AESpeakers TD Series group buy!!! - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 768 Old 04-15-2012, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by omegaslast View Post

http://www.aespeakers.com/phpbb2/vie...e96d&start=150

Still havent left china, dont expect to get your stuff until well into september.

haha so 1 year turn around.
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post #452 of 768 Old 04-24-2012, 08:21 AM
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I still haven't received my invoice. Has anybody received their invoices? This is from the AE forum.

by stryke » Tue Apr 10, 2012 7:24 pm

In addition, everyone who has made payment for the drivers on the group buy will be getting an email to confirm their order shortly. I have noticed that the impedance and S/X/H/M designation was left off on some of the invoices. I want to verify personally that everyone is getting the right woofers.

John
************************************************************ *******************
Acoustic Elegance/AE Speakers
1825 Mills St
Green Bay, WI 54302
phone: (920) 469-9198

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post #453 of 768 Old 04-24-2012, 09:31 AM
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No invoice for me.

I expected slow delivery of the drivers, but 1yr or over is starting to stretch it.
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post #454 of 768 Old 04-24-2012, 12:26 PM
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I had no idea that it would be this long of a wait. 6 months and counting. The parts are still somewhere in China. Maybe a bribe would expedite the shipment. Perhaps $1000 with the cost being spread among all the GB participants would grease the wheels. I suppose the pallet is in some warehouse waiting to be piggybacked on a larger order. Maybe it's lost.
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post #455 of 768 Old 04-24-2012, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rajacat View Post

I still haven't received my invoice. Has anybody received their invoices? This is from the AE forum.

by stryke » Tue Apr 10, 2012 7:24 pm

In addition, everyone who has made payment for the drivers on the group buy will be getting an email to confirm their order shortly. I have noticed that the impedance and S/X/H/M designation was left off on some of the invoices. I want to verify personally that everyone is getting the right woofers.

John
************************************************************ *******************
Acoustic Elegance/AE Speakers
1825 Mills St
Green Bay, WI 54302
phone: (920) 469-9198

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considering every thing shortly is probably not within the next 2 months. but i can say he is completing orders ever so slowly.

2 18'' pr only took 5 months build quality is good. to bad i have no idea what i bought them for or why.
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post #456 of 768 Old 04-24-2012, 09:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rajacat View Post

I suppose the pallet is in some warehouse waiting to be piggybacked on a larger order. Maybe it's lost.

Maybe it never got ordered!? Maybe your money was used to build someone else' drivers in hopes that filling one order would indicate progress was being made, when in fact Peter was just robbed to pay Paul. If I'm not mistaken this group buy was supposed to allow John the margins, and cash flow to create shorter turn around times by hiring out assembly. I've dealt with Chinese vendors for several years, albeit never in the audio industry, and never have I experienced delays and sudden lack of communication that John seemingly runs into each time. I'd love to close my eyes and believe one day these drivers would arrive, but my phone just rang....it's the boy cried wolf one too many times
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post #457 of 768 Old 04-25-2012, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by tgse3 View Post

Maybe it never got ordered!? Maybe your money was used to build someone else' drivers in hopes that filling one order would indicate progress was being made, when in fact Peter was just robbed to pay Paul. If I'm not mistaken this group buy was supposed to allow John the margins, and cash flow to create shorter turn around times by hiring out assembly. I've dealt with Chinese vendors for several years, albeit never in the audio industry, and never have I experienced delays and sudden lack of communication that John seemingly runs into each time. I'd love to close my eyes and believe one day these drivers would arrive, but my phone just rang....it's the boy cried wolf one too many times

That's exactly what I'm worried about.
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post #458 of 768 Old 04-25-2012, 12:06 PM
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I wouldn't push the panic button yet. Let's give it till Summer/Fall and see what happens.
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post #459 of 768 Old 04-25-2012, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

I wouldn't push the panic button yet. Let's give it till Summer/Fall and see what happens.

You've got to be kidding me! Wait a year for a couple of drivers that were supposed to be delivered in a couple of months?
Please explain why John, AE owner, can't even find the time to send his customers invoices for their PP money? Hey... he may have an artistic temperament or something but if he's going to be in business, he should operate in a businesslike manner.
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post #460 of 768 Old 04-25-2012, 01:50 PM
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Rajacat,

An honest question here for you. At this time are worried that you have lost your money and will never see the drivers? Thanks.

