Budget Eminence Coaxial surround build!!! - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 871 Old 11-11-2013, 10:52 AM
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Fantastic. I was hoping this didn't replace that plan.
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post #362 of 871 Old 11-11-2013, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

yes, I still plan on doing the 8" beyma model, but it will be significantly more (probably double) that of this build, but should yield some excellent results as well. Had some random expenses come into play that have significantly hindered my order on them.

Tell me about it.

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post #363 of 871 Old 11-11-2013, 10:57 AM
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I just try to talk my wife into covering random expenses. Can't have life interfering with my fun.
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post #364 of 871 Old 11-11-2013, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

Maybe I can get a few box designs cut if that makes any sense to do.

One would probably just be a 12" cube. Or maybe one that was a little taller and shallow.


If anyone wants an angled box, I'd need the dimensions. I have no idea how much extra a box like that would cost because mitered angles would need to be cut on a few pieces after it comes off the CNC machine.
Beast's design seems optimal for SB and heights mounted close to the ceiling for some boundary reinforcement with ported in the tall/shallow configuration or cubed for primary surrounds. Just a thought.
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post #365 of 871 Old 11-11-2013, 04:51 PM
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Originally Posted by gpmbc View Post

Beast's design seems optimal for SB and heights mounted close to the ceiling for some boundary reinforcement with ported in the tall/shallow configuration or cubed for primary surrounds. Just a thought.

I would prefer Beast's angled design if I were to buy these surrounds ..... and at that price, I might need at least three or four pairs.

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post #366 of 871 Old 11-11-2013, 06:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

yes, I still plan on doing the 8" beyma model, but it will be significantly more (probably double) that of this build, but should yield some excellent results as well. Had some random expenses come into play that have significantly hindered my order on them.

I am ordering 6 of these in about 4 weeks....stay tuned

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post #367 of 871 Old 11-12-2013, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

yes, I still plan on doing the 8" beyma model, but it will be significantly more (probably double) that of this build, but should yield some excellent results as well. Had some random expenses come into play that have significantly hindered my order on them.

I'm still very interested in your build beast, although this new build from Erich has peaked my interest. But personally I want to keep any DIY surrounds similar in size to the JTR Slant 8's.

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post #368 of 871 Old 11-13-2013, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

I would prefer Beast's angled design if I were to buy these surrounds ..... and at that price, I might need at least three or four pairs.

I would take 2 of these angled designs immediately for surrounds for my bro's 5.1 build (and would likely follow-up with 3 more pair, for my own HT2 plan)

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post #369 of 871 Old 11-13-2013, 02:54 PM
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Four slants to go please, Hold the onions. I've got a project underway and I think they would be perfect.
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post #370 of 871 Old 11-13-2013, 05:23 PM
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Can't wait to see, hear and get my hands on these things! I always wondered why the 10" eminence coax was less expensive than the 8".
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post #371 of 871 Old 11-13-2013, 07:53 PM
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The angled box posted probably won't have enough volume for the Eminence 10". Would it be better to make the cabinet wider?

Would some type of trapezoid style box would make sense for these? Then they could be used as mains, or fit into corners, or angle down on the walls. I've got no idea how much the flat pack would cost with a box like that though. My initial price estimate was for just a 12" cube with no bracing.


Anyone have a name for this speaker? I'm sure that 'The Cube' is already used somewhere.
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post #372 of 871 Old 11-13-2013, 08:40 PM
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By the way, MTG90 and I put this coaxial through the final stress tests today and it passed with no problems. It's amazing just how loud this speaker can get and still keep it's composure. We also listened to it in my living room using my vintage Pioneer 2 channel receiver. I'm not sure how much power I was feeding just the one speaker, but in a 13' x 22' room it would require 2 people to nearly yell to talk with each other.

In a sealed box crossed to a subwoofer it would easily take more power than you would ever feed surrounds.....or mains for that matter. I believe at one point this past week MTG90 ran his Behringer A500 to it in bridged mode.

