8x 18" LMS Ultra 5400s in 4 sealed enclosures - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 518 Old 02-16-2011, 10:52 PM - Thread Starter
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These things are huge



All installed.







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post #92 of 518 Old 02-16-2011, 10:55 PM
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not only does it apparently sound so much better, but looks much better. there's the dream right there.
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post #93 of 518 Old 02-16-2011, 10:57 PM
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Omg

Ssseexxxxxyyy!

My Dual 18" LLT subs 120dB down to 10hz

 

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post #94 of 518 Old 02-16-2011, 11:29 PM
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A pet peeve of mine is when logos are not alligned . But heck, if I could afford a full setup like that, I'll be more than happy live with it. Awesome build. I was quite surprised how dense the stuffing was for each cabinet. Looking foward to some measurements. Again...awesome build.

You'll rarely hear anyone say, "I wish I'd gotten less Sub."

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post #95 of 518 Old 02-16-2011, 11:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Way smoother than the maelstroms.

This is without any smoothing, one pass of audyssey for the eq'd plot.

I'm waiting for whatever truck is outside to leave so I can run a full 8 audyssey passes.

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post #96 of 518 Old 02-16-2011, 11:54 PM
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Damn. That's pretty good right there.

My Dual 18" LLT subs 120dB down to 10hz

 

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post #97 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 12:26 AM
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We all know what you have went through in the past weeks with this. My question is, "Are you glad that you had to go through it?" You went through mental states of who knows what, pissed of states I'm sure, thoughts about how much more money was going to be spent on these, and down time as well. So, if the Mals would have worked just fine but the seller came to you with an offer to change them for the price difference would you go through it all again?
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post #98 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 12:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post

Way smoother than the maelstroms.

This is without any smoothing, one pass of audyssey for the eq'd plot.

I'm waiting for whatever truck is outside to leave so I can run a full 8 audyssey passes.


what all do you have going on down in the sub 10hz area?
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post #99 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 12:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiovideoholic View Post

what all do you have going on down in the sub 10hz area?

Most likely a bit of room gain there.

I'm glad I ended up with the LMS at the moment. I'll update this thread as time progresses
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post #100 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 01:45 AM - Thread Starter
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THD @ 10hz. I'll take a louder one when the wife isn't asleep. I also notice due to the limited range of the radio shack mic, as you change levels, it increases the noise floor. I calibrated in the 100db range, and the noise floor was much higher.

Anyway, 10hz, there is no audible distortion. I think I may have been hitting the limits for this calibration range as well. Even 10db past here it just sounds perfectly clean. Incredible.

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post #101 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 01:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TnTBigman View Post

A pet peeve of mine is when logos are not alligned . But heck, if I could afford a full setup like that, I'll be more than happy live with it. Awesome build. I was quite surprised how dense the stuffing was for each cabinet. Looking foward to some measurements. Again...awesome build.

Me too, but my cabinets already had holes drilled in them from the maelstroms. I didn't think there was a need to add more, especially since you can't even see the logos with the lights on high unless you're standing right in front of the subs. The large surrounds cast a shadow over them. The pictures that show the logos are two second prolonged exposures. Keep in mind this is my theater room, and as such, is dark

As for stuffing, I went for about 1lb per cuft.
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post #102 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 02:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mjaudio View Post

They have pretty stiff suspension when new so they will fill out even more after they loosen up. Not sure exactly how long it takes, I just remember playing the same music about a week later at the same level and feeling the bass hit Much harder from my office on the other side of the house, definitely got my attention.

Outstanding build once again notnyt!

Thank you Having two spiders will definitely do that I'll be re-eqing in a week anyway once I get the right couch that I ordered, instead of the one they gave me that doesn't recline. That happened the same time I got the maelstroms running about a month ago. Two clusterfcuks at once, I was a bit mad.
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post #103 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 05:09 AM
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Awesome!

Congrats on a great setup!

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post #104 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 05:24 AM
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Wow, subs check. It looks like you never have to consider subs again. The only possible upgrade is more power. I doubt you would need it at real world listening levels.

Enjoy.

