I am making three of them as my left, right, and center channel speakers. They will be replacing Jim Holtz Statements as my theater left / right and an old Audax center channel. They will be powered with an Emotiva XPA3. They will be cutoff at 80hz and paired with a Danley DTS-10 sub.
Unpacking:
As usual Erich packs everything absurdly well.
SEOS 12 Horns
Very well made. Nice weight to them, great finish, and super solid.
Compression Driver
Echoing the comments of others these thing are hefty! Surprisingly heavy for the size.
Flat Packs:
Well packed.
Dry Fitting:
Everything went together great dry fitting. The CNC cuts are excellent.
Assembly:
The way Erich had the kit CNC'ed this is the back piece. You simply glue everything to the already lined up back channels. It makes the build really straight forward and intuitive. You would have to try pretty hard to mess it up.
Here is with the bracing installed. The one thing to note is that the horizontal braces may not be square vertically. I used a square to make sure they were. Probably not a huge issue either way but maybe Erich can make a grove in the vertical brace as well so that the braces have to be perfectly square.
I used PL Premium and decided to put the whole rest of the box (with the exception of the front baffle) together in one go. They all went really smoothly.
Here are the three waiting for front baffles.
What's Next:
Gluing front baffles on today. Then going to sand edges perfectly smooth, paint with Duratex, and attach Speakon connectors. Waiting for the Deltalite drivers and crossover parts to come from Erich. Parts-Express hadn't given everything to him yet but he was kind enough to send the rest over my way.
Questions:
What is the recommending amount of lining / should they be stuffed with some polyfill?
Wow, you work really fast, and I'm glad everything arrived in good shape. It's nice to see that the new boxes go together easy enough even without directions. But I will eventually type something up.
You mentioned having the CNC cut some dados in the side pieces to make sure the horizontal braces were square. Those were in the original design and I actually took them out for a reason. The braces don't really need to be glued in the box perfectly square anymore to still get a perfectly squared up box..
I had the grooves on the back panel cut fairly tight so the braces would stand up straight on their own and hold close at 90 degrees. After you glue the braces to the back panel, you'll see that even if they aren't exactly at 90 degrees, it won't matter and the sides will still glue on perfectly. However, if by chance someone glued the braces slightly crooked, it would be much more difficult to line them up if there were grooves in the side panel.
So the new method completely eliminates any problems with that and still gives the same exact end product. You could have those braces glued in seriously wrong and they would still line up just fine with the side panels. That's good stuff!
It's how the new subwoofer boxes will be. Actually, I think you might have gotten one of those as well.
Looking at your pictures more, I'm curious if you glued the entire box together at one time? If so, that's pretty impressive.
I guess the PL adhesive has a much longer open time to allow for that? Whenever I glue up test boxes, I just use normal wood glue. There was a some concern that the thicker PL adhesive would fill the joints a bit more more and things might not line up as good. But it looks like that's not the case after everything gets clamped down and the glue gets squished out. Did you see any issues?
I do have all the crossover parts. Parts Express was out of the 12" Deltalites and they were suppose to be back in stock last week. When I called they said it might not be until the 12th. That wasn't good, so I actually called Eminence to see if they kept any in stock. They had 12 and let me make the unusual order for 10 of the woofers.
They'll be letting me know about shipping today. I told them if it was going to take more than a few days, I'd probably drive there to pick them up. They're about 1.5 hours away, but I made the trip once before when I helped with the MFW-15 group buy last year.
You make it easy! In the time I assembled these I probably would have only finished cutting half the pieces. Gotcha on the braces.
I did glue it all together in one go. PL makes it pretty easy and it squishes out totally fine. I've never had issues with things not lining up because of it. It squeezes out of the joints as you apply pressure and makes a really nice seal. You do need to clamp it well but you have 15-20 minutes of play time. The other plus is that it expands and will fill any voids you do have making a completely airtight box.
Don't worry, I managed bleed opening the boxes with scissors. Both build styles are certainly fun and I enjoy blasting sawdust into the air as much as anyone. However, the flat packs make you feel wickedly efficient.
With these new speakers nearly finished, you'll be looking to get rid of those old, over-sized, obsolete speakers. I'd be happy to take them off your hands...
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeerParty /t/1431867/seos12-deltalite-erich-flatpack-kit-build#post_22452562
With these new speakers nearly finished, you'll be looking to get rid of those old, over-sized, obsolete speakers. I'd be happy to take them off your hands...
I would just be interested your impressions between the two! the statements certainly have a great reputation, but are certainly a different design style than what you are about to have. Ill be tuned in for sure
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio /t/1431867/seos12-deltalite-erich-flatpack-kit-build#post_22452862
I would just be interested your impressions between the two! the statements certainly have a great reputation, but are certainly a different design style than what you are about to have. Ill be tuned in for sure
The Statements are wonderful speakers. I have only great things to say about them. Fantastic soundstage, great overall sound. I am certainly interested in the differences and will post my thoughts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilYoda /t/1431867/seos12-deltalite-erich-flatpack-kit-build#post_22452906
Horse stall matting, kettlebells, atlas stones...looks like a nice S&C or Crossfit gym you have there.
(Nice work on the speakers too, thanks for the detailed writeup!)
How much is this kit and does it come with crossover already built? I love kits for DIY and the price is more than DIY because someone is doing all the labor for you. My eD kits were done exactly the same way, all I had to do was put together and glue. I also nailed the enclosure together but that was for subs. Kits are great! Erich H is doing a great thing here!
