high excursion 18's for cheap - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 91 Old 03-05-2011, 01:44 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
So I am over the high Xmax low Fs thing. Budget still a factor. Are there any 18" subs out there with at least 40mm Xmech for around $200? Like the IXL... does that have 40mm Xmech?
kryptonitewhite is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 91 Old 03-05-2011, 02:03 PM
AVS Special Member
 
michael hurd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 49th parallel
Posts: 2,116
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 26
Nope. The limiting factor most of the time is the basket, there isn't enough room behind the spider plateau.

Even if the coil isn't bottoming physically in the motor, if driven that hard, the spider will bottom on the basket. You need to step up to a driver with a bigger diameter spider and TC style basket if you want longer throw.

Like this basket:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=293-668

"You take the blue pill - the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill - you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes."
michael hurd is online now  
post #3 of 91 Old 03-05-2011, 02:29 PM
Bass Enabler
 
Scott Simonian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Clovis, CA
Posts: 13,201
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 143 Post(s)
Liked: 639
The best most immediately availabe driver I can think of is the Fi Q series. After that would be the RLp18/Mal-x but those aren't available. After that ...well, the price per driver gets pretty high. I keep hearing about a new IXL but no real details or release date.

For $200 a pop, you're options will be pretty limited.

My Dual 18" LLT subs 120dB down to 10hz

 

Plan9Reloaded Co-host

Listen to the Plan9Reloaded Gaming and Technology Podcast (may contain NSFW language)

https://soundcloud.com/plan9reloaded/sets/podcast - direct pod link

http://plan9reloaded.com/site/ - main website

Scott Simonian is online now  
post #4 of 91 Old 03-05-2011, 02:37 PM
Advanced Member
 
zora's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Walla Walla, WA
Posts: 801
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 16
I've got some custom Fi drivers. PM sent.
zora is offline  
post #5 of 91 Old 03-05-2011, 03:27 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
PM returned.

I would have gotten SSDs or Qs to begin with, but they're $100 more per driver. I'm not looking for more Xmech or Xmax anymore, I can deal with what I have, but I am on the same budget. The IB3's are 3.25" or 3.5" p-p, I use all of it, but they are discontinued I am told at least partially due to me. I could wait until they are carried over to the Blue Print Audio lineup, see if they have the same total excursion or more, same low price tag... but I think that would defeat the whole purpose. I haven't spoken with Scott, but I'd assume me switching over to the BPA IB3's would defeat the purpose of the changeover. Sure that could have been the plan all along, AA and FICA as car audio and BPA as HT...but at any rate... just looking to see if there's any comparable options out there.
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #6 of 91 Old 03-05-2011, 08:22 PM
FOH
AVS Special Member
 
FOH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Midwest
Posts: 4,745
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 208
Krypt,

As sarcasm is real tough to flesh out in a forum such as this, I can't tell if you're kidding or not. I'm actually pretty sure you're not kidding,...so what gives? How are you responsible, even in a small way, for Fi to perform this reorganization of their product line? I've read you allude to this previously, I don't get it. Trust me when I say I'm not doubting you, because dude you're out there...and I like it.



Are you under the influence of any drug right know? "I'm on a drug called....LLT, ...matter of fact, IB3-LLT. "Winning" Hell I'm bangin 7hz rocks....Epic, man Epic. Can you feel it? .... hell my neighbors can feel it sometime, ... next question"



I just realized the little cool smilie has quite the resemblance to Charlie Sheen



Thanks

------------------------------------
Flat, Deep, Clean, Linear, and Loud
------------------------------------
Active 16.8kw, 7.3 system
(3)Seaton Cat12C up front, (4)QSC K8 sides/rears
(2)Seaton SubM-HP, (4)18" IB
FOH is online now  
post #7 of 91 Old 03-05-2011, 11:27 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by FOH View Post

Krypt,

As sarcasm is real tough to flesh out in a forum such as this, I can't tell if you're kidding or not. I'm actually pretty sure you're not kidding,...so what gives? How are you responsible, even in a small way, for Fi to perform this reorganization of their product line? I've read you allude to this previously, I don't get it. Trust me when I say I'm not doubting you, because dude you're out there...and I like it.



