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post #301 of 538 Old 01-26-2013, 04:31 PM
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Lot of horsepower up front there! Great job. They look mean as hell.

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post #302 of 538 Old 01-26-2013, 04:39 PM
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Well in my opinion you probably have some output left on the table with the wimpy EP4000. tongue.gif

The 15PS76 could take a thousand watts with a high pass around or above 50 Hz without getting into excursion trouble. I am sure that is more then double what the EP4000 puts out into an 8 ohm load (450 watts???). I think the DNA-360 might be safe thermally as well because it is padded a little over 10dB though I am not sure mechanically when it will tap out.

Erich is right about the clipping though that is bad especially if you don’t like replacing CD's. As long as you are not clipping or the clip light blinks only very scarcely on the largest peaks the speakers should take the power from the EP4000 all day long.
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post #303 of 538 Old 01-26-2013, 05:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Proper front stage!


Looks awesome! That's an intimidating looking front stage. Can't wait to hear your thoughts on them once calibrated and broken in. biggrin.gif

Scott
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post #304 of 538 Old 01-26-2013, 05:37 PM
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Wow, just... wow.

LOVE the looks and I bet the sound is awesome. How sensitive are they? I'm guessing a bit less than the SHO-10's which allows them to dip into the low 40's upper 30's?


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post #305 of 538 Old 01-26-2013, 06:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post

Yeah man they are awesome indeed!

One quick comment though, if you find the midrange boxy sounding try to throw some more dampening material in there. You could completely fill the top section where the waveguide and CD are mounted up with it, the bracing up there should hold it in place. Here is how the dampening in mine looks BTW:

Sorry to start critiquing after you just finished. redface.gif

Thanks for the suggestion Matt ! No worries suggestions/critique is always welcomed here. The mids sound great so far, but I do have some extra polyfill I can try out to see if makes an difference to my ear.
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Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

Glad you liked the gloss versus matte. Most people are ordering the matte finish, and they look okay with most of the woofers. But the gloss looks great, especially with that B&C. As PassingInterest said......'Gloss is Boss'.

Take it easy on that amp! biggrin.gif I'm not sure if amp clipping can cause speaker issues or not, but I think so. I can't recall what kind of power MTG-90 recommended for these.

You might also try toeing those in a bit more and see how they do.

Looking forward to any nice pictures you can get. I'll also be putting a link to each build on the speaker's page so others can follow the builds.

Heh, the clip lights were barely just being tapped, but you could easily tell the amp is/was holding them back. I do have my Crown XLS5000 sitting around that I could try out. That will definitely give them ample power. Nervous? biggrin.gif

I'm running Audyssey now and plan on watching the first movie with this setup right after. biggrin.gif It will be cool to see how they integrate with my subs too.


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post #306 of 538 Old 01-26-2013, 06:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by brian6751 View Post

Lot of horsepower up front there! Great job. They look mean as hell.

Thanks Brian! I'm enjoying staring at them right now. biggrin.gif
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Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post

Well in my opinion you probably have some output left on the table with the wimpy EP4000. tongue.gif

The 15PS76 could take a thousand watts with a high pass around or above 50 Hz without getting into excursion trouble. I am sure that is more then double what the EP4000 puts out into an 8 ohm load (450 watts???). I think the DNA-360 might be safe thermally as well because it is padded a little over 10dB though I am not sure mechanically when it will tap out.

Erich is right about the clipping though that is bad especially if you don’t like replacing CD's. As long as you are not clipping or the clip light blinks only very scarcely on the largest peaks the speakers should take the power from the EP4000 all day long.

It's clear they can take a lot more than the EP4K can dish out. The clip flights start to flicker at crazy levels and there isn't the slightest sound of stress from the mains at that point. As I mentioned above I could give the Crown XLS5K a try? I had them crossed at 40hz earlier.
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Originally Posted by skeeter99 View Post

Looks awesome! That's an intimidating looking front stage. Can't wait to hear your thoughts on them once calibrated and broken in. biggrin.gif

Scott

Thanks Scott - more impressions coming up. cool.gif

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Originally Posted by carp View Post

Wow, just... wow.

LOVE the looks and I bet the sound is awesome. How sensitive are they? I'm guessing a bit less than the SHO-10's which allows them to dip into the low 40's upper 30's?

Thanks Carp! I will have to check the specs but I believe mid to upper 90's sensitive?

Edit: Erich's site shows 96db. This seems about right based on the audyssey settings.


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post #307 of 538 Old 01-26-2013, 09:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Just got finished watching most of the avengers. A few more comments:

I ran audyssey and now have the front 3 crossed at 60hz. Audyssey set them at -9 which is very close to where my sho's were set. During most of the movie I had the volume from -10 to -5.

Clarity is exceptional. What stood out most for me was the center channel's dialog. Even with my center sitting on the floor under the screen, the width of the stage was great. I really see no need to move the center from where it is.