Right now they're designed to sound a bit 'crisp', which I think is pretty good for surrounds. We also listened back to back to the Karma-10 with it's more laid back sound, which I prefer for the L/C/R. The 2 models would likely make one of the best bang for the buck theater set ups out there. For the SEOS speakers, the Karma-10 was the hidden gem that people just didn't order for some reason. I'd say these coaxials could also be considered hidden gems, but will likely get more attention.
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post #373 of 871 Old 11-13-2013, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

By the way, MTG90 and I put this coaxial through the final stress tests today and it passed with no problems. It's amazing just how loud this speaker can get and still keep it's composure. We also listened to it in my living room using my vintage Pioneer 2 channel receiver. I'm not sure how much power I was feeding just the one speaker, but in a 13' x 22' room it would require 2 people to nearly yell to talk with each other.

In a sealed box crossed to a subwoofer it would easily take more power than you would ever feed surrounds.....or mains for that matter. I believe at one point this past week MTG90 ran his Behringer A500 to it in bridged mode.

Right now they're designed to sound a bit 'crisp', which I think is pretty good for surrounds. We also listened back to back to the Karma-10 with it's more laid back sound, which I prefer for the L/C/R. The 2 models would likely make one of the best bang for the buck theater set ups out there. For the SEOS speakers, the Karma-10 was the hidden gem that people just didn't order for some reason. I'd say these coaxials could also be considered hidden gems, but will likely get more attention.

These new speakers sound awesome, which also sucks even more for me...lol
For me they sound like they're going to be just to big of a design to run as surrounds, I was really hoping they'd be a little smaller. Some thing close to the size of Slant 8's.

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JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
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JVC RS45
Falcon Screens FVHD105
Dual PSA XS30's (gone but not forgotten)
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post #374 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 05:02 AM
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post #375 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 06:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

I'd say these coaxials could also be considered hidden gems, but will likely get more attention.


Naturally the Gem Series smile.gif

These would work great for surrounds for me I think. What is the minimum depth?
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post #376 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 06:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

The angled box posted probably won't have enough volume for the Eminence 10". Would it be better to make the cabinet wider?

Would some type of trapezoid style box would make sense for these? Then they could be used as mains, or fit into corners, or angle down on the walls. I've got no idea how much the flat pack would cost with a box like that though. My initial price estimate was for just a 12" cube with no bracing.


Anyone have a name for this speaker? I'm sure that 'The Cube' is already used somewhere.

Considering the level they can play, the #5 rarest gem in the world could be a good name for it: Painite

In all seriousness though, if we are going on rare gems, I would say the Jade10's Opal8's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

These new speakers sound awesome, which also sucks even more for me...lol
For me they sound like they're going to be just to big of a design to run as surrounds, I was really hoping they'd be a little smaller. Some thing close to the size of Slant 8's.

That time will come good sir, have no worries.

Quote:
Originally Posted by d_c View Post

Naturally the Gem Series smile.gif

These would work great for surrounds for me I think. What is the minimum depth?

Min depth with the apt50 I knew was 6.5" inches, but the DNA cd's aren't as deep, so you might squeeze out a 6 inche depth, but then they need to be pretty tall/wide to get you to 1 cuft.

My box is .68 cuft IIRC and once on the wall, is perfectly capable to 80hz.

(European models do not accept banana plugs.)

 

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post #377 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 07:11 AM
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Slanted design would need to be 14" high, wide, and top, with a bottom of 8" to get to 1 cuft.
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post #378 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 10:45 AM
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Hi Erich,

I am ready to order two drivers with all the crossover components right now. I will build my own baffle and enclosures. Please send me a PM or post in the open how I should proceed.

I'm rarin' to go!!

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post #379 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 11:21 AM
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I am in for 4 slants once they are up and running...
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post #380 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 11:58 AM
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So where is the final XO layout and complete parts list? How about a final response curve? We are eagerly awaiting more news on these coax's. cool.gif
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post #381 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 12:48 PM
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Eric, can you identify anything unique about the sound that might be due to the point source nature of a coax I'm really fascinated with these prosound coaxes.
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post #382 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 01:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Have you ever listened to pro coaxials or compression drivers in a home environment before?

