Group Buy for 6.5" Anarchy Tapped Horn. - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 424 Old 05-11-2011, 06:52 PM
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Anybody know if the foster plate amps are still available?
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post #362 of 424 Old 05-11-2011, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by habermas View Post

Anybody know if the foster plate amps are still available?

Unfortunately, they're all sold out: http://home.comcast.net/~jhidley/
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post #363 of 424 Old 05-11-2011, 09:35 PM - Thread Starter
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post #364 of 424 Old 05-15-2011, 10:20 AM
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What type of sound should I use to break-in these 6.5" drivers before installing them in the cabinet?

If I'm using a tone generator from my laptop to my 75watt stereo amp with the drivers in free air, is a continuous sine wave at 45Hz for 20 hours good enough?

Should I use a different frequency ?

Any specific procedure would be appreciated.

Thanks
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post #365 of 424 Old 05-15-2011, 10:40 AM
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That should be fine.
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post #366 of 424 Old 05-15-2011, 11:49 AM
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What's a good voltage level to drive the Anarachy drivers ?

I'll be driving them with a parasound HCA 750 stereo amp.
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post #367 of 424 Old 05-15-2011, 12:38 PM
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I just set the frequency near resonance, then turn up the amp till the cones are moving pretty well. If you hear bad noises, that's too much....

Be sure they are mounted securely.
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post #368 of 424 Old 05-16-2011, 07:55 AM
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Just my experience. I assembled my two kits this weekend. I gotta say, I really reccomend using standard wood glue over PL premium. I used the PL premuim first, and the problem I had is that the PL is quite thick. This is good for making sure the joint is sealed, but it's also harder to make sure that the board is seated into the dado properly. On the second one I used wood glue. Some might have a concern that it won't seal as well, but as long as you use enough glue that shouldn't be an issue, IMHO.

Now they're together and hooked up. I'm playing with the crossover and level settings right now. These are my first subwoofers, other than the sony one I had from the HTIB. So far the bass is stronger, but it still sounds a bit boomy... Not sure if it's a setup issue, a break-in issue, a construction issue, a sound material issue (what I'm playing). But I'll keep tweaking and see what works.
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post #369 of 424 Old 05-16-2011, 09:55 AM
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BigZ

When you applied the PL bead of glue into the dado, what was the size of the bead (approx diameter)? Was it larger than 1/4inch ?

Did you use pipe clamps to hold the joint together? Did you use screws or a brad nailer to tighten the fit ?


Mine are unpacked and sitting on the kitchen table while I break in the drivers. I'm trying to make space in the basement or garage for an assembly area, but I'm a bit busy at work.

Anybody else who has assembled one of these kits, what are your impressions ?
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post #370 of 424 Old 05-16-2011, 10:23 AM
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Wood glue may work with the CNC flat packs, but I STRONGLY recommend PL. Any leaks will absolutely kill the performance of these cabinets. The expansion of the PL is key here. Not all the joints are square. Wood glue works great with a straight edge and square corner, but will not fill gaps, so the seams should all be caulked. Caulking is impossible once the second side is installed. There are ways to seal things, but I prefer to handle it with proper assembly.

I know working with PL is messy, it is nasty stuff. My hands are stained every time I do a build, even if I wear gloves. I am not stingy with the PL, I typically use a flattened bead, less than 1/8" tall, approximately 1/4" wide, when I assemble cabinets. I look for squeeze-out along the entire joint as I fasten the panels together. I don't glop it on either, I built the entire F-20 with a just over one tube (I got into the second tube for the last panel when gluing the second side on and doing the access panel flange). I can get two Anarchy-sized cabinets out of a tube and a half.

I'll admit - I've not built one of these flat-packs, but I have built several with dadoed sides now, and had no trouble at all with the PL in the dadoes, provided the grooves are clean.

Sure, I had issues, as usual. It seems that I always do when I experiment with my own stuff. That's how you learn.

I had problems with the design, but that was all my fault. Also had a few issues with the construction - but again - that's all me. Note to self - double-check your cutlist against your plans before you cut wood.....and run the tracksaw on the correct groove.....and double check your folds before you cut any wood.....

See - I make all the mistakes so you don't have to....
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post #371 of 424 Old 05-16-2011, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceD View Post
BigZ

When you applied the PL bead of glue into the dado, what was the size of the bead (approx diameter)? Was it larger than 1/4inch ?

Did you use pipe clamps to hold the joint together? Did you use screws or a brad nailer to tighten the fit ?


