them! You probably don't believe that though.

But I had a bunch of ported flat packs cut and ready to put on the site. Forum member Chalugadp sent me a PM and said he was hoping to sell flat packs to make some extra money and even mentioned openly on the forum that I held off and didn't list them so he could do that!!

I've been sitting on pallets of large ported subwoofer flat packs for about a year because another forum member wanted to sell something similar!!

He has recently said he was done with it, so I will try to get them listed when I have time.



Again, you've been given some bad info, or misunderstood something and you've let it dig at you for a while.
I will believe that, and it was very nice of you. I perhaps was not as vocal about my plans so I can't really hold that against you. Our timelines were somewhat similar on the designs and you won out. I saw a business opportunity that I didn't develop fast enough, my own fault.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doradoguy View Post
Beast Audio
You are getting the funds back to cover your lost truck, so you may again purchase a new one. Once the new truck has been purchased, hopefully you are fully back in the black. Once you buy "your own personal truck again" then subsequent sales will be considered profit. This was my ENTIRE point. You SHOULD profit. You deserve it.

Hypothetical
20,000 to order 1000 drivers
20,000 for truck to cover cost
20,000 in sales of 1000 drivers
Zero profit Trucks paid back.
no drivers left
the end

I'm not trying to start an argument but it's possible he is only recovering the loss of his truck and potentially zero profit.
Again, my hope was that more drivers would come, $20,000 more in sales of 1000 more drivers, $20,000 more in Erich's pocket. He deserves to make money off his hard work.
Doradoguy
12:46 PM Liked: 12
post #12332 of 12349
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My previous question was how musical the 1899 was and how did it compared to the Sentinel; Second question was should I wait for the 1899 and what was the price point. Given he was only running one 1899 it seemed to be a mute question and he did respond with they are loud. Since then Erich has updated his site with ball park pricing. Thank you for that. In the end I chose to go with the Sentinels because all I have heard about the 1899 is they're loud. I'm in on the group by with 4 uxl so full range wasn't necessary and what reviews I have read on the Sentinels was great. So three Sentinels, eight Volt10-xl's, Four 18 uxl and one SI 24 shall keep me busy for my first build.

So my last question to Erich if you must know. Is when can I expect the third sentinel to be available and should I wait to have them shipped all at once.

Now I'm sharing YEE HAA.
Doradoguy
12:48 PM Liked: 12
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Man this thread has taken off.
eng-399's Avatar eng-399
01:19 PM Liked: 16
post #12334 of 12349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doradoguy View Post
My previous question was how musical the 1899 was and how did it compared to the Sentinel; Second question was should I wait for the 1899 and what was the price point. Given he was only running one 1899 it seemed to be a mute question and he did respond with they are loud. Since then Erich has updated his site with ball park pricing. Thank you for that. In the end I chose to go with the Sentinels because all I have heard about the 1899 is they're loud. I'm in on the group by with 4 uxl so full range wasn't necessary and what reviews I have read on the Sentinels was great. So three Sentinels, eight Volt10-xl's, Four 18 uxl and one SI 24 shall keep me busy for my first build.

So my last question to Erich if you must know. Is when can I expect the third sentinel to be available and should I wait to have them shipped all at once.

Now I'm sharing YEE HAA.
Wow that's a nice set up!!!! Your room is going to rock
pbc's Avatar pbc
01:22 PM Liked: 40
post #12335 of 12349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbc View Post
What the heck?
Just thought I'd quote myself, since I'm still at the same state of disbelief. I recall when I first forayed into the DIY section back in 2008 or 2009 when I was thinking of building my own sub. Wondering if I'd look like a fool (I did with many of the questions), run into elitist minds who would push me back to the brick and mortar sub forum. Instead I found a group of incredibly helpful individuals who, barring very very few, didn't insult anyone and lived to help newbs and learn from experienced posters alike.

Hopefully we can get back to that and get this thread back on track.

"More data, less wank". Please.
Mfusick's Avatar Mfusick
01:28 PM Liked: 1322
post #12336 of 12349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doradoguy View Post
My previous question was how musical the 1899 was and how did it compared to the Sentinel; Second question was should I wait for the 1899 and what was the price point. Given he was only running one 1899 it seemed to be a mute question and he did respond with they are loud. Since then Erich has updated his site with ball park pricing. Thank you for that. In the end I chose to go with the Sentinels because all I have heard about the 1899 is they're loud. I'm in on the group by with 4 uxl so full range wasn't necessary and what reviews I have read on the Sentinels was great. So three Sentinels, eight Volt10-xl's, Four 18 uxl and one SI 24 shall keep me busy for my first build.

