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post #1 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 09:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Alright it is time to get started. Rilla and I have been chatting a little over PM regarding some designs, and I wanted to go ahead and get my thread started on the build I am planning. I need a little help with the box port dimensions though. I want to use these:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=268-353

I was thinking two per cab, as opposed to a slot port. I just love that look of the dimpled round ports. I have Erich's front SEOS 12 baffles, the 360's and the td12x's all already and am looking at about a 2.5cuft cab, with a hopefully 40-50hz tune. Assuming two of those ports per box, how much port length will I need? 2.5 cuft is not locked in by any means, I have all the room I need, but still want to use the front baffles I have from Erich, just thought that was a good starting point.

My plan for finishing is to get a nice flat black front baffle but the remainder of the cab will be stained and verathaned with a nice Oak finish to match the rest of my front stage. I am construction out of 3/4" BB.

Also, What are some good binding posts to use, or speaker terminals. I have used the regular old square terminal cups, but might this time just go for the regular binding posts. I DO like these however:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=260-314 They are the same as I had on my triple 12's and they are quite easy to use smile.gif

So at this point, all that I am lacking is the overall box dimensions and the XO parts, which is going to be the biggest issue, as this will be my first try :/
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post #2 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 09:56 AM
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Are you using bwaslo's crossover design? http://www.diysoundgroup.com/forum/index.php?topic=73.0

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post #3 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 10:01 AM - Thread Starter
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yep, might look at upgrading the caps, but haven't decided yet.
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post #4 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 10:16 AM
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Which front baffle do you have? The 4" round flared ports take a lot of baffle space, 7.5". I considered using them, but they took too much baffle space.

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post #5 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 11:05 AM
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Awesome beast! Looking forward to your build and your impressions vs the LS6's.

Regarding the baffle and round ports, you could use a taller baffle and have the ports in front or keep the baffle shorter and do side/rear ports.
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post #6 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 11:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

Which front baffle do you have? The 4" round flared ports take a lot of baffle space, 7.5". I considered using them, but they took too much baffle space.

I would more than likely rear-mount them then. I have a good amount of space on the front baffle, and I guess I could scrap it if need-be. I am going to mock it all up probably tomorrow and see where I stand, but I feel with two on either side of the driver, in the bottom left and right corners, I might be just barely ok. I wish they made 3" Dimpled ports but I don't see any.
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post #7 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 11:34 AM
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post #9 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 12:04 PM
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Beast - How much power do you plan on applying? 2 x 3" round ports at 5.5" long get you tuned to ~44hz. The only issue comes as you apply a bit of power (+300w) port velocity becomes a bit higher. I don't know if this actually audible, but it's worth mentioning I guess.


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+1

+2. I'm definitely going speakon on my mains build. I kind of wish I did with my subs, but I wanted to remain flexible and easy wiring options outside of the box without using junctions or anything like that.
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post #10 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 02:12 PM
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Haven't seen a build using the TD12x... Any benefits to going with that driver over the M or S?
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post #11 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 02:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ehoeft View Post

Haven't seen a build using the TD12x... Any benefits to going with that driver over the M or S?

The x has higher Xmax than the m, s is similar. Lookin for a little more extension with the x while sacrificing some efficiency.
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post #12 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 02:29 PM
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Doesn't the port velocity go down once your speakers are crossed over to the subs?
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post #13 of 377 Old 12-31-2012, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

I would more than likely rear-mount them then. I have a good amount of space on the front baffle, and I guess I could scrap it if need-be. I am going to mock it all up probably tomorrow and see where I stand, but I feel with two on either side of the driver, in the bottom left and right corners, I might be just barely ok. I wish they made 3" Dimpled ports but I don't see any.

Yeah, you need about a 29" high baffle to be able to put them on the front. There was no way to fit them on my 26" high baffle. That is why i went to a slot port. smile.gif

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post #14 of 377 Old 01-01-2013, 12:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Yep, I started looking at a slot port as well at the bottom, I really would love to fit those pipes but oh well, not gonna happen I guess. Next question, to get to 2.5 cuft, I have two options:

1) Leaving the horn section of the box in it's own partition, inside the box, and I will have to go 26 friggin inches deep with the box, which is much larger than the two front dimensions. This isnt a problem, but it might look a little funny.