Are you under the influence of any drug right know? "I'm on a drug called....LLT, ...matter of fact, IB3-LLT. "Winning" Hell I'm bangin 7hz rocks....Epic, man Epic. Can you feel it? .... hell my neighbors can feel it sometime, ... next question"



I just realized the little cool smilie has quite the resemblance to Charlie Sheen



Thanks

1:27AM and rolling on the floor. you?


Nick of Fi told me they dropped IB3 from the FiCar lineup becasue of "the videos" all over youtube that kids watched, went to FiCar site, clicked 12" IB3, put them in vented boxes and "turned them inside out" LOL


As out there as I am, I know full well I didn't single handedly change the lineup... but I'm going to take credit for it as long as Nick says so!
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #8 of 91 Old 03-05-2011, 11:28 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by zora View Post

I've got some custom Fi drivers. PM sent.

oh.... my... wow....
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #9 of 91 Old 03-06-2011, 01:21 AM
AVS Special Member
 
chrapladm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,529
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 54 Post(s)
Liked: 61
What are you looking at doing Krypto?
chrapladm is online now  
post #10 of 91 Old 03-06-2011, 02:02 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
To be honest, I don't really know. Maybe take some advice and run a non-IB sub and see what happens? Will I be a sell out if I do?
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #11 of 91 Old 03-06-2011, 03:01 AM
AVS Special Member
 
gperkins1973's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,519
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Jordan,

Whats with the custom FI's. PM me.

cheers

Graham
gperkins1973 is offline  
post #12 of 91 Old 03-06-2011, 05:58 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Eddie Horton's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hayden, Alabama
Posts: 1,390
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 11
If you're on the "same budget", then you need to double your waiting time to get more $. Big, bad, long x-mech, and.......cheap. Reminds me of that kids song. "One of these things is not like the other. One of these things does not belong."

The previous post may contain spoilers, which will make the post less aerodynamic and increase handling at high speeds.
Eddie Horton is offline  
post #13 of 91 Old 03-06-2011, 11:03 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
but...but...but.... fi already had the Big, bad, long x-mech, and.......cheap! And i ruined it! It's all MY fault!

Graham, emailing now!
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #14 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 12:05 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Alright, the IB3s were extremely loud and did very well for $200 a pop. A 148.2 @ 25Hz made me proud. Even with EQ the bottom end just isn't where I want it to be, but the system ended up a ways from where it was initially going. It was supposed to be 110 cubic feet tuned to 15Hz and ended up at 45 cubic feet tuned to 24Hz. I never in a million years thought I'd use 10% of the power I had available. I ended up DOUBLING the front stage power and wish i could re-double that, but it will do. I still can't get a couple of adaptors made to mount my 2nd alt. Some day.

I just sold the IB3s for $600 and will be looking to try bigger motored subs. You guys were right, I was wrong

After I get the new subs I'll start a new thread, something like: (4) 18's 45 cubic feet 20" port tuned to 24Hz (4) AP30001Ds
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #15 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 12:11 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
penngray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 26,779
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Even with EQ the bottom end just isn't where I want it to be

Im really confused on what you goals are?

You are trying to EQ the bottom end of a ported design? You do know you are bound by the ported design's rolloff characteristics, correct

The only way to get bottom end performance is build a box that is tuned REALLY low (People build 10Hz tuned subs, correct?) or just go sealed or IB and add driver displacement.

It is not "open-minded" to reject knowledge - Bob Lee
penngray is offline  
post #16 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 12:40 PM
Advanced Member
 
Starkiller4299's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: SW MI
Posts: 526
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Wow, I musta missed a thread, cuz I thought you were solidly in love with your IB3LLT, KW.