(European models do not accept banana plugs.)

 

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post #383 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 01:46 PM
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I don't think there's anything 'special' about the pro coaxial speakers and they won't be beating the Fusion-12 or anything like that. The horns inside a coaxial just aren't going to do what a bigger waveguide will do. But we already knew that going in. These were designed to keep prices as low as possible and still give a good sounding small speaker that can handle some serious volume. And they hit those marks with no problem.

MTG90 and I were discussing what type of sound to shoot for and we both thought that they should have a little more 'sparkle' because many would use them for surrounds, but not too much to be overly harsh. I don't see any problems with them for main speakers either, I'd just probably bring the highs down a decibel or two if they were blasting in my face at reference levels. biggrin.gif But that can be done fairly easy I'm sure.

As for when they will be ready to go? I need to get a flat pack or two designed. MTG90 wants to listen to them in his more familiar sounding room to see if they need any last tweaks. He just headed home today after being here for a couple weeks. But this will be the first design he finishes up. I'm also going to get some PCB's made for much simpler crossover assembly, and hopefully those will be ready to go in about a week or so.

We really need to zero in on a box design. I do have a basic 12" cube ready to go, but nothing else yet.
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post #384 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post


We really need to zero in on a box design. I do have a basic 12" cube ready to go, but nothing else yet.

Erich,
Just a quick thought - with a small box like this being fairly easy to construct, how about:
- Offering just a baffle 12" high x 16" wide, with the hole for the driver.
- Then everyone could build their own "1cu' backer box" to fit their own size/aspect ratio (depth -vs-width, straight -vs- slanted to fit their specific needs)?
- Being 16" wide they would have the option of lopping off the ends to match-up to their specific need ...?

This could then be followed-up with your nice flat-packs (after demand gets sorted and settled) to a few popular choices
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post #385 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cuzed2 View Post

Erich,
Just a quick thought - with a small box like this being fairly easy to construct, how about:
- Offering just a baffle 12" high x 16" wide, with the hole for the driver.
- Then everyone could build their own "1cu' backer box" to fit their own size/aspect ratio (depth -vs-width, straight -vs- slanted to fit their specific needs)?
- Being 16" wide they would have the option of lopping off the ends to match-up to their specific need ...

+1

I'm also excited to see what's coming up with the 8" model that I think Erich mentioned earlier.

Sounds Good to Me... keeping track of my audio projects.

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post #386 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 04:22 PM
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Did I miss a spec given? What volume is the target?

I was about to draw up a box design for myself, but I wasn't sure what the volume needed to be. Actually, if I were to assume 3/4" MDF, double baffle?, a little bracing? - It'd be easier for me to design for an external/total volume, because I'm new at this.

I'd also like to see a polar - is there one around? I know PE says it's 100 degrees - is that a reliable dispersion to design around?

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post #387 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 05:02 PM
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+2 on the baffle panels....that will make it MUCH easier to customize for everybody's particular situations.
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post #388 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 05:04 PM
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I wish you could buy these in singles....I'd like to buy one to build and test before committing to a trio. It's not just about the components and SQ but rather about how it's sound in my application (built into the wall).
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post #389 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 05:26 PM
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For those of you thinking about modeling the Eminence Beta 10CX driver in WinISD 0.7, be aware that the TS parameters included in the database are substantially different than those posted at Parts Express. The PE data matches the manufacturer's data.

Mike
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post #390 of 871 Old 11-14-2013, 05:55 PM
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Can I get a theory check here?

Based on the scale drawing of my small room (140 inches wide). If I were to build cabinets with no tilt, and the driver were 10" from the wall, the near seat would be 52 degrees off axis and just over half the distance as the far seat, which is 34 degrees off axis. Would it even be worth building in a tilt to the cabinet? I have a feeling it's not really (but I'd still like to see a polar). If it's not worthwhile in my narrow room, it's probably not worthwhile in most people's rooms.

However, this drawing is for he rear row. The front row is 14 inches lower - I haven't done the math to see those angles. A tilt would make more sense for the front row.

(Sorry this is so hard to read)
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