James
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post #461 of 768 Old 04-25-2012, 02:26 PM
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Along with the steel for all of the group buy drivers is steel for quite a few of my own custom drivers. I won't make any excuses or attempt to explain the repeated delays, but I do know the steel from China has been paid for and was in the process of getting on its way to Green Bay. AE has often been slow, but they have always delivered the Lambda series once parts arrive and the work through the build que. I don't have any doubt all the group buy drivers will be delivered and perform as wonderful as all the units delivered in the past, it's just a question of how soon.

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post #462 of 768 Old 04-25-2012, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rajacat View Post

You've got to be kidding me! Wait a year for a couple of drivers that were supposed to be delivered in a couple of months?

I don't think anyone honestly thought the original December ship date was even remotely possible. It made for a good sales pitch and that's about it.

Quote:


Please explain why John, AE owner, can't even find the time to send his customers invoices for their PP money? Hey... he may have an artistic temperament or something but if he's going to be in business, he should operate in a businesslike manner.

As far as I've seen, the only invoices he said he was sending out were for the completed 18" drivers. It appears he's done that. There does seem to be a bit of a lag between customers paying the 18" invoice and getting anything shipped, but invoices are being sent for those particular drivers.

He did say he was going to send out was an email to people who had paid the 50% down, clarifying the impedence of drivers ordered. I think he'll wait until a few weeks before completion of the remaining drivers to actually invoice, like he's done on the 18" drivers. I know I would not be anxious to get a final invoice for drivers with the parts still on another continent. With completion of the remaining drivers still likely months away, checking on the impedence requirements of each order likely isn't a hot priority to him.

Having previously done business with his company, and being beyond frustrated at every turn of the way, the best thing to do IMHO is not get too upset. It's not going to make your drivers magically appear any faster, it's just going to make your blood pressure go up.

Until then, it's just more of "The dog ate my homework".
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post #463 of 768 Old 04-25-2012, 03:18 PM
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"....the best thing to do IMHO is not get too upset. It's not going to make your drivers magically appear any faster, it's just going to make your blood pressure go up."

Exactly!

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post #464 of 768 Old 04-25-2012, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by rajacat View Post

You've got to be kidding me! Wait a year for a couple of drivers that were supposed to be delivered in a couple of months?***

Given past performance information readily available here and elsewhere, "a couple of months" was simply not a reasonable expectation.

If most of you get your drivers before 2013, I think that would be a pleasant surprise.

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post #465 of 768 Old 04-26-2012, 12:45 AM
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This must be AE fanboy central.
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post #466 of 768 Old 04-26-2012, 04:32 AM
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The saddest part to me is the fact that there are no alternatives to the Chinese steel. what has happened to us?
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post #467 of 768 Old 04-26-2012, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by btinindy View Post

The saddest part to me is the fact that there are no alternatives to the Chinese steel. what has happened to us?

The EPA and massive regulations. Then add in sue happy citizens with a dose of business owners wanting to get rich off every project. It is going to get harder and harder for large US manufactures to compete.


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post #468 of 768 Old 04-26-2012, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by rajacat View Post

This must be AE fanboy central.

I can't possibly see where anything I posted could be construed as "fanboy". My past dealings with AE were absolutely the worst experience I've ever had in any audio related purchase. I'm just saying that your rant was based at least partially on false assumptions.

What seemed to set you off was this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by John@AE View Post

In addition, everyone who has made payment for the drivers on the group buy will be getting an email to confirm their order shortly. I have noticed that the impedance and S/X/H/M designation was left off on some of the invoices. I want to verify personally that everyone is getting the right woofers.

You wrongly interpreted it to mean you were supposed to get an "invoice".

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Originally Posted by rajacat View Post

I have my PayPal receipt, where's my invoice? It's been over two weeks since you wrote this "

Haven't you already paid 50% down? If you did, then you must have paid the money in response to some prompt from AE. That was your "invoice". If you just sent some amount of money to AE with no request from them, then you are on your own.

The people who paid the 50% down are evidently supposed to get some other email asking for confirmation of driver impedence. Doesn't sound like an "invoice" to me, but it must to you:

Quote:
Originally Posted by rajacat View Post

Please explain why John, AE owner, can't even find the time to send his customers invoices for their PP money?

An invoice is "A list of goods sent or services provided, stating the sum due for these". If AE asked you for 50% down, and you paid it, then what happened was they sent you an invoice. It's already happened. John, AE owner, sent you an invoice for 50% down. That was your invoice.