Dynamics: in this movie there are quiet a few scenes that go from very quiet to huge peaks in a split second. This setup handled them with authority. The many gunshot scenes sounded eerily realistic too.

Looking forward to playing alot of music on them tomorrow and just enjoying them in general. I will post some SHO vs. sentinel comments after I've listened for a few more days.


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post #308 of 538 Old 01-26-2013, 09:38 PM
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I guess the differences versus the Sho's would be...
More midbass overlap with subs.

Less 1100 Hz to 1500 Hz splashing walls and ceiling floor due to lower directivity?

DNA-360 less harsh when pushed? Extend higher for kids' hearing?

Less woofer distortion when pushed?
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post #309 of 538 Old 01-26-2013, 10:38 PM
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Glad you like them.

The XLS5K looks to have 1100 watts/channel into 8 ohms so it should pair up nicely with the woofer which at a 60hz crossover will be fine. Not sure about the CD though, if it starts to sound stressed then let off the gas some.

Looking forward to you thoughts on them compared to the SHO-10's.
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post #310 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 12:13 AM
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Kong theater! Those look awesome man super job.

"I should really see what dB levels I'm pushing. Long as it can't foam my beer during a movie we are ok "
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post #311 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 02:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post




Proper front stage!


"Proper" is right, sir! Very well done, Gorilla. Now you're hangin' in the big league. smile.gif


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post #312 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 05:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eyleron View Post

I guess the differences versus the Sho's would be...
More midbass overlap with subs.

Less 1100 Hz to 1500 Hz splashing walls and ceiling floor due to lower directivity?

DNA-360 less harsh when pushed? Extend higher for kids' hearing?

Less woofer distortion when pushed?

So far that's about right. To be honest I never really noticed any harsheness at all with the SHO's. I'm sure there is quite a bit less distortion with the Sentinels at those 'spirited' over reference listening demos. Midbass and extension is not even close, the Sentinels slay in that area. In all fairness the B&C 15 is about the same size as the entire SHO speaker, LOL. The cool part is the Sentinels extend much lower, and don't really seem to give anything up in the senstivity department. I still think the SHOs are unbeatable for a finished product at anywhere near that same cost. The deltamax is an even better value for those willin to DIY! But in my opinion the upgrade to the Sentinels for ~200 a speaker is a no brainer if you've got the room for these beasts.

Overall soundstage width both are excellent. When combined with a proper sub setup, I'm sure the Delta max or similar would be pretty awesome for 99% of the guys out there. The Sentinels take the mid-bass impact to a new level though. biggrin.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post

Glad you like them.

The XLS5K looks to have 1100 watts/channel into 8 ohms so it should pair up nicely with the woofer which at a 60hz crossover will be fine. Not sure about the CD though, if it starts to sound stressed then let off the gas some.

Looking forward to you thoughts on them compared to the SHO-10's.

For the next few days I'll leave them hooked up to the EP4K. I will experiment with more power later on once I have some hours on them and broken in.

BTW I wanted to send a huge formal THANK YOU your way for all your help over the past few weeks. I look forward to working with you on future uber creations too if you're up for it. biggrin.gif
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Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

"Proper" is right, sir! Very well done, Gorilla. Now you're hangin' in the big league. smile.gif

Thanks Scott! Time to get some hours on these babys now. How is your UBER mains project coming?


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post #313 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 05:10 AM - Thread Starter
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MOAR pics:

Doing some testing / build pics






Rears and speakon connectors




Hey guys, can I play too?




Front pics




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post #314 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 05:36 AM
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Wow you killed it, they look great!
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post #315 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 06:22 AM
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Very nice!

What's the plan for the SHO-10? Looks like you have room for an EOS 8/DNA 205 waveguide for an upgrade...wink.gif
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post #316 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 07:15 AM
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Great work sir. I absolutely love the way those slot ports look on the finished product. The other sentiment is right too, I don't think the gloss SEOS would look as good with the Eminence drivers in the Tempests but they look outstanding with those B&C's.
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post #317 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 09:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by MrSmithers View Post

Great work sir. I absolutely love the way those slot ports look on the finished product. The other sentiment is right too, I don't think the gloss SEOS would look as good with the Eminence drivers in the Tempests but they look outstanding with those B&C's.

Thanks Kevin! I love the slot port look to and in this case I didn't have a choice anyway as it was the only way to fit these under my screen. smile.gif
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Wow you killed it, they look great!

Thanks bud!
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Very nice!

What's the plan for the SHO-10? Looks like you have room for an EOS 8/DNA 205 waveguide for an upgrade...wink.gif

Thank you sir. The SHO's are about to be listed in the for sale section. biggrin.gif


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post #318 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 09:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Some more thoughts - listened to the majority of 'Dark side of the moon' almost twice this morning. I moved the LP up about a foot and played with toe in a bit more. Sounds fantastic - the best I've heard this album sound anywhere in my house so far. I found that the best sweet spot is about 6 inches higher than where the speakers are currently sitting so I'm going to build some small stands for them out of my plywood I have laying around. I'll coat them in duratex to match as well. cool.gif


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post #319 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 09:56 AM
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I was waiting for you to come to that realization that stands would make for a nice improvement. Great job. Wish I lived closer. I'd love to have a listen.

