Ficar SSD18 Group Buy Thread - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 535 Old 01-21-2012, 12:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

"To be honest, I don't think you're following what I'm saying at all."

why would you say that??? it is all very simple from your perspective.
1. within the limits that a system was designed for, we hear frequency response only, nothing else matters
2. the rolloff of a sealed sub requires the bottom end to be brought up
3. it is important to get flat response as low as possible
4. flat response is better achieved with multiple units than through equalization
5. corner placement is a good starting point for the sensitivity gain
sound about right?

I really need to stop posting here.

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post #362 of 535 Old 01-30-2012, 07:57 AM
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Hey Josh!

Any updates on the driver testing here?

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post #363 of 535 Old 01-30-2012, 09:51 AM
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I am still running the Q18 for awhile to give it more time to "settle". I will take one more set of params soon. They may not be much different from what has already been posted, or they might shift a little more. The response shape we know. It appears to offer the displacement that they advertise. I might try some high power testing outside with it but don't hold your breath on that. It will be weeks or months from now.

tgse3 will have to comment on the rest.
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post #364 of 535 Old 01-30-2012, 11:46 AM
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no prob, and thanks again for running what you already have. displacement is what im afraid I dont really have enough of at the moment so im very interested in one of these 18's for sure. Id like to find one that I can initially get two of and put in my mammoth tubatrons or possibly even retrofit them to instead of being ported deals to a dual opposed type enclosure with a driver on top and a driver on the bottom that would still yield a little too much airspace for the drivers, but in the process I could cut down the enclosure some...

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post #365 of 535 Old 01-30-2012, 05:36 PM
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Bosso, or anyone,

I have a Tumult II, sitting in a box in my basement. Anyone interested. I ended up gooing with AV-15s and the Tumult is in a box. It is one of the last produced. I was trying to get a second with Adire stopped production.

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post #366 of 535 Old 01-30-2012, 05:45 PM
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Damn.... just one.

Someone better pick that up real quick!

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post #367 of 535 Old 01-30-2012, 09:02 PM
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Wow (assuming that location is correct at least) I want to drive over there and pick it up tomorrow. Can't justify it by any means (already have a Mael-X sitting idle...) but still want it.

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post #368 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
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Damn.... just one.

Someone better pick that up real quick!

Yep, just one. This is another case of "one of these days I'm going to do something with it".

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post #369 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 09:32 AM
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Hey so is this thread about a group buy for FiCar Xcon subs?

I saw the pricing, what are the current specs of the driver, is it designed to be run sealed in a 4-6 cubic foot box? I know you guys were talking about modifying / upgrading the specs. I tried to read through this thread to find the info but it just made my head hurt.
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post #370 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by djkest View Post

Hey so is this thread about a group buy for FiCar Xcon subs?

I saw the pricing, what are the current specs of the driver, is it designed to be run sealed in a 4-6 cubic foot box? I know you guys were talking about modifying / upgrading the specs. I tried to read through this thread to find the info but it just made my head hurt.

Yes that is one of the options being considered here. Ricci should be taking claim of a xcon from Tgse3 to test and get back to us on the parameters and how nicely it plays with a HT setup. so far, I like the xcon's specs, but they dont mean anything until ricci gets some tests in.

The custom build of the xcon is not in the works, quite simply, Aaron said they wouldnt quite be willing to do a custom run as they already have a good working product and they wouldnt see the benefit (or profit) of doing such a thing. They are primarily car audio based and their driver works perfect for that...

about 4-6 cuft is perfect. Im shooting for the low side for protection, but you can go higher and it wont require as much power, you just may have to incorporate a high pass filter for protection

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post #371 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 10:06 AM
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Fi is much more suited to do a specific one-off single run model for AVS, then we are. To make costly changes and lower the price of an existing model would take us out of the logical equation.