Now he's said he will, at some time in the future, send you another email to confirm what impedence your drivers are supposed to be. This is not an invoice. An invoice will be a request for money. All he's requesting is clarification as to driver impedence, not money, so not an invoice.

I'm about as far from an AE fanboy as one could get, my order from them was 8 months of pure hell and I never even used the drivers I ordered.

All I'm saying is my frustration did absolutely not one single thing to expedite my order. Nothing. It made me frustrated, bewildered, angry, livid, back to bewildered, back to angry, etc. But at no point in all of that did it actually speed the process up. Not one minute.

So you can go down that road and be miserable for what looks to be a few more months, or just chill out and go with the inevitable, glacial paced, no communication black hole that is AE.

Beat your head against a wall, the wall doesn't care.
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post #469 of 768 Old 04-26-2012, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by rajacat View Post

This must be AE fanboy central.

Not exactly. I've made 3 purchases from AE in the past. I waited much longer than expected but got my goods and they were as expected. John has always come through, but very slowly. I think prior to this GB, the record of such was plain to see and evident to all if you were to do some due diligence. I even think the GB thread made note of this, so as an informed consumer you should have probably set some realistic expectations.

Now, like Chuck said, you are disappointed. I don't think anyone thinks you shouldn't be, but the constant bitchin about it over and over again like a broken record will do nothing to further the situation and ultimately is self-defeating. What do I mean by that? Well all the bitchin leads to bad press, which will make future potential customers leery and ultimately many will avoid. Thus AE will struggle to stay in business and thus your drivers will become obsolete, parts won't be available for future repairs, etc.

Some parts of this delay are truly out of John's control, and all the whining does nothing to resolve anything. I think John bit off more than he can chew by himself (I don't think he has any employees) and has let communication become the thing that suffers the most, unfortunately, and for that he is guilty.

A little sugar is going to go a lot longer in helping get some info that all the sour.

P.S. I am not attacking you, although it may seem that way. I am just agreeing with Chuck that it is running in circles.

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post #470 of 768 Old 04-26-2012, 01:52 PM
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Besides, they can always be sold when they finally arrive. I look at my group order as an investment in unobtanium.

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post #471 of 768 Old 04-27-2012, 07:06 AM
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Besides, they can always be sold when they finally arrive. I look at my group order as an investment in unobtanium.



Exactly what I am thinking.

Especially with the SEOS project nearing completion, I'll probably have completely built speakers before I even get the final invoice for the AE drivers.
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post #472 of 768 Old 05-11-2012, 08:48 AM
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Re: ** Official TD Woofer Group Buy Information **

Postby stryke » Tue Apr 10, 2012 7:24 pm
In addition, everyone who has made payment for the drivers on the group buy will be getting an email to confirm their order shortly. I have noticed that the impedance and S/X/H/M designation was left off on some of the invoices. I want to verify personally that everyone is getting the right woofers.

John
***************************************
When will we get the email confirming our orders and confirming the impedance and model designation? It's been a month.
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post #473 of 768 Old 05-11-2012, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioJosh View Post

Not exactly. I've made 3 purchases from AE in the past. I waited much longer than expected but got my goods and they were as expected. John has always come through, but very slowly. I think prior to this GB, the record of such was plain to see and evident to all if you were to do some due diligence. I even think the GB thread made note of this, so as an informed consumer you should have probably set some realistic expectations.

Now, like Chuck said, you are disappointed. I don't think anyone thinks you shouldn't be, but the constant bitchin about it over and over again like a broken record will do nothing to further the situation and ultimately is self-defeating. What do I mean by that? Well all the bitchin leads to bad press, which will make future potential customers leery and ultimately many will avoid. Thus AE will struggle to stay in business and thus your drivers will become obsolete, parts won't be available for future repairs, etc.

Some parts of this delay are truly out of John's control, and all the whining does nothing to resolve anything. I think John bit off more than he can chew by himself (I don't think he has any employees) and has let communication become the thing that suffers the most, unfortunately, and for that he is guilty.

A little sugar is going to go a lot longer in helping get some info that all the sour.

P.S. I am not attacking you, although it may seem that way. I am just agreeing with Chuck that it is running in circles.

. I even think the GB thread made note of this, so as an informed consumer you should have probably set some realistic expectations.

Wrong! There were no warnings in the AE GB thread about the possibility of very long wait times.
I scanned most of the GB threads and I think the only one who gave a veiled warning was auger.

