First DIY project for a guy looking to upgrade - multiple sealed 18s? - Page 25 - AVS Forum
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post #721 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 04:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

So how did the CHT-18.2's sound compared to the Dayton HO18's? Is the gtg over yet? What were everyone's impressions?

The CHT 18.2s were not at my place. John isn't really interested in the DIY aspect, but is interested in a multiple large driver sealed setup. Craig is currently selling the 18.2s on sale for a great price which should get him the SQ and output he is looking for.
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Originally Posted by SeaNile View Post

Had a chance to stop by and check out Andrew's system today. It's by far the most impressive thing I have heard short of a professional rock concert. Everything sounds so smooth and integrated very well. The subs are not pushed at all the the output is insane. So insane that I put my Caps up for sale on the way home. My decision now is 2 or 4 of the CHT 18.2 subs. I am so tempted to go with 4 but for the first time in my life I think it might be overkill if it's anything like Andrew's. If my ears weren't still ringing I'd be getting 4....

I'm glad you enjoyed yourself. I apologize it was such an expensive visit to my place. tongue.gif
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Originally Posted by carp View Post

I keep wanting to tell you that you are crazy for selling your Caps for CHT but I keep forgetting those are the older Caps. I wonder what kind of output they have compared to the newer versions?

See my first comment above. I've heard both his caps and the Cht's before and in multiples outside of DIY they will be very hard to beat at 800 a pop right now.
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post #722 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 05:08 AM
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I will say the same thing, one for one I would take the Cap but 2 vs 1 I like the CHT.
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post #723 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 05:08 AM
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I will say the same thing, one for one I would take the Cap but 2 vs 1 I like the CHT.
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post #724 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 05:08 AM
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I will say the same thing, one for one I would take the Cap but 2 vs 1 I like the CHT.
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post #725 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 05:09 AM
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I will say the same thing, one for one I would take the Cap but 2 vs 1 I like the CHT.
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post #726 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 08:14 AM - Thread Starter
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post #727 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 08:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Wow MK you must really agree. biggrin.gif LOL.
Or he got the hiccups. rolleyes.gif

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post #728 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 08:49 AM
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Here is the basic response from data-bass between the sealed dayton and the larger ported VS 18.1.



Per Craig, "If you look at either our 18 or the Dayton 18, you will see that running it as a properly vented subwoofer tuned to 19 Hz will yield about 6 dB more output at 20 Hz than the same driver will at 20 Hz in a sealed configuration."

So put the Chase driver in a smaller sealed enclosure and what does the roll-off look like?
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post #729 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 09:04 AM
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A: a lot more roll off than than the Dayton 18" wink.gif

Interesting. It appears ported CHT 18" has about the same frequency response as sealed Dayton 18"...

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post #730 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 09:34 AM
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here is how dual CHT, the Dayton and the SI model in 8 cu.ft. box, no EQ, 600W signal



FWIW
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post #731 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 03:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zheka View Post

here is how dual CHT, the Dayton and the SI model in 8 cu.ft. box, no EQ, 600W signal

FWIW

600 watts with two drivers doesn't quite highlight what they can do. The SI and the Dayton really shine with >1000w per driver. biggrin.gif
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Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

A: a lot more roll off than than the Dayton 18" wink.gif
Interesting. It appears ported CHT 18" has about the same frequency response as sealed Dayton 18"...

Agreed, interesting for sure.
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post #732 of 1010 Old 12-29-2012, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

600 watts with two drivers doesn't quite highlight what they can do. The SI and the Dayton really shine with >1000w per driver. biggrin.gif
Right. But as far as SPL and FR the differences between all three is the same as with 600W signal. All three drivers are within 2 dB of each other under 100Hz.

With 2000W per cab, 1000W per driver in 8 cu.ft box, the main difference is in excursion. The CHT is pretty much maxed out at and below 20Hz. Of the three drivers, the SI has most mechanical headroom at this power level.

