Yung Plate Amp - Initial Impressions - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 126 Old 05-16-2012, 07:12 AM - Thread Starter
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I ordered and received the 200W with 6dB boost model, strictly for evaluation. Mainly I was looking to see if I can figure out the boost circuit, and identify the components needed for tweaking the subsonic filter for diy needs. Sadly, these amps are not DIY-friendly at all, so imo are not worth the trouble unless they fit your needs 'as-is'. Yung has taken some measures that make board removal tedius, and obviously warrany-voiding. Gluing the board in place, and using surface mount resistors that can only safely be replaced by removing the board, for example. Still, I will do my best to figure out the boost circuit, for those brave souls who spit in the eye of challenges like this. Or if someone out there happens to already have the schematic, even just the pre-amp, that would be awesome to share.

The amp itself seems to be very well made. I'll eventually give it a listen. I was surprised at the small size, even knowing the dimensions before it arrived.

For me, I'll stick to the BASH amps since the info for these is already available, and they are relatively easy to tweak.

 

EDIT:  After studying and working with these a bit more (and having my frustration of disassembly subside a bit), I've changed my mind about these.  It is possible to tweak the HPF on these relatively easily if desired, and it is possible to defeat the bass boost circuit if needed.  And I do like their smallish size, and good power.  You can read through the whole thread to see how the circuits were discovered, or jump to post 85-ish for a wrap up.

Bombelman likes this.

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post #2 of 126 Old 05-16-2012, 07:35 AM
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Just curious why not just get the Dayton SPA-250 for 120.00 , why buy an amp that requires tweaking, is this project specific for something you are working on.

I did a boost mod on a Dayton 240, it turned out ok, and the board was easily removed...


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post #3 of 126 Old 05-16-2012, 08:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Kg,

I've gotten where I prefer the 'digital' type amps. Seems the a/b with the huge transformers always have some type of hum or mechanical noise. Once I tried a BASH 300, I was converted.

I just finished repairing a Keiga 300w for hum issues, and I have a SA240 from PE that I put in a friend's sub that hums as well. Gonna do a temporary swap with him to try to fix his amp. (Amp hums on its own, nothing else hooked to it, once it's powered on). I agree...they are easy to work on for modding the boost and such. But in my limited experience, they are a bit noisier and prone to noise/hum.

Hence my interest in finding another possible DIY-friendly 'digital' amp. Not that I NEED them to be tweakable, just that it's nice to have that option in case you want to move it to a totally different sub design. Being able to boost here or there, or move the subsonic filter is a great option imo.

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post #4 of 126 Old 05-16-2012, 10:45 AM
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^^^^ yeah, no matter what, something is always humming in my rig. My MiniDSP was nuts till i grounded the chassis to the outlet, my 240's picked up on that and were also humming......

Nice to know the digital plate amps reject that noise... Interesting. Thanx for the explaination !


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post #5 of 126 Old 05-16-2012, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

Nice to know the digital plate amps reject that noise... Interesting. Thanx for the explaination !

Not so fast!! I have an Inuke 3000DSP that hums as well. I even ran a ground wire externally from the receiver to amp and it still hums.
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post #6 of 126 Old 05-16-2012, 01:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Pro-amps are in another category all together. Does it happen to have a 3prong plug? Just curious. It doesn't help that users have to up the gain on them to achieve good output, so if it's a noisy design it will make matters worse. Best bet for these is to use a level booster, or take advantage of the balanced inputs if at all possible.

Reports like yours of hum...that's one of the main reasons why I don't explore the pro-amp universe. Plus, I prefer efficient subwoofer designs that give me max output with <500W. I may never achieve record-setting spls, but it gets me where I'm happy and smiling.

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post #7 of 126 Old 05-16-2012, 01:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsloms View Post


Not so fast!! I have an Inuke 3000DSP that hums as well. I even ran a ground wire externally from the receiver to amp and it still hums.