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post #105 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post

THD @ 10hz. I'll take a louder one when the wife isn't asleep. I also notice due to the limited range of the radio shack mic, as you change levels, it increases the noise floor. I calibrated in the 100db range, and the noise floor was much higher.

Anyway, 10hz, there is no audible distortion. I think I may have been hitting the limits for this calibration range as well. Even 10db past here it just sounds perfectly clean. Incredible.



WOW. Over reference at 10Hz with little to no distortion. Very nice, notnyt. As someone mentioned above, you will never again want for subwoofage. If you do, you will likely never be satisfied until you essentially detonate claymore mines inside the room....

Now throw in the Incredible Hulk and give us listening impressions, and more THD graphs....

JSS
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post #106 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 05:49 AM
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Excellent NotNyt - as stated give it a week or two depending on how much usage and youll def notice a difference after they loosen up, maybe even a bit longer.... I was givin a number like 50-100 hours, which seemed awefully long, but I did notice things opening up and becoming more effortless after a good deal of time went by. Congrats on the sizable upgrade !!! Once you have the LMS's theres no going back, everything else is just sloppy IMO
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post #107 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TnTBigman View Post

A pet peeve of mine is when logos are not alligned . But heck, if I could afford a full setup like that, I'll be more than happy live with it. Awesome build. I was quite surprised how dense the stuffing was for each cabinet. Looking foward to some measurements. Again...awesome build.

FYI mounting logos upside down adds 3dB, jus so you know...

Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post

Way smoother than the maelstroms.


sigh

it just doesnt stop
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post #108 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 08:09 AM
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Way smoother than the maelstroms.

That also ends up leading to pushing things a bit further then you would with the Mal-X's... It just sounds so much cleaner that you end up running it hotter and wanting more...
At least thats the way my habit tends to have taken me....
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post #109 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 08:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Warpdrv View Post

That also ends up leading to pushing things a bit further then you would with the Mal-X's... It just sounds so much cleaner that you end up running it hotter and wanting more...
At least thats the way my habit tends to have taken me....

That is an interesting phenomenon. How hot is hot? Do you run the subs 3db hot and then listen at a louder volume then normal or are the subs several db hot?

I struggle with this. My current thinking is that I run the sub 3db hot. I have headroom for more but it can get odd with certain movies...car door slam hits you in the chest type stuff.

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post #110 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kryponitewhite View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post

Way smoother than the maelstroms.

sigh

it just doesnt stop

I would think that bad drivers might sound and measure poorly regardless of when they actually quit working. It isn't like there are necessarily multiple problems with the Maelstrom drivers. One problem can lead to multiple symptoms. You really can't come to any conclusion about the Maelstrom sound quality vs the LMS unless good drivers are being compared.
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post #111 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 08:52 AM
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Remember now, my room is open - think 15-20,000^3 so any of that slam or punch in the chest stuff is a bit lost in that type of arena - so I typically am running about 5-10db hot, sometimes more depending on the material... 5db hot is absolutely the minimum in order to match the feeling I'm getting at the LP in comparison to how the mains are with the material... I know that everyone likes to be txt book about stuff but it just doesn't work for me in my room with it being so open...

In my secondary system (1800^3 basically closed off) not really more then then 5db hot is my general pref, which is plenty impactful with good clean bass (LMS's) and 5-10db hot becomes, not unbearable, but it starts to cloud over the vocals with music or movies, again depending on the material - so for me its totally room dependent. I'll be looking to see how things go when I change from the Submersive to the LMS in there....We'll see if my opinion sticks, but honestly - the dirtier the bass, the more presence, or to me thickness it has which as it gets louder, less bass is needed to get the presence.... That is not always a bad thing unless your getting into solid on terrible sounding enclosures or less then acceptable sloppy drivers...