2)leaving the horn section as part of the total box volume without separating it from the rest of the box, and then I would only have to go to 20 inches deep to get me a total of 3 cuft, before Horn, driver, and bracing displacement which I am guessing will be around .5cube.

scenario one even at 26 inches deep is still only 2.58 cuft so I could possibly have to go even larger than that...

What do yall think? and how long would the 2x13 slot port need to be to get that 40hz tuning? Could I possibly go any smaller with the box and still achieve that tuning?
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post #15 of 377 Old 01-02-2013, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Yep, I started looking at a slot port as well at the bottom, I really would love to fit those pipes but oh well, not gonna happen I guess. Next question, to get to 2.5 cuft, I have two options:
1) Leaving the horn section of the box in it's own partition, inside the box, and I will have to go 26 friggin inches deep with the box, which is much larger than the two front dimensions. This isnt a problem, but it might look a little funny.
2)leaving the horn section as part of the total box volume without separating it from the rest of the box, and then I would only have to go to 20 inches deep to get me a total of 3 cuft, before Horn, driver, and bracing displacement which I am guessing will be around .5cube.
scenario one even at 26 inches deep is still only 2.58 cuft so I could possibly have to go even larger than that...
What do yall think? and how long would the 2x13 slot port need to be to get that 40hz tuning? Could I possibly go any smaller with the box and still achieve that tuning?

A 2x13x13.25" slot port in a 2.5 box with the TD12X will give you 40hz tuning. Looks like this:

Port velocity is also minimal.

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post #16 of 377 Old 01-02-2013, 02:03 PM
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Why were you going to go so deep on the box? Do you not have the room to make a taller enclosure?

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post #17 of 377 Old 01-02-2013, 02:34 PM - Thread Starter
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I have plenty of room, just also have your 26" front baffle. smile.gif
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post #18 of 377 Old 01-02-2013, 04:36 PM
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I guess I'm missing something. If you've got a 26" tall baffle, then the enclosure only needs to be about 16" deep or so to net 2.5cuft, not counting port area.

If you're crossing to subs, do you need to tune that low and need such large ports?

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post #19 of 377 Old 01-02-2013, 05:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

I guess I'm missing something. If you've got a 26" tall baffle, then the enclosure only needs to be about 16" deep or so to net 2.5cuft, not counting port area.
If you're crossing to subs, do you need to tune that low and need such large ports?

Nope you are right on it actually. Box will be 26x14.5x20 to net 3.4 cuft. Subtract port (.18 cuft), horn, cd, driver, and I will be right around 2.5cuft once is all said and done. if it all ends up not taking that much space, it will just drop the tuning down a shade, which I am still ok with.

I prefer and will almost all the time be crossing to subs, but I like a lower tuning as the driver can handle it, and I could potentially play it without subs with decent results, as well, I want the speaker to extend flat well below the more than likely 80hz XO. It makes a difference, I promise. It also puts these into a different league than the other designs in hopes of actually being able to use them relatively full range if I ever wanted to smile.gif all still in a "not huge" footprint, even at 20 inches deep. I am about to start making cuts actually, and mocking it up, it doesnt look weird at all.

If there are any issues with this idea, let me know! I am ready to make some dust here!!! haha
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post #20 of 377 Old 01-02-2013, 05:13 PM - Thread Starter
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To be close to exact, if it just took up half that space with all things considered, and I was at 3 cuft, it would drop the tuning to 38hz using the same port length.

I can't model but I think even then that xmax would be in check with 500 watts
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post #21 of 377 Old 01-02-2013, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Nope you are right on it actually. Box will be 26x14.5x20 to net 3.4 cuft. Subtract port (.18 cuft), horn, cd, driver, and I will be right around 2.5cuft once is all said and done. if it all ends up not taking that much space, it will just drop the tuning down a shade, which I am still ok with.
I prefer and will almost all the time be crossing to subs, but I like a lower tuning as the driver can handle it, and I could potentially play it without subs with decent results, as well, I want the speaker to extend flat well below the more than likely 80hz XO. It makes a difference, I promise. It also puts these into a different league than the other designs in hopes of actually being able to use them relatively full range if I ever wanted to smile.gif all still in a "not huge" footprint, even at 20 inches deep. I am about to start making cuts actually, and mocking it up, it doesnt look weird at all.
If there are any issues with this idea, let me know! I am ready to make some dust here!!! haha

Hey now, the SEOS Zephyr model was built for full range. smile.gif

I definitely understand tuning them under 80hz, but I was thinking something closer to 50-55hz.