Actually, I submitted my deposit in the middle of Oct. and dire warnings were almost no where to be found. A far cry from "I told you so" that many of the apologists are sprouting ex post facto.
I didn't start my "bitchin' " till more than 4 months had elapsed. I thought my initial inquires about the delays and lack of communication were very reasonable and modulated. Well... it won't be long before we're 8 months into this GB and as far as we know the parts are still in China.
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post #474 of 768 Old 05-11-2012, 10:34 AM
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Raja,

Quitcherbitchin!! If you want out, what did you order? ill give you a way out! 4 months is a long time, a year is a SUPER long time, but to get one of the premier DIY drivers, heck, most of the folks designing around these drivers can take 4-8 months just building the speaker completely out! I understand waiting patiently can wear off after an extended period of time. I just cant wait for everyone to take possession of these beautes and start some killer build threads!!! This place is going to EXPLODE!!!! I have two vintage advent cabs just waiting on a pair of td12's of one type or another, as soon as there is a passive build focused around the TD's with an SEOS

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post #475 of 768 Old 05-11-2012, 10:46 AM
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How long is too long for you? 1 year? 2 years??? I'm at the point where I'm trying to decide to give up on the AE GB and purchase an alternative pair of drivers. These extremely long wait times discourage newbies like me and do a disservice to the diy community. The worst part is that the AE owner doesn't know how to communicate with his customer in a way that for any legitimate business would be standard operating procedure. If there's a problem, there should be some transparency. I'm an understanding person but there seems to be a bit disdain for legitimate customers.
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post #476 of 768 Old 05-11-2012, 10:51 AM
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That's when you need to trust the more seasoned folks bro!! If these were just another "run of the mill" driver, there wouldnt be such a big demand for them!! I havent had the chance yet to hear some, but ive read enough about these drivers and the folks who have built around and listened to them compared to other top drivers, and its something I just know I want to get my hands on! I know this suggestion may be a stretch, but grab another pair of drivers for the time being, but stay on the AE order! If I wasnt happy with what I have right now to tide me over, then I would have done the same

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post #477 of 768 Old 05-11-2012, 10:57 AM
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At the time I posted in the group buy thread, I was actually a few months into the annoying situation you find yourself in and a few months from getting my order resolved. I was trying to show some restraint towards AE, but I guess I should have been a little more forceful in expressing my displeasure.

I guess those of us who have previously dealt with AE are just more jaded in regards to the endless projections, excuses, delays, and aggravation that go hand in hand with doing business with that company.

I still think that getting wound up every month or so won't do you any good. If John posted today that the parts were at his shop, you can rest assured that something else would pop up to cause yet another delay. That's just the way it goes.
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post #478 of 768 Old 05-11-2012, 12:34 PM
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rajacat,

i understand your frustration, but any more bitchin' isn't getting your drivers here any faster.

forget about it for a few months. focus on other things, like build some subs, paint your house, clean the yards, whatever.

and when the drivers finally showed up, you'll be a happy camper.
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post #479 of 768 Old 05-11-2012, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

rajacat,

i understand your frustration, but any more bitchin' isn't getting your drivers here any faster.

Agreed and it's hardly the most effective place to ask to get an update.
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post #480 of 768 Old 05-11-2012, 05:49 PM
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I understand why some posters have tried to protect/defend AE, and up to now I have refrained from commenting, but AE's behaviour through this process has not been acceptable by any measure. Their very poor communication with parties that have tied funds for months longer than originally proposed is not a proper way to conduct business, even if purchasers assumed the process would take a few months longer than AE originally suggested.

Some of us have decided to try to address AE's failure to communicate with and deliver product to us by allowing third parties to take over our order, but AE has been totally useless in facilitating this transfer (even when third parties have offered to make full payment for the drivers, instead of only covering the initial pre-order amount). Ideally buyers should try and communicate with AE, and if they are unhappy with the process, they should transfer their orders to willing third parties who are not troubled by the poor service provided by AE, sadly AE's extremely poor communication (incompetence?) does not even allow for these steps to be taken.

I'm troubled by my decision to post this, but parties who have obviously been very poorly treated are being criticized for expressing valid concerns. The complaints being expressed by customers are very reasonable and the manner they have expressed themselves has been fairly cordial considering the circumstances. On the face of it, the proposed solutions being suggested by some posters seem reasonable. Sadly, they are of little comfort and value as long as AE chooses to be play deaf and ignore its customer's attempts at communicating.

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