I was at my buddies house not too long ago and he has 2 subs, one right on top of the other an a rather spacious area open all over - a small sunfire dual opposed 8" I think and some ported 12", can't remember but it was just downright thick in there and I couldn't believe the amount of perceived bass that was there, thick and muddy, tons of note overhang - you could almost cut it with a knife.... IMO more distortion leads to a more perceived heaviness, giving me that less is more thought, but certainly not as accurate.
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post #112 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 09:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdome View Post

I would think that bad drivers might sound and measure poorly regardless of when they actually quit working. It isn't like there are necessarily multiple problems with the Maelstrom drivers. One problem can lead to multiple symptoms. You really can't come to any conclusion about the Maelstrom sound quality vs the LMS unless good drivers are being compared.

Actually, you can, since the problem was related to the short rings not having enough epoxy. They only came loose after a few heat cycles. The drivers still functioned as normal, even after they started to vibrate.
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post #113 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t6902wf View Post

That is an interesting phenomenon. How hot is hot? Do you run the subs 3db hot and then listen at a louder volume then normal or are the subs several db hot?

I struggle with this. My current thinking is that I run the sub 3db hot. I have headroom for more but it can get odd with certain movies...car door slam hits you in the chest type stuff.

It depends on where the car shutting the door is. It is funny how everyday things makes me think about my system. The other day getting home from the airport I was taking the kids out of their seats when my wife opened and then closed her passenger side door, it made a thump and moved my hair. This was in my garage. I thought to myself that how many people here always say that when a car door hits you it is over exaggerated, that is not true, it happens!

OK, back to this awesome build. Looks fantastic and I am jealous. It looks like I maybe changing something. That THD is awesome and the reason for these crazy builds. 1.78% at 10hz over reference is insane and perfect! I love it.

I need to measure my system to see what I get. Sorry, maxmercy, I know you have posted this but can you or NYT PM the settings so I can take some THD measurements?

Again, awesome!!!!! Hey, do you guys notice how impressive those JBL's look next to the subs They are as big as 2 subs.
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post #114 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 09:30 AM - Thread Starter
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The settings are in the title of the window capture I posted

mode spectrum, 4 samples, hanns window, 131072 point, and (missing) 87.5% max overlap
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post #115 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 09:38 AM
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Cool thanks!!! I will do this tonight.
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post #116 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

It depends on where the car shutting the door is. It is funny how everyday things makes me think about my system. The other day getting home from the airport I was taking the kids out of their seats when my wife opened and then closed her passenger side door, it made a thump and moved my hair. This was in my garage. I thought to myself that how many people here always say that when a car door hits you it is over exaggerated, that is not true, it happens!

OK, back to this awesome build. Looks fantastic and I am jealous. It looks like I maybe changing something. That THD is awesome and the reason for these crazy builds. 1.78% at 10hz over reference is insane and perfect! I love it.

I need to measure my system to see what I get. Sorry, maxmercy, I know you have posted this but can you or NYT PM the settings so I can take some THD measurements?

Again, awesome!!!!! Hey, do you guys notice how impressive those JBL's look next to the subs They are as big as 2 subs.

*laughs* Thank you, MK! I laugh about this all the time. Car door slams are loud AND have a ton of deep bass.

My Dual 18" LLT subs 120dB down to 10hz

 

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post #117 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post


It looks like I maybe changing something. That THD is awesome and the reason for these crazy builds. 1.78% at 10hz over reference is insane and perfect! I love it.

Sounds like there is going to be some sawdust flying at MK's house. Those last subs did not last long......

By the way I want to see a picture of your wife. I wonder what the most understanding women in the world looks like?

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post #118 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by t6902wf View Post

Sounds like there is going to be some sawdust flying at MK's house. Those last subs did not last long......

By the way I want to see a picture of your wife. I wonder what the most understanding women in the world looks like?

She is not understanding, I just do it. I always argue and then tell her she has the rest of the house, I have my theater. Anyways, My subs are awesome and I will measure the THD tonight which I have never done before. I assume that it will be low because it is all room gain down low.
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post #119 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 10:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Hah, my wife thinks all these upgrades are great and loves the theater
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post #120 of 518 Old 02-17-2011, 10:35 AM
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Hah, my wife thinks all these upgrades are great and loves the theater
She gets over it fast and loves the room.

Remember guys, my room is less than half the size.
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