Mine are unpacked and sitting on the kitchen table while I break in the drivers. I'm trying to make space in the basement or garage for an assembly area, but I'm a bit busy at work.

Anybody else who has assembled one of these kits, what are your impressions ?
Either choice of adhesive is fine. I have built a couple with each and they seal up just peachy. The clamps are a great idea to have but you could get away with a stack of flocks or a tool box or my dear aunt Martha's backside. The beauty of the Kit is that there is little need to use excessive glue or force while building. A brad nailer can be used if you so desire, but I had great success just gluing and clamping. A good Idea as you go might be to put the top on a couple of times during assembly to make sure you are getting a nice alignment on everything as it dries. You can literally build one if these in under an hour if you wish.

Move them around a bit and try a couple of orientations when you get down to firing them up. If you do I think you will find it's sweet spot pretty quickly. They are cool little subs.
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post #372 of 424 Old 05-16-2011, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Flanery View Post

Either choice of adhesive is fine. I have built a couple with each and they seal up just peachy. The clamps are a great idea to have but you could get away with a stack of flocks or a tool box or my dear aunt Martha's backside. The beauty of the Kit is that there is little need to use excessive glue or force while building. A brad nailer can be used if you so desire, but I had great success just gluing and clamping. A good Idea as you go might be to put the top on a couple of times during assembly to make sure you are getting a nice alignment on everything as it dries. You can literally build one if these in under an hour if you wish.

Move them around a bit and try a couple of orientations when you get down to firing them up. If you do I think you will find it's sweet spot pretty quickly. They are cool little subs.

I totally agree. If you do the build correctly either adhesive will work. I used the pre-drill/screw method, following the instructions, with PL on my first build. I forgot to pre-drill the third fold (I) to bottom of throat piece (K) before placing PL and didn't notice the corner of K (at K/C) was up about 1 mm until a few minutes after placement. I tried to re-drill and force it down to no avail, but ultimately it was no big deal. In this case using the PL paid off and I am absolutely confident it is sealed. See attached pics.... the gap is not readily visible, but I didn't try to capture it, and most of my photos were blurry anyway. I got a little clamp/strap happy at the end for piece of mind. My second build will be with PL adhesive as well. No matter what lilmike says, there is always room for more mistakes.

This thing is smoooth, pushing it with a Rotel RB-1050 (70 wpc) power amp, MIC2200 rigged as a quasi-24db/octave hpf, used aRTA to get the best dropoff around 25 Hz I could. Musical Bliss, not Home Thunder.
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post #373 of 424 Old 05-16-2011, 07:33 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm really glad these turned out so well.


I do have some more of these if anyone wants to try one, or wants an extra one.
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post #374 of 424 Old 05-17-2011, 07:26 PM
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Going to be building mine soon. Two questions:

What is everyone finishing these with? Paint? Stain? Veneer? I was thinking stain, because it's the only thing I have any experience with. What kind of stain works well?

Also, the original guy to build this design used "acoustical cotton" in all of the corners. Is that necessary? If so, where do you get that stuff?
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post #375 of 424 Old 05-18-2011, 04:43 AM
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Two additional questions:

1. Everybody is confident without an access door? I'm not, ex what if the solder on driver terminal breaks? I was thinking about cutting the D panel above the driver with a very thin saw, adding a backing piece along the cut and screwing the cut panel to the cabinet in the grooves with some kind of strip to prevent leakages
2. I would use T nuts for driver fixing, at least 4, it cost nothing and is much stronger, maybe an overkill solution
Chris
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post #376 of 424 Old 05-18-2011, 04:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KRZYS View Post

Two additional questions:

1. Everybody is confident without an access door? I'm not, ex what if the solder on driver terminal breaks? I was thinking about cutting the D panel above the driver with a very thin saw, adding a backing piece along the cut and screwing the cut panel to the cabinet in the grooves with some kind of strip to prevent leakages
2. I would use T nuts for driver fixing, at least 4, it cost nothing and is much stronger, maybe an overkill solution
Chris

Not me, I would never build an enclosure with the hopes that the driver will never, ever fail or a connection will come loose. I always build with the future in mind. My enclosures always have access doors.
I also always build using T nuts or hurricane nuts. Just make sure that you epoxy or glue the nuts in place and run a tap through them to clean out the threads.
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post #377 of 424 Old 05-18-2011, 06:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sproulle View Post

Going to be building mine soon. Two questions:

What is everyone finishing these with? Paint? Stain? Veneer? I was thinking stain, because it's the only thing I have any experience with. What kind of stain works well?