Aaron Clinton ~ SSAudio Inc.
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post #372 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 12:18 PM
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Fi is much more suited to do a specific one-off single run model for AVS, then we are. To make costly changes and lower the price of an existing model would take us out of the logical equation.

thanks aaron, thats what i was trying to convey. So how do you think your xcons would work in a 15 cuft sonotube llt tuned to about 10hz? give em about 2000 watts per driver had anyone do an LLT with that line?

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post #373 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 12:33 PM
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So how do you think your xcons would work in a 15 cuft sonotube llt tuned to about 10hz? give em about 2000 watts per driver had anyone do an LLT with that line?

That would almost work but.... no way would you be able to tune that low in that small of size enclosure with a decent enough size port and NOT have have a port resonance that is below 100hz. I'm assuming you are talking about an 18" driver XCON. A 15cuft cab with an 8" dia port tuned to 10hz is going to be 75 inches long! Ack!! EEEwwwww!!! Even if you compromise and go with a 6" dia port, it's still going to be 40" long at the least with major compression setting in from 15hz and lower .... which will reduce output <15hz so then why bother?

With the XCON, you'll be best serving yourself cloning my 25cuft sized LLT's and if you really want 2kw to use, you'll need a larger vent and that means a higher tune to not have the port resonance super low. Gotta compromise somewhere. LLT's are not best use with uber power per driver, imo.

A well designed and proper LLT takes some checks and balances.... and they really need to be HUGE. Hence the 'large' part of their name.

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post #374 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 01:47 PM
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fair enough, didnt know how they would play in what ive already got. 6 inch port is only 36 inches, so im pretty close there, I could manage only 1000 watts per driver but would love to give the xcons all that they are capable of. next idea, not sure if you read it above would be to make the towers dual opposed and put a bottom firing driver (like it is now) and then remove the port and make a top firing driver as well and do the 4 18's that way...Or just build the standard issue cubes that ive been discussing anyways

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post #375 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 02:35 PM
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You could definitely do that! Though depending on how much power you plan on giving each driver, you would have to cut down the size of each tube. Otherwise you would need to use some limiter or filter to keep the <10hz stuff from pushing the drivers into overexcursion. At that point I'd ask myself, "why bother having such a huge enclosure if I just have to filter the lowest bass anyway?".

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post #376 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 02:38 PM
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Been seriously considering the SSD 18" for mainly HT use, and tinkering with Unibox, I've come up with the following:

283L (10 cu ft.)
2 4" ports (132.88cm length each)
800W input

Was just wondering if the resulting 11hz tune, 106db @ 10hz output before unloading sounds too optimistic for such an alignment. Port air speed hits the red at 11.2hz, and resonance is at 126hz (audible/ cause of concern, if crossed at 80hz?).

Thoughts would be appreciated.
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post #377 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 02:41 PM
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When I sim the SSD18 with the specs you list.... and an 11hz tune... the port is over 48 inches long! Gah!!!

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post #378 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

You could definitely do that! Though depending on how much power you plan on giving each driver, you would have to cut down the size of each tube. Otherwise you would need to use some limiter or filter to keep the <10hz stuff from pushing the drivers into overexcursion. At that point I'd ask myself, "why bother having such a huge enclosure if I just have to filter the lowest bass anyway?".

Well that was a point I made where during removal of the cap with the port, I could cut the boxes down to whatever optimal size I want win win situation. overall, i think id still rather build the cubes, but this wouldnt be a bad temp setup until I got more wood and spent the time getting the cubes lookin real nice

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post #379 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 02:52 PM
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Bah, fail! Just ran the numbers through sonosub.exe, and the ports end up being longer than the tube, LOL.

Back to the drawing boards!
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post #380 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 02:58 PM
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Well that was a point I made where during removal of the cap with the port, I could cut the boxes down to whatever optimal size I want win win situation. overall, i think id still rather build the cubes, but this wouldnt be a bad temp setup until I got more wood and spent the time getting the cubes lookin real nice

For sure. Only you would know if you would prefer to have tubes or boxes. Though it would save you a ton of work (and materials) to cut down the ones you have already unless you wanted to keep them with the Tempest-X's.

Dual-opposed those XCON18's look fine in something as small as 8cuft.