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post #320 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Thank you sir. I have the EP4000 on them now and they take EVERYTHNG the amp can throw at them. I had them up to +15 (not yet level matched) where the EP4000 taps out (clip lights) and they're screaming away, cleanly!

And you had them crossed at 50hz all the while? That is quite impressive smile.gif

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post #321 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Some more thoughts - listened to the majority of 'Dark side of the moon' almost twice this morning. I moved the LP up about a foot and played with toe in a bit more. Sounds fantastic - the best I've heard this album sound anywhere in my house so far. I found that the best sweet spot is about 6 inches higher than where the speakers are currently sitting so I'm going to build some small stands for them out of my plywood I have laying around. I'll coat them in duratex to match as well. cool.gif

Ok thats it, I gotta get my a$$ out to the garage and finish these thing up!


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post #322 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 10:21 AM
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These have me excited. I love the way they look. These will match my subs very well when they get done. Do you see any issues arising with making them a little taller by spacing the bass driver and the port. I want them to be either 28" or30" to match my subs in height?

Also, is there a direct link to this kit with the (slot port baffle? Edit)

Chris
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post #323 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 11:25 AM
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Originally Posted by filtor1 View Post

These have me excited. I love the way they look. These will match my subs very well when they get done. Do you see any issues arising with making them a little taller by spacing the bass driver and the port. I want them to be either 28" or30" to match my subs in height?

Also, is there a direct link to this kit with the (slot port baffle? Edit)

Chris

The original design is 29.5" tall.


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post #324 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 11:44 AM
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The original design is 29.5" tall.

Awesome news. Thanks again Erich.

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post #325 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 12:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by filtor1 View Post

These have me excited. I love the way they look. These will match my subs very well when they get done. Do you see any issues arising with making them a little taller by spacing the bass driver and the port. I want them to be either 28" or30" to match my subs in height?

Also, is there a direct link to this kit with the (slot port baffle? Edit)

Chris

Like Erich said the 29.5" normal version should be great for you. The original version has 3" circle ports.
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I was waiting for you to come to that realization that stands would make for a nice improvement. Great job. Wish I lived closer. I'd love to have a listen.

Thanks - I had intended to make stands from the beginning, just wasn't sure which size I would make them. For the center channel I'm going to make a small 45 degree wedge to angle it up toward the LP.
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And you had them crossed at 50hz all the while? That is quite impressive smile.gif

Actually originally I had them at 40hz but the music I was playing probably didn't quite have content that low. smile.gif They could definitely benefit from some more power eventually, heh.
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Ok thats it, I gotta get my a$$ out to the garage and finish these thing up!

GET IT!! We expect program update by tonight. smile.gif


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post #326 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 03:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Only a matter of time before I broke the omnimic out.

No subs, B&C's full range, 1/24 smoothing, post XT32 run, from the LP 18 feet away. Extension was the same without EQ, but I did have a good sized peak at 100hz. Check this $hit out! Extension to 19-20hz. biggrin.gif BTW I also ran the sweeps up to 110 where the sweep looks exactly the same. Thought I grabbed one of those too, but I guess not. Any more output past that and the omnimic gave me a mic overload. biggrin.gif



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post #327 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 03:28 PM
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Yup. That's what I expected to see. That's why I love big cabinets with a big horn. Can't wait to see near-field measurements, I've got a really good feeling about this.
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Only a matter of time before I broke the omnimic out.

No subs, B&C's full range, 1/24 smoothing, post XT32 run, from the LP 18 feet away. Extension was the same without EQ, but I did have a good sized peak at 100hz. Check this $hit out! Extension to 19-20hz. biggrin.gif BTW I also ran the sweeps up to 110 where the sweep looks exactly the same. Thought I grabbed one of those too, but I guess not. Any more output past that and the omnimic gave me a mic overload. biggrin.gif


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post #328 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 05:35 PM
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Sweet! those will sound really good in straight 2 channel i bet. have you tried them full range without the subs for music?

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post #329 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post
Check this $hit out! Extension to 19-20hz. biggrin.gifBTW I also ran the sweeps up to 110 where the sweep looks exactly the same. 
 

Jeeze Louise! 

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post #330 of 538 Old 01-27-2013, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Only a matter of time before I broke the omnimic out.

No subs, B&C's full range, 1/24 smoothing, post XT32 run, from the LP 18 feet away. Extension was the same without EQ, but I did have a good sized peak at 100hz. Check this $hit out! Extension to 19-20hz. biggrin.gif BTW I also ran the sweeps up to 110 where the sweep looks exactly the same. Thought I grabbed one of those too, but I guess not. Any more output past that and the omnimic gave me a mic overload. biggrin.gif


Crazy... Very impressive.. If you build seven of these.... biggrin.gif:D
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