Also, the original guy to build this design used "acoustical cotton" in all of the corners. Is that necessary? If so, where do you get that stuff?

I finished the two I put upstairs in the living room with Minwax Mahogany stain and then gave them two coats of Clear Satin finish. They look good from the seating area and not too bad up close, but I will have to take them down and sand them out and give them a finish coat at a later date. I just kind of got them done and into use due to a time restraint on our house warming. Listening to them right now with Jazz streamed over FIOS they have a nice punch without being overwhelming and seem to go well with the speakers I have. I really do need to EQ them rather than just using Audessey.

As far as access panels... I never cut them. I can always go back in with a track saw or router and cut one if it is needed. I have much too much confidence in my superior crafts skills. Read that as I have no skill and very little confidence in anything I build. But I will deal with it when it happens.

So far these little guys just plain kick. I am driving two of them in the living room of my house with an Audiosource AMP-100 in bridged mode for each and they do a great job with music and TV. I would say that they are a great choice for casual use spaces. I intend to add two more to the back of the room at some point but there are a lot of other projects on the table right now and the two I have running now really don't need the help.

BTW The Audiosource AMP-100 seems to be a great choice with this sub. I run the amp bridged at about 70% output and I am satisfied with the results. We recently had a lot of people in the house and they were all very impressed with the sound from them.
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post #378 of 424 Old 05-18-2011, 07:58 AM
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Has anyone else had issues witht he AMP? I get a popping noise intermittingly, as well as a bit of a screech when the amp first clicks on.

I'm playing around with the idea of wrapping the BB box with 1/2" MDF. This should have a couple of purposes- first it'll make doubly sure the seams around the main panels are sealed, it'll add more weight to the boxes, which is aways good, and finally it'll give a perfectly flat surface for veneer to be added.
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post #379 of 424 Old 05-18-2011, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigguyZ View Post

Has anyone else had issues witht he AMP? I get a popping noise intermittingly, as well as a bit of a screech when the amp first clicks on.

Not seen or heard that. I get a small pop when I turn it on or off from time to time but nothing malicious.

[/quote]I'm playing around with the idea of wrapping the BB box with 1/2" MDF. This should have a couple of purposes- first it'll make doubly sure the seams around the main panels are sealed, it'll add more weight to the boxes, which is aways good, and finally it'll give a perfectly flat surface for veneer to be added.[/quote]

The first test unit I built from scratch I used around 60 wood screws to assemble it. I am thinking of using up some flooring cement I had left over from our renovation and cutting a nice sheet of Luan and adhering it to the outside of the box. Then I could add a nice stain and get something better than son of Frankenstein. As it stands it will be destined for the Garage.
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post #380 of 424 Old 05-23-2011, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigguyZ View Post

Has anyone else had issues witht he AMP? I get a popping noise intermittingly, as well as a bit of a screech when the amp first clicks on.

I'm playing around with the idea of wrapping the BB box with 1/2" MDF. This should have a couple of purposes- first it'll make doubly sure the seams around the main panels are sealed, it'll add more weight to the boxes, which is aways good, and finally it'll give a perfectly flat surface for veneer to be added.

I'm getting the same boomy/hollow sound that you mentioned in your previous post. Admittedly I just finished building them a couple of days ago so perhaps they need some more break-in. I haven't played with placement either although I don't think that's the issue. Also I haven't eq'ed them so they're operating out of their max 100hz comfort zone thus more distortion. I suspect the boomy/hollow sound is emanating mostly from > 100hz thus some sort of low pass filter is needed so that the midrange isn't compromised. Nevertheless, filters or not, I plan to take steps to make the cabinet less resonant maybe by adding another layer of something, contrained damping layer, MDF..... . Might as well since they're here and shipping weight is no longer a concern. Can't hurt.

Once I get them eq'ed, I sure that they'll be fine. Already they have made a positive impact and once they're fully tweaked, I'll be happy.
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post #381 of 424 Old 05-24-2011, 09:08 AM
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I've had my pair sitting for a couple weeks now, just need the time to put them together.

Before I do I need to figure out access door. I know it has been said some don't think its necessary, but I am curious of what others are doing for an access door.

I've been toying with a few options.

1. Cutting a hole big enough to fit the largest diameter of the driver. Slap another piece of wood on the back. (A full size cutout leaves little room for a routered insert.)