You'll probably be over 2.5 cuft if you're starting at 3.4 unless you're going to do something really crazy with bracing.

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post #22 of 377 Old 01-02-2013, 05:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

Hey now, the SEOS Zephyr model was built for full range. smile.gif
I definitely understand tuning them under 80hz, but I was thinking something closer to 50-55hz.
You'll probably be over 2.5 cuft if you're starting at 3.4 unless you're going to do something really crazy with bracing.

Is the zephyr with the designer 12?

yep I bumped it down to an 18" depth which is 3.04cuft before port, and other displacements. 39hz tune after that, still happy. It takes one single inner front baffle to the 3rd sheet of BB but I have some other leftover stuffs to use for that since you will never see it anyways smile.gif
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post #23 of 377 Old 01-02-2013, 09:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Just so ya'll don't think I am messing around...



What are those? PHASE PLUGS????? Yes, YES they are!!!! Cutsheet is done, Wood is down, I just need someone to build me a friggin crossover!!! haha smile.gif

Front baffle will be flat black (A-T screen happy) and the rest of the box will be stained Oak to match my trim in the theater and sub boxes. Not sure how it will all look but hope it turns out ok!!!
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post #24 of 377 Old 01-03-2013, 07:19 PM - Thread Starter
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And one more so you REALLY don't think I am messing around smile.gif I want to get all this done so it looks impressive before Scott gets his uber-main thread going which will make me look like a Bish...



Hoping to have these mocked up and start assembling tomorrow or this weekend in general. Still no takers on someone building the XO's for me?
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post #25 of 377 Old 01-03-2013, 08:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Still no takers on someone building the XO's for me?

Sorry B, I would if I knew what I was doing redface.gif

I have enough amps I was thinking of maybe using the DCX2496 as an active crossover, I am more of a sub fiend then speaker.
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post #26 of 377 Old 01-03-2013, 08:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Still no takers on someone building the XO's for me?

My offer still stands if you don't mind shipping parts here and back:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1395966/the-advent-loudspeaker-rebuild#post_22433947
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post #27 of 377 Old 01-04-2013, 04:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post

My offer still stands if you don't mind shipping parts here and back:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1395966/the-advent-loudspeaker-rebuild#post_22433947

Beast - You do have access to some measurement equipment like REW or omnimic, right? Do you have access to some sort of active crossover as well? Just for the design phase, of course.

Matt - Wouldn't it be easier to send you full sweeps with driver and compression driver in their respective ranges? I assume these would have to be taken outdoors, though. Just thinking it would be faster/easier than shipping. smile.gif
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post #28 of 377 Old 01-04-2013, 05:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Still no takers on someone building the XO's for me?

Why are you not interested in using the one Bill designed? http://www.diysoundgroup.com/forum/index.php?topic=73.0

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post #29 of 377 Old 01-04-2013, 06:25 AM
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I think he means just assembling them.

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post #30 of 377 Old 01-04-2013, 07:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mjaudio View Post

Sorry B, I would if I knew what I was doing redface.gif
I have enough amps I was thinking of maybe using the DCX2496 as an active crossover, I am more of a sub fiend then speaker.

I have the DCX as well so that could work, but I am more interested in the passive design as I am currently using the DCX for sub EQ.

Quote:
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My offer still stands if you don't mind shipping parts here and back:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1395966/the-advent-loudspeaker-rebuild#post_22433947

I will send you a PM. I don't have the parts yet, so I can just order them and have them sent straight to you. Thanks smile.gif I had forgotten you offered in the advent rebuild. That one is on the back burner right now since the SEOS12 doesn't fit on the front baffle :shoot:
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