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Bah, fail! Just ran the numbers through sonosub.exe, and the ports end up being longer than the tube, LOL.

Back to the drawing boards!

The overall design could work but you'd have to tune higher. 14-15hz looked good but the port speed went up as well.

Careful balance of everything equals quality LLT.

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post #381 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 03:13 PM
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If tuning at those ranges, like you said, might as well go sealed for an enclosure half the size.

142L (5 cu ft) @ 1000W doesn't look too shabby, I guess.
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post #382 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 03:32 PM
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Yup.

LLT's... been there, doing that. Almost done with that.

My LLT's are the definition of pushing the envelope (only to be edged out by Krypto) and wrenching out every last drop of performance that can be had from my particular drivers and the alignment, itself. There really is no where else to go if you desire even more output AND extension/bandwidth. That's why these days I'm all about sealed. You just gotta have multiples for proper execution.

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post #383 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 03:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

Yup.

LLT's... been there, doing that. Almost done with that.

My LLT's are the definition of pushing the envelope (only to be edged out by Krypto) and wrenching out every last drop of performance that can be had from my particular drivers and the alignment, itself. There really is no where else to go if you desire even more output AND extension/bandwidth. That's why these days I'm all about sealed. You just gotta have multiples for proper execution.

hehe, i like to think I got kinda close

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post #384 of 535 Old 01-31-2012, 03:57 PM
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Wasn't forgetting about your efforts, Beast. Just that back when I built mine, the LLT's were the new hotness and I made mine larger and even more lower tuned. There was no where else to go from there.

For a one day project, yours turned out pretty damn good. Haven't seen any updates in your thread since you first played with them.

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post #385 of 535 Old 02-01-2012, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

Wasn't forgetting about your efforts, Beast. Just that back when I built mine, the LLT's were the new hotness and I made mine larger and even more lower tuned. There was no where else to go from there.

For a one day project, yours turned out pretty damn good. Haven't seen any updates in your thread since you first played with them.

Yep, im in need of an update. Ive got them looped through both sides of a mic 220 to get 2 bands of eq, they sound great right now but having to move my L/R's inboard so far has been a little detrimental to the sound stage, which I like very wide. im going to mess around with them probably up to superbowl trying to get them right. if moving them in on either side of my center works for the staging, then I may very well use them for a quad dual opposed 18 setup at least at the beginning...

Ive read through your thread a couple times, and you definitely have a sweet thing going for two 18's! those boxes are massive. I wasnt even tryin to compare what I did in a day to what you did, haha, not even close. I will hang my hat on getting to 10hz flat reference on a build in that timeframe tho


EDIT: I just put a good update on my thread

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post #386 of 535 Old 02-08-2012, 12:46 PM
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Hey Josh, any new testing stuff come up? I just read through my entire 14 page displacement thread last night and Im getting antsy. Everyone else there has moved on to new builds, but im still holding out hope that the xcon's may model better than the q's did for you. If not, I might screw the whole bag and pull and Edogg and go order a pair of ultra's.

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post #387 of 535 Old 02-08-2012, 12:59 PM
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i might screw the whole bag and pull and edogg and go order a pair of ultra's.

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post #388 of 535 Old 02-08-2012, 01:02 PM
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Yeah, I'm still curious about the XCON's.

Good thing I've got other things to keep me busy.

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post #389 of 535 Old 02-08-2012, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
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Yeah, I'm still curious about the XCON's.

They are at my place currently. Problem is I am not. I'm out of the country, but will get with Ricci to arrange a time to get them to him when I get home.
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post #390 of 535 Old 02-08-2012, 01:23 PM
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They are at my place currently. Problem is I am not. I'm out of the country, but will get with Ricci to arrange a time to get them to him when I get home.

crapfish.

OK Scott, ive given you some time off, mind doing another quick graph? How would a pair of ultra's fair against a quad setup of xcons, assuming both are powered by a single fp14k in about the same size box, lets say 4.5 cuft to be fair to each. maybe 4 cuft if you think that's better?

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