So my last question to Erich if you must know. Is when can I expect the third sentinel to be available and should I wait to have them shipped all at once.

Now I'm sharing YEE HAA.
I've never heard them both at same time, or even ever the 1899 but the few times I heard the Fusion 15 or the SEOS 15" with DNA360 I thought they sounded great. There is a nice big sweet spot with those waveguides, and something nice about 15" midbass on music. I have no doubt the 1899 could be MOAR but I guess that really only matters if you need it. It's more money, and it's a lot bigger. But hey, that could be cool. Practicality tells me you'll be really happy with the FUSION 15 you ordered and don't need the 1899. But the excessive side of me wants to tell you to order enough so you can use them for surrounds too. My gut tells me the Fusion15 sounds better because there is less to go wrong, it's a lot more complicated to cross two 18", a 12" and a waveguide. It's possible to have too much of a good thing I think. But I never heard it, so it might be the best sounding speaker in the world.. IDK. That speaker just looks like bad ass but I'd question if you needed it. You'll die before you find it's limits indoors. I doubt many people have heard them both, I'd assume even Erich hasn't had them back to back, so your question might not be very easy to answer. This is the kind of stuff that probably really taxes him and his time. It does take some effort to give an intelligent response on something that's not black and white and easy to answer. Exactly the kind of questions for threads and not emails.
Fatshaft's Avatar Fatshaft
02:23 PM Liked: 307
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How many words can you type per minute???

Just incredible...
Rybaudio's Avatar Rybaudio
03:04 PM Liked: 10
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General question: which of the following are available and where/how do I get them?

SEOS-10 plastic (B-stock on DIYSG?)
SEOS-12 plastic (DIYSG, Parts Express?)
SEOS-15 plastic
DNA-360

Also, what are the future plans for these items? If available now, will they continue to be in the foreseeable future? If not available, when will they be?

Is there a place where the status of the various projects are tracked? I've been keeping an eye on this thread/project for years and it's always a struggle to find out what is going on after being away for a little while.

Thanks for any help!
Eyleron's Avatar Eyleron
04:03 PM Liked: 77
post #12339 of 12349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post
That's part of the transition from a group buy to a proper business.
I'll throw this idea out there again. There are other organizational/business models than:
  • garage effort for group buys for a few folk as a hobby
  • full-fledged business for ownership profit

As an alternative to the above, there's:
  • Co-op businesses where customer-members take profits (small sports clubs, electric co-ops, insurance, etc.)
  • Nonprofit membership associations, where no profit goes to any 'ownership.' Revenue pays for operations (including staff salaries etc.) and profit would go to further the nonprofit cause (develop new drivers, new designs, the growth of designers, research, etc.). A member might be a designer, a customer, both.
  • Company whose purpose is to sell and "crowd-fund" speaker designers. Etsy, Kickstarter, etc. come to mind. Much benefit goes to designers, the company takes the fee for infrastructure, marketing, operations, fulfillment, etc.
  • 501c3 for scientific purposes (this might have to exclude the purchasing of product component, but could fund research, testing?)
  • ...I'm sure there are more models.

Typically there's a board, there are committees of board members and volunteers and staff, and there are directives in bylaws for how to operate.

The point is, to have an organization with a higher purpose than "make money", that does have a facility for group contribution, whose raison d'existance is the community.
You can still have volunteers, a couple staff who are compensated for their time, a director, oversight, products, sales, discounts, etc. But key is the perception, which as we've seen, people can be sensitive about.
beastaudio's Avatar beastaudio
04:15 PM Liked: 1110
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I like the idea of your first two alternative bullet points for sure. Either would be an excellent direction IMO for DIYSG to go. They both retain the ability to consistently move forward and offer great product/service to their target markets, while driving research and developement into further, and better endeavors.
lukeamdman's Avatar lukeamdman
05:03 PM Liked: 271
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Erich, any word on that shipment of DNA-150s?
Erich H's Avatar Erich H
05:19 PM Liked: 909
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post
Saying all the compression drivers are packed up in kits doesn't make a lot of sense either. You have someone that wants to buy something, and you seem to have a lot of money tied up in inventory, yet you don't sell it and let it sit on a shelf longer than it should. That's bad business 101.

One of the constants whether it was electronics, cars, or whatever... you need to turn your inventory. And that was the foundation of my objection to the excuse you can't sell CD's because they are all packed up in kits. Good business 101 is turning your inventory quickly.
It's strange you say bad business is sitting on inventory, but then you want me to sell my remaining compression drivers which would leave kit inventory that can't be sold.

Oddly enough, if I had the entire speaker kit you wanted, but not the compression driver because I sold it to Jimmy.....then you'd say "It's bad business 101 to sit on an entire kits inventory without a driver."