Edit: I messed up. I did not match the box sizes. The SI does not have most excursion headroom. In fact all three are above xmax @ 20Hz with 1kW in 8 cu.ft.box

red - Dayton, yellow- SI, blue -CHT



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post #733 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 07:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zheka View Post

Right. But as far as SPL and FR the differences between all three is the same as with 600W signal. All three drivers are within 2 dB of each other under 100Hz.
With 2000W per cab, 1000W per driver in 8 cu.ft box, the main difference is in excursion. The CHT is pretty much maxed out at and below 20Hz. Of the three drivers, the SI has most mechanical headroom at this power level.
Edit: I messed up. I did not match the box sizes. The SI does not have most excursion headroom. In fact all three are above xmax @ 20Hz with 1kW in 8 cu.ft.box
red - Dayton, yellow- SI, blue -CHT


Ah, you must have one driver in 8 cubes instead of 2. Here are 2 HO's in 8 cubes with 2000 watts:



Here is 1 driver, 1000w in 8 cubes:
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post #734 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Ah, you must have one driver in 8 cubes instead of 2.

you are right, 1 driver in 8 cu.ft. which is too big . stupid me.

this is how the trio looks in 4 cu.ft box


the CHT is the only one that may be in trouble at this power
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post #735 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zheka View Post

you are right, 1 driver in 8 cu.ft. which is too big . stupid me.
this is how the trio looks in 4 cu.ft box

the CHT is the only one that may be in trouble at this power

Sweet! I was afraid my two single enclosures were a bit big at 21" cubes. They work out to 4.29ft3 minus .45 for driver displacement and about.2 for bracing. I know it was said that 3-3.5 cubes was best for the Daytons, but my net works out to about 3.65 and each on a channel of the CV5000 yesterday worked just fine.... Never mad e a funny noise, seemed stressed or sounded anything but great. I am guessing that in 3.65, I can push close to 1500 without blowing past 20mm..hopefully:D
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post #736 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by dstew100 View Post

At the GTG we measured sub output via the standard Gorilla measurement test. AKA number of inches the subs knock the projector out of alignment. He has now changed the standard measurement unit to feet. Bwahahahaha

LOL! After reading this entire thread tonight, and then laughing quite loudly at this comment, my wife asked..."what's so funny?" To which I just laughed again, because trying to explain this thread to her would be like explaining calculus to a pre-schooler. Great build Gorilla! I'm just getting into the home audio stuff, but I can appreciate a great build when i see one based on everything I built in car audio for the past 15 years! I really wish I were closer to these GTGs so that I could see the goods from the start. Fantastic job everyone! Really makes me want to start an over-the top DIY build for my theater room. Perhaps I will with due time and a fifth of Jack
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post #737 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 07:59 PM
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Really makes me want to start an over-the top DIY build for my theater room. Perhaps I will with due time and a fifth of Jack

Hang around here long enough and you will. biggrin.gif

I've been on the forum for years, but it only took one week in this section to order 6 18's. cool.gif

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post #738 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 08:12 PM
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Hang around here long enough and you will. biggrin.gif
I've been on the forum for years, but it only took one week in this section to order 6 18's. cool.gif

You'll have that kinda thing from time to time on these bigger jobs biggrin.gif haha. Why oh why would anyone NOT want to go over-the-top with anything.

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post #739 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 08:42 PM - Thread Starter
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LOL! After reading this entire thread tonight, and then laughing quite loudly at this comment, my wife asked..."what's so funny?" To which I just laughed again, because trying to explain this thread to her would be like explaining calculus to a pre-schooler. Great build Gorilla! I'm just getting into the home audio stuff, but I can appreciate a great build when i see one based on everything I built in car audio for the past 15 years! I really wish I were closer to these GTGs so that I could see the goods from the start. Fantastic job everyone! Really makes me want to start an over-the top DIY build for my theater room. Perhaps I will with due time and a fifth of Jack

I'm glad you are enjoying. biggrin.gif like others have warned, the addiction here rubs off QUICKLY!! It's all great fun though. tongue.gif I only listened to my first pair for about 45 seconds before I decided I was building more, lol.
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Originally Posted by zheka View Post

you are right, 1 driver in 8 cu.ft. which is too big . stupid me.
this is how the trio looks in 4 cu.ft box

the CHT is the only one that may be in trouble at this power

I'm not certain what the xmech is on the CHT driver, I thought it was around 20mm?
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post #740 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by bass addict View Post

Hang around here long enough and you will.biggrin.gif
I've been on the forum for years, but it only took one week in this section to order 6 18's. cool.gif

Yeah I looked at PE tonight for those subs and they're sold out until next year. Have some jack and some crown in me tonight and was gonna start my own build for the fun of it. Guess ill check back next time I drink some whiskey, as that's what lead to most of my projects...Makers ALWAYS does it for me
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post #741 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 08:48 PM
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Yeah I looked at PE tonight for those subs and they're sold out until next year. Have some jack and some crown in me tonight and was gonna start my own build for the fun of it. Guess ill check back next time I drink some whiskey, as that's what lead to most of my projects...Makers ALWAYS does it for me

I didn't go with the Dayton's, I snagged the SI's. Those are available for you. biggrin.gif

BMG, on some random side note; you're not a gamer are you? You have a similar tag to a friend that I used to game on Xbox with years ago.