2. Cutting a rectangle panel the width of the driver, and slide the driver in and tilt it once halfway in the box. Height of the panel is overall slimmer and there is room for a routered overlap. (Been playing around in CAD to get this working with enough room)

3. Using a metal plate for the panel. Thinner, less need for routered insert, possible cooling benefits?
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post #382 of 424 Old 05-24-2011, 09:35 AM
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4. Install the driver during construction when you have plenty of room to move about. Wait for the day you need to replace the driver and cut a hole big enough to remove and reinstall the driver. Fashion a cover for the hole.
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post #383 of 424 Old 05-24-2011, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nigel1004 View Post

I've had my pair sitting for a couple weeks now, just need the time to put them together.

Before I do I need to figure out access door. I know it has been said some don't think its necessary, but I am curious of what others are doing for an access door.

I've been toying with a few options.

1. Cutting a hole big enough to fit the largest diameter of the driver. Slap another piece of wood on the back. (A full size cutout leaves little room for a routered insert.)

2. Cutting a rectangle panel the width of the driver, and slide the driver in and tilt it once halfway in the box. Height of the panel is overall slimmer and there is room for a routered overlap. (Been playing around in CAD to get this working with enough room)

3. Using a metal plate for the panel. Thinner, less need for routered insert, possible cooling benefits?

If you really need an access cover, one can be added.

Cut the back panel essentially in half, so that the seam is just above the driver cutout. I don't have an exact measurement, but can get one later tonight when I am home from work.

Install 1/8" thick X 1" leg aluminum angle (sides and bottom) and 2" X 1/8" aluminum flat bar (top) as mounting flanges inside the panel, like I did with my Shiva X2 Tapped horn build. I used screws and PL.

Drill and tap mounting holes through the aluminum flange (I suggest 10-24, because the 10-32 threads in the Shiva have started to strip, but I have pulled the cover 4 or 5 times now).

To mark the proper locations to drill the cover, thread the screws in from the inside, set the panel in place, and tap it lightly with a hammer to mark the locations to drill the mounting holes.

Be sure to seal it well, weatherstrip tape alone did not work on the Shiva, I had to use some duct-seal in the corners. If you're interested in this approach, I can try to find some pictures tonight.
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post #384 of 424 Old 05-24-2011, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sproulle View Post

Going to be building mine soon. Two questions:

What is everyone finishing these with? Paint? Stain? Veneer? I was thinking stain, because it's the only thing I have any experience with. What kind of stain works well?

Also, the original guy to build this design used "acoustical cotton" in all of the corners. Is that necessary? If so, where do you get that stuff?

Use a sealer before staining birch, or it will be blotchy. I prefer oil-based stains and polyurethane myself.

I tested lots of different batting and acoustical absorbers when I built the Shiva tapped horn last year. Nothing worked well enough below 120 Hz to worry about using it. The bonded acoustic cotton that was used initially is typically used for air ducts. You could use poly quilt batting from the fabric store instead of the cotton if you wanted, I don't bother with batting any more.
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post #385 of 424 Old 05-25-2011, 09:43 AM
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Has anyone else got a rattle if you push them too much? It sucks because you can't see what is going on inside and I really don't want to cut a hole. I have one that can go pretty load but the other not so much...
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post #386 of 424 Old 05-25-2011, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by handsomepete View Post

Has anyone else got a rattle if you push them too much? It sucks because you can't see what is going on inside and I really don't want to cut a hole. I have one that can go pretty load but the other not so much...

Maybe the driver got loose from the baffle or it may be blown. Are they HP'd at least 25hz?

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post #387 of 424 Old 05-25-2011, 10:30 AM
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They are HP'd at 30hz. Maybe they are loose but I doubt it. Would a blown driver sound ok sometimes?
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post #388 of 424 Old 05-25-2011, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by handsomepete View Post

Would a blown driver sound ok sometimes?

Not that I've heard myself. A blown driver wouldn't sound good sometimes. A good driver would sound good and a blown driver wouldn't.

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post #389 of 424 Old 05-25-2011, 11:36 AM
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You can check things by reaching inside. Not the most convenient, but this is how I check for excursion issues.

I've never had a blown driver sound good sometimes. When I kill things, I kill them dead...

Have you swapped the amp?
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post #390 of 424 Old 05-25-2011, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by handsomepete View Post

They are HP'd at 30hz. Maybe they are loose but I doubt it. Would a blown driver sound ok sometimes?

I forgot to ask, how much power you're putting into them?

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