I put aside a certain number of drivers for a certain number of complete kits. If I buy woofers and crossover parts for twenty Fusion-12 kits, I put twenty DNA-360's aside for those kits and put 20 of them in stock on the site. That way when the Fusion-12 is out of stock, there are still other kits available that use the same compression driver.




Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
You are getting the funds back to cover your truck, so you may again purchase a new one. Once the new truck has been purchased, hopefully you are fully back in the black. Once you buy "your own personal truck again" then subsequent sales will be considered profit.
That's not really correct.

There was a group buy set up to cover the costs of 1000 SEOS-12's. No one has ever asked whose buying them the second time when the 1000 waveguides are all gone.

If I put $15,000 into a project from a truck sale, when does it come back out of the project? If I do take it out after all the initial parts are sold, how does it get done again?
beastaudio's Avatar beastaudio
05:38 PM Liked: 1110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post
That's not really correct.

There was a group buy set up to cover the costs of 1000 SEOS-12's. No one has ever asked whose buying them the second time when the 1000 waveguides are all gone.

If I put $15,000 into a project from a truck sale, when does it come back out of the project? If I do take it out after all the initial parts are sold, how does it get done again?
Well, hopefully once you get those first 1000 horns sold! You and I both know the SEOS-12 is a fantastic horn that will sell I have three of them myself! They vaulted my own theater to a new level coupled with the TD12x's that I put them with thanks to @bwaslo and his fantastic design. I did choose to upgrade a couple XO parts to more premium, less latent caps, but that was it. I still have them, while not in use, I really enjoyed them for the time they were in the theater.

With hopes that the next order will be a little easier on your wallet, and you not having to sacrifice another vee-hickle, I would hope you pocket some dough in the long-run. As I have said, you deserve it to say the least....
chrapladm's Avatar chrapladm
06:13 PM Liked: 130
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WOW....an I post pad also Anyways after looking at some older designs and parts I have does anyone know the best place to get a 3012LF?

Not sure how long PE has ha them out of stock but no word on when they will be in stock either. Not on any hurry just asking in case I missed something about Eminence not making these anymore or something. Erich you deal with Eminence a lot so I didnt know if you would know.
Eyleron's Avatar Eyleron
06:25 PM Liked: 77
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I think the problem is that once Erich pulls the personal money back out (to pay for truck etc.), the account is missing funds to make the next buy.

So either he always lags financially, a margin pays it back and funds new buys, or we customers pre-pay.
Thatsnasty's Avatar Thatsnasty
06:30 PM Liked: 35
post #12346 of 12349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrapladm View Post
WOW....an I post pad also Anyways after looking at some older designs and parts I have does anyone know the best place to get a 3012LF?

Not sure how long PE has ha them out of stock but no word on when they will be in stock either. Not on any hurry just asking in case I missed something about Eminence not making these anymore or something. Erich you deal with Eminence a lot so I didnt know if you would know.
http://www.usspeaker.com/kappalite3012lf-1.htm
http://www.amazon.com/Eminence-Neody.../dp/B001U1PK94

Or this.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eminence-Kap...item257dcdbace

Has a "buy it now" option for 190, plus you can make an offer and probably get it cheaper with free shipping.
Note: I have never bought from them before but it seems legit enough.
Boxozaxu's Avatar Boxozaxu
06:33 PM Liked: 121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fatshaft View Post
How many words can you type per minute???

Just incredible...
Stenographers can't type as fast as Mike. And Erich wouldn’t have an email problem if he could only type half as fast.
Nabukicks's Avatar Nabukicks
06:53 PM Liked: 36
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I challenge anyone who needs a single part from a kit, to order the whole kit, and see how long it takes to sell off the remaining incomplete kit, or remaining individual parts of the kit. If/when that is done, post back your findings on 1. How long it took to sell every part. 2. Did you end up making money on selling the parts, break even, or lose money. And 3. Would you consider doing that consistently with thousands and thousands of your own personal money tied up in it, all in your free time.

When all is done, please direct your appreciation and gratitude to @Erich H for all the work he does. While his site may not cater to the needs of every individual advanced DIYer, he does a ridiculously good job of helping newcomers get their feet wet in the hobby. Who knows what future designs could come from someone that started DIY speaker building with a kit.

Thanks Erich for being awesome and organizing DIYSG!
Mfusick's Avatar Mfusick
07:01 PM Liked: 1322
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxozaxu View Post
Stenographers can't type as fast as Mike. And Erich wouldn’t have an email problem if he could only type half as fast.
Both probably true. I'm self taught surprisingly.

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