Veneer On Roundovers - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 11 Old 07-14-2012, 08:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I think i may have asked this in the past but i can't find where.

I'm looking for comments on veneering the roundover of a front baffle.

I've been cheating by not running a roundover on any of my builds to date. So i just veneer the sides, trim the veneer, then veneer the front.

With a roundover i'm having a hard time invisioning the steps to avoid an ugly seam. I imagine you need to tape together some sheets to get a large section that will cover the front baffle and then wrap around the roundover and cover both sides all the way to the back panel. I can't see any other way to do it. But in that scenario, the clamping seems daunting. gotta glue up 3 sides at once and put the whole thing in place in one shot. all while keeping the veneer tight to the roundover...

I'm not too interested in running solid wood corners becauase that limits veneer choices to something you can find hardwood strips for. unless you can laminate like 20 layers of veneer to similate a hardwood strip and then roundover that?

Am i missing a better approach? Can anyone link to some examples?


Thanks,
Joe


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post #2 of 11 Old 07-15-2012, 12:53 PM
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I've only done this on one project, but you have the right idea. Cleanest way is with a piece big enough to cover the front and sides. Then slowly cover each panel. You have options in the type of adhesive you can use though. Pressure sensitive, contact, and iron-on. Somewhere on this site is the info for suppliers of sheets of veneers, and a place that sells the different adhesives.

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post #3 of 11 Old 07-15-2012, 02:52 PM
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The best trick I have ever found is the 3M water based contact adhesive. It is the only water based contact adhesive that works for anything. It sticks very well. If you slip and drop the sheet down before it's ready, you are pretty much screwed. It doesn't release with heat like solvent based adhesives do.

I do a lot of 1", 2", and 3" roundovers. I typically use the Formwood NBL backed adhesive. This is a 2ply but the grain goes the same direction as the direction of the veneer so it can bend nicely. I buy mine from Tape Ease, www.tapeease.com

This is done on a 3" radius:

399

This is on a 1" radius:
399

Put the 3M Fastbond 30NF on the sheet and box. Let it dry fully or it won't stick. Carefully start pressing it down in the middle of the sheet, blocking it down as you work away from the center. Putting plastic under half of the piece allows you to align it up and only press down one side at a time. You are limited to 48" wide though or you can get their 8x4 sheets which give you 8ft width to work with. The problem with that is they sand the sheet across the grain then and you have hours of sanding to get it to look decent and can risk sanding through. Either way you will have a seam or seams somewhere unless you do sharp corners in back. I put down a strip of clear plastic about 4" wide where the seam will be. Block down the pieces and let them overlap. Then trim through both overlapped pieces with a sharp utility knife. Sharp is key! You really want to do it in a single pass to avoid widening the cut. Once it is cut you can remove the plastic, butt the two pieces together and block that 4" section down. With practice you can get a seam that is no more noticeable than the factory seams in the sheet.

John

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post #4 of 11 Old 07-15-2012, 05:19 PM
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You've gotten great advice already, but here is another approach you can take.
It is a little trick I've used a couple of times. You'll see it somewhere on page 2, I think. Just another alternative.

Of course, you can always veneer the final front baffle before installing it on your cab. That can help, also.
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post #5 of 11 Old 07-15-2012, 07:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garciab View Post

I've only done this on one project, but you have the right idea. Cleanest way is with a piece big enough to cover the front and sides. Then slowly cover each panel. You have options in the type of adhesive you can use though. Pressure sensitive, contact, and iron-on. Somewhere on this site is the info for suppliers of sheets of veneers, and a place that sells the different adhesives.

thanks for the feedback - i happened to buy some heat-lock glue a while back but haven't given it a shot yet. maybe this would be a good time to try it out. i'm considering a large build but maybe i should try something small with roundovers first to see how that iron-on approach works out for me.

i'm very surprised by the polarizing effect contact adhesives seem to have on woodworkers. i've seen many great build threads reference using it for veneer with no comments about ever having problems. but several other sources i've read woodworking tips from swear that veneering with contact cement is the worst idea ever. i think the main arguement against it is that it never sets hard and allows too much movement as the veneer tries to shift with the seasons. can't be that bad if people on these forums are using it continuously? seems odd.