BTW, what are the specs on this speaker, like sensitivity and power handling, basically, how loud will it play and extension? I am using DR-250's which use deltalite 10's and 20 piezo tweeters in a horn design(BFM) and based on their sound this should perform very well! More expensive kits for the big rooms(needing more spl) and the cheaper kits for the smaller rooms. Awesome stuff!
It's probably more expensive than us cheapo DIY'ers are used to, but that's a cream de la cream speaker there. Performance is top tier with top notch quality drivers. I'm not sure what this would typically retail for. Hard to even find something like this in the retail world. Well over $2k for a pair though I imagine. Of course that would be finished with a warranty and you wouldn't have to lift a finger. But it's hard to say there isn't value in this kit.
Erich is working on cheaper kits too. Some of those will sneak in under or around $250/each.
To give you guys an idea on retail(ID retail) eD sold a speaker like this to me finished. It had a DE-250 compression driver and 3012HO 12 inch driver which both are upgrades to this kit. The DNA-360 is supposed to be the cheaper equavilent and the deltalite 12 is a step down(from eminence). The finish was awesome and so was the cabinet. The difference was the horn and crossover so who knows if it would sound much different. The cost was $850 each so $1700 a pair.
I come up with about $310 for woofer (from Parts-Express), cd, waveguide and wood. Don"t forget about the crossover components. So $370 doesn't sound bad at all.
Depends what you are comparing it to. There are certainly cheaper options that are very good speakers. However, my perception of value with DIY is that as you get into the higher end you are actually saving a larger percentage of money. You can spend 50$ and build a DIY speaker that you could commercially buy for 70$ or you could spend 400$ and get something worth 1,200$. Of course there are always many other considerations + I am pulling numbers out of thin air but that's how I feel personally and where I am putting my money.
As stated below just the components would end up being really close to 370$. This doesn't count the huge expense commitment on Erich of getting the waveguide molded in plastic, shipping being included (probably another 20-30$ per speaker), and the fact that just about everything you need comes in one box already cut.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater /t/1431867/seos12-deltalite-erich-flatpack-kit-build#post_22454647
How much is this kit and does it come with crossover already built? I love kits for DIY and the price is more than DIY because someone is doing all the labor for you. My eD kits were done exactly the same way, all I had to do was put together and glue. I also nailed the enclosure together but that was for subs. Kits are great! Erich H is doing a great thing here!
BTW, what are the specs on this speaker, like sensitivity and power handling, basically, how loud will it play and extension? I am using DR-250's which use deltalite 10's and 20 piezo tweeters in a horn design(BFM) and based on their sound this should perform very well! More expensive kits for the big rooms(needing more spl) and the cheaper kits for the smaller rooms. Awesome stuff!
MK: From Erich including the entire cut cabinet flatpack, waveguide, compression driver, deltalite 12, crossover components, mounting hardware, and shipping it was 370$ per speaker. From my calculations and louis below it seems essentially the cost of the components. Especially nice that everything comes together so you aren't paying for shipping for six different things.
I'm not sure on the exact specs. I'll let Erich or Bwaslo comment. It is a high sensitivity design that will need to be paired with a sub.
I haven't received my crossover components yet. I do NOT believe they are preassembled. There was some mentions of PCB boards though so I am not sure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by louisdamani /t/1431867/seos12-deltalite-erich-flatpack-kit-build#post_22454945
I come up with about $310 for woofer (from Parts-Express), cd, waveguide and wood. Don"t forget about the crossover components. So $370 doesn't sound bad at all.
The only finished speaker that will even come close is the CHT SHO-10 for $400-$450. That uses 10 inch driver. Great sounding speaker! The eD speaker had more midbass punch with that 3012HO woofer compared to the 10 of the SHO-10. This kit speaker fits somewhere in between as cost of parts are concerned so the price is great!
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater /t/1431867/seos12-deltalite-erich-flatpack-kit-build#post_22455466
The only finished speaker that will even come close is the CHT SHO-10 for $400-$450. That uses 10 inch driver. Great sounding speaker! The eD speaker had more midbass punch with that 3012HO woofer compared to the 10 of the SHO-10. This kit speaker fits somewhere in between as cost of parts are concerned so the price is great!
There is a design just finished up that uses that same 10" woofer, but I think it will have a higher end compression driver similar to the DE250. I'm not sure what CD the SHO-10 uses though. Price should start about $200 less. If I recall, they will be under $250 per speaker, including the flat pack box. If you just bought the Delta-10A woofer and a DE250, you would be over $200, so you can see that there's some serious value in what's coming.
There's another even cheaper design ready to go that uses a different Eminence 10" woofer and will be around $200.......with the flat pack box.......including shipping. I've been listening to one in my living room for a while and it's very impressive for the price. If you wanted to build the box yourself, I think the parts come in less than $160 for everything, with shipping. Extremely tough to beat for their performance.
Obviously there are other 12" models coming too. Jeff Bagby is currently working on one of them.
Things are going to be getting crazy for the DIY guys.
I think the price is great as well especially for people who don't have all the tools to make cut the wood themselves. I actually have all the tools but will be buying the kits from Erich since I don't happen to own a CNC and doing these cuts without one is tricky and time consuming. In time saved it will cost me more to build these cabinets my-self so just having to put together a CNC'ed cabinet is a life saver when your busy.
Can't wait to hear how you like them.
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