My 3000dsp hums too, it's driving me nuts.
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post #8 of 126 Old 05-16-2012, 04:19 PM
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Even when I unplug my inputs to the amp I'm still getting a hum so it must be the amp itself. And yes it has a 3 prong power cord on it with a proper ground.
I'm not even using the 3000dsp on my subs. This is actively powering just one of my main speakers. I'm using a Rane amp on the other mains but they him as well. For my subs I don't go small. I'm running 2 EP2500's for 4 ixl18's.
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post #9 of 126 Old 05-21-2012, 07:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Quick update...I have managed to find the location of the boost circuit. It does not calculate to a full 6dB boost though, so it's either done in two stages or the specs are inaccurate. If you need details, send me a pm. Again I stress, these amps are not really DIY-friendly...removing the pre-amp board for these mods is quite a pain and will surely void any warranties it has. Unless I am blown away by the little 200W model, or unless they run a great sale on them, I'll stick to other models for my needs.

I am certain that the circuit applies to the whole line that PE carries. It's obvious the pre-amp board is identical in all models, only exception being that the 300W and 500W models add speaker-level inputs. This would have no bearing on the boost circuit. Also bear in mind that the boost circuit likely serves as the subsonic filter; the models with no boost simply have an Fc at or slightly below 20Hz with no boost above that.

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post #10 of 126 Old 05-21-2012, 06:52 PM
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You're the first concrete feedback I've seen on these, so I hope you don't mind a question or two.

If you're just looking for a straight no-boost amp, do they seem to be reasonable quality - say competitive with the BASH?
Is their input sensitivity high enough to be usable with the miniDsp without additional gain circuitry? It looks to be from the specs.
Is the low pass a 2nd or 4th order slope? I'm assuming 2nd, but I didn't see any explicit indication in the data sheet.

thanks.
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post #11 of 126 Old 05-21-2012, 09:21 PM
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I have the yung SD500 and the bash 500. Both are of good quality but the yung has a bit more power in the lower octaves. I tested both in my 3 CF boxes with a titanic and the yung was able to reach down to 15hz and be noticeable and the bash 500 ran out of steam at 17hz and the yung had noticeably higher slp under 20hz. The yung is the one without the 6dB boost and the bash 500 is modded.

Blasting brown notes for 10 years and counting!

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post #12 of 126 Old 05-22-2012, 06:07 AM - Thread Starter
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I'd take N8's feedback, since he's compared both himself. I haven't traced the whole pre-amp yet, so I can't answer your tech questions. I'd say your hunches are probably correct.

N8 isn't the first to tell me that they have stronger output than the BASH down low. A vendor who sells both told me the same thing. As far as quality...it does look like a very well made amplifier. Can't compare components to the BASH, as I believe they are actually different technologies. The BASH feels a bit wimpy compared to the Yung, but that's likely due to the different types of power supplies needed for their respective tech. I think both a very good amps.

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post #13 of 126 Old 05-22-2012, 02:27 PM
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Ya when it comes down to it, you can't really go wrong with either. When I bough my yung, I had never even heard of them. It was a re branded amp for CCS and someone pointed out that it was a yung.

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post #14 of 126 Old 07-17-2012, 12:53 PM
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So has it been confirmed that the Yung Amps have a high-pass/subsonic filter?
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post #15 of 126 Old 07-17-2012, 03:29 PM - Thread Starter
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I haven't seen a schematic for any of their models, but I think it's safe to say that the models without boost have their high-pass set at or slightly below 20Hz, and those with boost are as advertised, except with 'undetermined' boost values.

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post #16 of 126 Old 07-17-2012, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garciab View Post

I haven't seen a schematic for any of their models, but I think it's safe to say that the models without boost have their high-pass set at or slightly below 20Hz, and those with boost are as advertised, except with 'undetermined' boost values.

So I tried to do a little reading about how these filters are designed in plate amps.... and am I correct that typically, an amp with boost uses a high Q filter to generate the boost, followed by 2nd order rolloff below the boost?

For example, in the case of the Yung 200W version with boost, assuming for simplicity that it is 6dB boost at 35Hz... This would mean the amp uses a high pass filter at 35Hz with a Q of 2, right?