We love overkill. -- gperkins1973
My fuse box is my HPF. -- kryptonitewhite

2x18 Ficar IB3 Infinite Baffle Manifold Install
Starkiller4299 is offline  
post #17 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 12:43 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
The van is tuned to 24Hz, but since its only 45 cubic feet...less than 1/2 what was planned... the weak motors are restricted by loading, so rather than peaking at tuning, they lose output unless EQed.



kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #18 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 01:06 PM
Advanced Member
 
Starkiller4299's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: SW MI
Posts: 526
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Aaaaaaahhh, the van. Different story there. Had me worried for a second .

We love overkill. -- gperkins1973
My fuse box is my HPF. -- kryptonitewhite

2x18 Ficar IB3 Infinite Baffle Manifold Install
Starkiller4299 is offline  
post #19 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 01:09 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starkiller4299 View Post

Wow, I musta missed a thread, cuz I thought you were solidly in love with your IB3LLT, KW.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Starkiller4299 View Post

Aaaaaaahhh, the van. Different story there. Had me worried for a second .

yeap, the IB3s aren't coming out of there, more than pleased in that department . Actually, down the road I'd like to do the same thing, bigger motored subs in there too to increase the peak responce around tuning, make a little dip in the mid department, and the high stuff back up again. U-shaped FR curve
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #20 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 03:19 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
LTD02's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 15,971
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 135 Post(s)
Liked: 852
why don't you coordinate with them to market some subs with your name on them...you can make the videos and get all the crowd excited, i.e. the marketing...fi just handles the manufacturing and order fulfillment...you guys split the profits. you said that it is what you would like to do, so why not just do it? :-)

Listen. It's All Good.
LTD02 is offline  
post #21 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 03:56 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

why don't you coordinate with them to market some subs with your name on them...you can make the videos and get all the crowd excited, i.e. the marketing...fi just handles the manufacturing and order fulfillment...you guys split the profits. you said that it is what you would like to do, so why not just do it? :-)

I won't lie, I want to be Steve Meade. Thats what he does. He was just a gu who built a bunch of good systems, made a bunch of vids, and now he reps Rockford Fosgate, Fi, and Ascendant Audio. Has his own shop and sig series... I'd love to, I was hopin theyd make a sig series "K-Dub IB4" lol
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #22 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 04:02 PM
AVS Special Member
 
notnyt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 4,099
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 85 Post(s)
Liked: 338
notnyt is online now  
post #23 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 04:07 PM
AVS Special Member
 
jpmst3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Davidsville, PA
Posts: 8,115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post

i bet he has a meter

lol!

jpmst3 is offline  
post #24 of 91 Old 03-07-2011, 04:12 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
as a matter of fact, he does. he has his own term lab. better system in his Taho, better system in his shop, better stereo in his house, he's a better man than me.

I know he has a bigger and better wang, I'd rather not whip them out and see just how much bigger!



Ignorance IS bliss!
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #25 of 91 Old 03-09-2011, 09:09 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
I just purchased (4) custom FiCarAudio 18's from Jim, aka ZORA. Thank you very much Jim, I am very excited to see how these perform in the van! So here's what's in the van:
Alpine IVA-W505 DVD player. I purchased it with the intent of running an optical out cable for audio and Ai-NET cable to touch-screen interface with the crossover, Alpine PXA-H701.
All slopes are set to 30dB/oct going against the advice of CUBDENNO, who said "keep it even at 24dB!" sorry but I just can't make myself do it!
(4) Vifa XT25TG30 1" ring radiators doing a steep 66dB/oct slope 14kHz on up (yeah, I know, but thats how it is) off a Kicker SX500.2 parallel 2ohms with its 36dB/oct slope adding in the mix. Since 14k on up is such a small weak bandwidth, I had to add a PG line driver I got from my buddy in the windy city/
(2) CSS FR125S 4.5" full range XBL^2 drivers doing 710Hz-14k off a KX650.4 bridged 8 ohms
(4) Adire Audio Extremis 6.4's off (2) KX850.4's each bridged on a pair covering 80Hz-710Hz
(4) custom Fi 18's from Jim, who gave me one hell of a deal.. great guy to work with! Covering 200Hz on down. Too high? too bad! Overlaping the Extremis? yup! When I dropped the old subs down to 80Hz, I really missed the 80Hz-200Hz content from the subs. When I brought the Extremis up to 200Hz from 80Hz, I hated it! They sound different coming from the different drivers (they being 80Hz-200Hz) and I miss them when i remove either!