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post #6 of 11 Old 07-15-2012, 07:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John_E_Janowitz View Post

The best trick I have ever found is the 3M water based contact adhesive. It is the only water based contact adhesive that works for anything. It sticks very well. If you slip and drop the sheet down before it's ready, you are pretty much screwed. It doesn't release with heat like solvent based adhesives do.
I do a lot of 1", 2", and 3" roundovers. I typically use the Formwood NBL backed adhesive. This is a 2ply but the grain goes the same direction as the direction of the veneer so it can bend nicely. I buy mine from Tape Ease, www.tapeease.com

those are some great looking edges John. nice and clean. how do you get your large (ie. 3") roundovers? you bending plywood or something? don't think i've ever seen a 3" roundover bit smile.gif. it's a cool look.

thanks for the Tape Ease link. they seem to have a wide selection of sheets stocked. wish they had some pics of the species along with the price list. i'm not experienced enough to know what's what without a pic. i tried some paperbacked veneer on my first project. it was cheap and working with large sheets meant no seams, but it's way too easy to sand through. i've been using raw wood veneer since then but i'm terrible at seams so maybe i should try some 2ply sheets.

another vote for some contact adhesive.


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post #7 of 11 Old 07-15-2012, 07:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PassingInterest View Post

You've gotten great advice already, but here is another approach you can take.
It is a little trick I've used a couple of times. You'll see it somewhere on page 2, I think. Just another alternative.
Of course, you can always veneer the final front baffle before installing it on your cab. That can help, also.

Great reference build, thanks PI. the slats from the blinds is a great tip, thanks. I thought it might be difficult to get the seam between the front panel veneer and the side veneer tight and neat. i guess as long as you get it tight you can sand smooth any small inconsistencies afterwards. the two-tone look of that project is sweet.

crunch time at work lets up in a few weeks and i'm itching to start another DIY project when i get some downtime. been laying awake at night thinking about how to *not* mess up the veneer on my next project when i finally get started tongue.gif


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post #8 of 11 Old 07-16-2012, 05:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John_E_Janowitz View Post

I do a lot of 1", 2", and 3" roundovers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lowpolyjoe View Post

how do you get your large (ie. 3") roundovers? you bending plywood or something? don't think i've ever seen a 3" roundover bit smile.gif. it's a cool look.

I am curious about this as well. How do you get 3" round-overs?

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post #9 of 11 Old 07-16-2012, 05:59 AM
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I am curious about this as well. How do you get 3" round-overs?

3" bits are typically used on a machine called a shaper. Think giant table mounted router... I think about the biggest roundover bit you would want to use on a regular router is about 1 1/2". I don't even think they really sell anything bigger than that in 1/2" shank. I could be wrong though, I've never really looked for anything bigger than 1 1/2"

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post #10 of 11 Old 07-16-2012, 10:30 PM
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The roundovers are purchased from a company that makes them. They only sell in large quantities, but Anderson International Trading sells individually.

http://aitwood.com/StoreFront.Asp?ItemID=8400&wdesc=MDF%20Prefit%20%28L%29%20Quarter%20Rounds

At some point I hope to stock and sell them here as well. If I buy in quantity I can offer them for less than AIT does.

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post #11 of 11 Old 07-17-2012, 09:26 AM - Thread Starter
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interesting reports on the roundovers. thanks guys.

that shaper machine looks pretty hardcore. certainly not something i'll be able to get my hands on. took me over a year just to pick up a simple router table tongue.gif

the prefab corners make a lot of sense, thanks for the link John. you integrated them very nicely into your builds.


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