So if I wanted to model that in WinISD, would I use a "Peaking 2nd order highpass" with 6dB gain peak at 35Hz... or "User SOS" highpass with n=2, fc=35Hz, Q=2?
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post #17 of 126 Old 07-18-2012, 05:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes, I believe you are right. Though I'm not completely clear on if Fc and boost F are the same. Fc is usually at the -3dB point in the response, and the boost frequency (if Q is above 0.7) occurs above that. I don't know what the sim programs do with the values they require. If I'm wrong, hopefully someone will step in and correct me.

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post #18 of 126 Old 11-26-2012, 10:08 AM
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Can anyone verify what the subsonic filter is set to on these amps yet. I havent seen a solid answer. thank you
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post #19 of 126 Old 11-27-2012, 06:12 AM
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30 hz. That's straight from the engineer that built it.


The line with a peak at 30 is my Yung SD300-6. The other line is my iNuke 3k. Ignore everything below 17hz where the mic loses accuracy.
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post #20 of 126 Old 11-27-2012, 06:59 AM
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So they are kinda useless for diy subs then?
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post #21 of 126 Old 11-27-2012, 09:41 AM
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Well, if you are going for linear sub response, then yes, you wouldn't want a Yung. If you haven't bought a plate amp yet then the consensus is to go with Bash.

Since I'm past the return period I'm thinking mine will eventually end up powering some buttkickers. You could also use one on a ported sub with a 20 hz tuning if you want the extra rumble of the 30hz boost. The -3db below signal isn't until about 19hz. That might work for my living room since I don't need and won't try to get below 20 hz there.
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post #22 of 126 Old 11-27-2012, 11:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nograveconcern View Post

30 hz. That's straight from the engineer that built it.

The line with a peak at 30 is my Yung SD300-6. The other line is my iNuke 3k. Ignore everything below 17hz where the mic loses accuracy.

What are the vertical divisions in the graph, 3dB? What exactly was the setup for measuring this response?

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post #23 of 126 Old 11-27-2012, 12:00 PM
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Vertical is frequency. Horizontal is 10db. I didn't level match, it just came out close.

All I did was place my RS meter on a paint can in front of the cone, take my filters off the inuke and run a sweep, then swap leads over to the yung and run a sweep. It was quick and dirty.

You can see that the yung is about 0-2 db hotter from 50hz up. The point was to verify the frequency that the HPF is set to as there was some conjecture about it being 19hz vs 30hz. You can tell that it isn't 19hz by looking at the curve. You can also see where that confusion comes from since -3db below signal on the +6db models is 19 hz.

Here is the full image with the scale not chopped off:

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post #24 of 126 Old 11-27-2012, 01:03 PM
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At least the boost looks to be centered at the correct frequency... Now if we could just get confirmation the SD500-6 actually has boost at 25Hz (and how much boost), that would be great info.
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post #25 of 126 Old 11-27-2012, 09:01 PM
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During the sales I was eyeing these amps. They are new to me, so I'm trying to decide on the 500w version or the Bash500S. It will power a living room project for my parents house.

"I should really see what dB levels I'm pushing. Long as it can't foam my beer during a movie we are ok "
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post #26 of 126 Old 11-28-2012, 07:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Do you have an ohmmeter? Or a way to measure a couple of resistors? I'd like to know what R8 and R23 measure on your amp. They are easy to locate, near the top edge of the pcb where the led is.

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post #27 of 126 Old 11-28-2012, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garciab View Post

Do you have an ohmmeter? Or a way to measure a couple of resistors? I'd like to know what R8 and R23 measure on your amp. They are easy to locate, near the top edge of the pcb where the led is.

Yes I do. I assume they are marked?
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post #28 of 126 Old 11-28-2012, 08:44 AM
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Yes I do. I assume they are marked?
How else would he know what to call them? wink.gif
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post #29 of 126 Old 11-28-2012, 09:52 AM
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Thought he had a schematic. IDK tongue.gif
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post #30 of 126 Old 11-28-2012, 12:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes, the pcb is marked showing their location.

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