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post #742 of 1010 Old 12-30-2012, 08:59 PM
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I didn't go with the Dayton's, I snagged the SI's. Those are available for you. biggrin.gif
BMG, on some random side note; you're not a gamer are you? You have a similar tag to a friend that I used to game on Xbox with years ago.

I'm a gamer for sure, but never tried online, and only with ps3. Good stuff out these days, much better graphics than in my day. I'm only 30, but I can remember back to my preschool days when everyone got a "turn" at Mario, but my turn lasted half of a day because I was the one who jumped on the turtle shell on the steps and gained 99 lives. I guess I've always been a little over the top!
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post #743 of 1010 Old 12-31-2012, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post


I'm not certain what the xmech is on the CHT driver, I thought it was around 20mm?

20 mm is probably a good estimate.
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The xmax of the driver is listed as about 19mm one way with a recommended power rating of about 800 watts. In use the driver would produce this much stroke but the xmech seems to be at almost the same point as the useful excursion and the surround and/or suspension seemed to be the most limiting factor.
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post #744 of 1010 Old 12-31-2012, 02:17 PM
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20mm is a good estimate for usable xmax. the damage limit, xmech, is higher, upper 20's or so.

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post #745 of 1010 Old 12-31-2012, 03:02 PM
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20mm is a good estimate for usable xmax. the damage limit, xmech, is higher, upper 20's or so.

for the CHT driver?
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post #746 of 1010 Old 01-01-2013, 03:08 PM - Thread Starter
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A quick note for those running XT32 using multiple sub channels:

I've had WAY better results with this setup using only the one channel. When I run XT32 with multiple channels it does something funky with EQ and level settings and it was never quite right.

I've re-run using one channel for everything and right out calibration it was pretty much flat 6hz to 100hz. Really no EQ needed after that, but I've added +3db down low (10-25hz) to experiment. biggrin.gif Watched the few opening clips from Dark Knight and WOW! I really do enjoy this setup.

I also just added rear surrounds so now I'm full 7.4. biggrin.gif
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post #747 of 1010 Old 01-01-2013, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

A quick note for those running XT32 using multiple sub channels:
I've had WAY better results with this setup using only the one channel. When I run XT32 with multiple channels it does something funky with EQ and level settings and it was never quite right.
I've re-run using one channel for everything and right out calibration it was pretty much flat 6hz to 100hz. Really no EQ needed after that, but I've added +3db down low (10-25hz) to experiment. biggrin.gif Watched the few opening clips from Dark Knight and WOW! I really do enjoy this setup.
I also just added rear surrounds so now I'm full 7.4. biggrin.gif

So do you run a splitter from the sub out #1 and then route from the splitter to each amp/channel??
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post #748 of 1010 Old 01-01-2013, 03:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ChopShop1 View Post

So do you run a splitter from the sub out #1 and then route from the splitter to each amp/channel??

Actually I just run one line to the amp. My amp has a channel out feature and I use that as a "jumper" from channel one to channel two. Essentially the same result as a splitter going to the amp though.
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post #749 of 1010 Old 01-01-2013, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Really no EQ needed after that, but I've added +3db down low (10-25hz) to experiment. biggrin.gif Watched the few opening clips from Dark Knight and WOW! I really do enjoy this setup.

Yeeeeeeaaahhhh! +1 on this approach. I plan on employing a similar approach to the sub sonics (below 14hz) when I am up and running.

 

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post #750 of 1010 Old 01-01-2013, 04:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeeeeeeaaahhhh! +1 on this approach. I plan on employing a similar approach to the sub sonics (below 14hz) when I am up and running.

Ah, there he is! When are you going to begin construction? biggrin.gif

Some pictures of the subs in their home and the new rear surrounds:

biggrin.gif I apologize I hadn't cleaned up a whole lot before taking the pictures. I chose to spend the time doing some tweaking instead. cool.gif




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