Enclosure is 45 cubic feet, 20" diameter port 20" long for a 24Hz tune! Subs are HPed at 6dB/oct at 20Hz for protection.

120-150 cans of Great Stuff expanding foam..so glad I didn't do all 2x4's!

Toggle switches to disable the different bands: I can kill the tweets, 4.5's, 7"ers, and subs all separately, run any combination... just subs and tweets, just mids, whatever at the flip of a switch!

The subs:

Fs = 23.7 Hz
Re = 1.8 Ohms
Qms = 7.22
Qes = 0.38
Qts = 0.35
Cms = 130.0 uM/N
Mms = 300.0 grams
Sd = 1217.0 cmsq
Vas = 279.4 liters
SPL = 92.1 dB
X-max = 40mm
Power = 1,500+ watts

The top plate is 7/8", triple magnet, 2 ohm flatwound coils, single spider (8" I think), paper/kevlar cone, santoprene surround.
The 40mm might actually be X-mech one-way. A throw of 28-30mm one-way with the coil in the gap?








kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #26 of 91 Old 03-09-2011, 09:14 PM
Bass Enabler
 
Scott Simonian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Clovis, CA
Posts: 13,201
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 143 Post(s)
Liked: 639
Holy crap! Those look sweet. I'm gonna model those up right now.

How the heck do you get custom drivers like that, how can I get some and how much are they?

My Dual 18" LLT subs 120dB down to 10hz

 

Plan9Reloaded Co-host

Listen to the Plan9Reloaded Gaming and Technology Podcast (may contain NSFW language)

https://soundcloud.com/plan9reloaded/sets/podcast - direct pod link

http://plan9reloaded.com/site/ - main website

Scott Simonian is online now  
post #27 of 91 Old 03-09-2011, 09:48 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

Holy crap! Those look sweet. I'm gonna model those up right now.

How the heck do you get custom drivers like that, how can I get some and how much are they?

ib@ficaraudio.com email Scott!

Will you send me the driver data file when youre done? I can't enter them in ISD worth a hoot! Never had any trouble in Bass Box Pro
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #28 of 91 Old 03-09-2011, 09:51 PM
Bass Enabler
 
Scott Simonian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Clovis, CA
Posts: 13,201
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 143 Post(s)
Liked: 639
I played around with them a bit but the response changes A LOT with different Le specs. Like all them darn FiCar products... they never list the damn Le. Lol, seems kind of important.

My Dual 18" LLT subs 120dB down to 10hz

 

Plan9Reloaded Co-host

Listen to the Plan9Reloaded Gaming and Technology Podcast (may contain NSFW language)

https://soundcloud.com/plan9reloaded/sets/podcast - direct pod link

http://plan9reloaded.com/site/ - main website

Scott Simonian is online now  
post #29 of 91 Old 03-09-2011, 09:56 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
kryptonitewhite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

I played around with them a bit but the response changes A LOT with different Le specs. Like all them darn FiCar products... they never list the damn Le. Lol, seems kind of important.

why is that? I HATE that! At least most are given, incriminator has NONE!
kryptonitewhite is offline  
post #30 of 91 Old 03-09-2011, 10:24 PM
AVS Special Member
 
gperkins1973's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,519
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Could someone pop a winisd file off that custom driver on here. I want to see how they compare to my Q18's and how winisd compares with bassboxpro. Bassboxpro lets you put the parameters in any order where as winisd doesn't and I can never remember which poxy order they go in.


cheers

Graham
gperkins1973 is offline  
Reply DIY Speakers and Subs

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off