HSU Owner going DIY **Finished Quad Dayton 18HO build pics** - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 26 Old 04-11-2013, 12:31 PM - Thread Starter
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So I currently have a HSU ULS-15 Dual Drive (2 subs) and I have been happy with the performance and sound quality in my dedicated HT. I'm now rebuilding my screen wall with a new 2.35:1 AT screen and I can't fit the HSU dimensions into the design, so I'm moving on to DIY. I live in Northern Virginia where there are lots of DIY HT folks and I have heard a TubaHT and a pair of Stereo Integrity 15's. The TubaHT had massive HT output but I think I prefer the sound of a sealed sub (a conclusion I came to over many years). I think I have narrowed my choices to the Dayton 18" HO and the Dayton Ultimax 15" but looking at the ideal box sizes, they look pretty close. I plan to build 4 across the front, so box size is important. I need to stay between 3-4cu per driver.

The 18's would have more wow .. but looking for woof (dayton 18 may be both). Not really concerned about the price difference. Eventually I plan on 2-4 more behind my second row so (again) a smaller cabinet size would be best. Thoughts. I've never used the modeling software ... was going to do that tonight, but thought I would ask. Any other drivers I should consider?

I only live a few miles from popalock but that's an entirely different level...
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post #2 of 26 Old 04-11-2013, 01:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Also, looking at the LMS Ultra on PE .. its says recommended sealed volume ~1.4cu ??? is that right? If so that would free up some space (in my room and my wallet smile.gif )
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post #3 of 26 Old 04-11-2013, 03:30 PM
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you can go really small with the lms, but the tradeoff is that you won't be able to put enough power on it to get it to xmax. small boxes are nice, but there is a point where the sensitivity is so low that the driver can't take the power required to push it to xmax.

both the 18ho and the um15 model similarly with the 18 being a little more sensitive on the top end. the um might be a little better controlled for critical listening on the top end, but who knows without a side by side.

the stereo integrity 18's are good for ht too.

a quad set of dayton 18ho's in 3.5 cubic feet of enclosure per driver and a 5000 watt amplifier (cerwin vega cv5000) and some sort of eq device would make for a meaningful upgrade over what you have now. the drivers are 4 ohm nominal, so 2 in parallel per channel pull full power from the amp.

the -ho has been tested at data-bass.com if you want to see performance.

good luck with your build.

edit:

here is 5000 watts total power on either:
1. 4x dayton 18ho's 3.5 cubic feet per driver, and
2. 1 lmsu 18 2 cubic feet


Listen. It's All Good.
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post #4 of 26 Old 04-12-2013, 05:02 AM
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I wonder how a pair of the Dayton UM-15's in a sealed enclosure, or a pair of UM-15's in a ported enclosure tuned to the recommended 18hz...how would those compare to the OP's existing HSU ULS-15's?
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post #5 of 26 Old 04-12-2013, 05:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

you can go really small with the lms, but the tradeoff is that you won't be able to put enough power on it to get it to xmax. small boxes are nice, but there is a point where the sensitivity is so low that the driver can't take the power required to push it to xmax.

both the 18ho and the um15 model similarly with the 18 being a little more sensitive on the top end. the um might be a little better controlled for critical listening on the top end, but who knows without a side by side.

the stereo integrity 18's are good for ht too.

a quad set of dayton 18ho's in 3.5 cubic feet of enclosure per driver and a 5000 watt amplifier (cerwin vega cv5000) and some sort of eq device would make for a meaningful upgrade over what you have now. the drivers are 4 ohm nominal, so 2 in parallel per channel pull full power from the amp.

the -ho has been tested at data-bass.com if you want to see performance.

good luck with your build.

edit:

here is 5000 watts total power on either:
1. 4x dayton 18ho's 3.5 cubic feet per driver, and
2. 1 lmsu 18 2 cubic feet


Hey LTD,

I build a pair of sealed 18ho's and have been underwhelmed (http://www.avsforum.com/t/1451411/rss460ho-diy-sound-group-flat-pack-build#post_23188691). I'm running them with an NU6000 (non-DSP). I have a mini-dsp coming, so I will be able to EQ. Any suggestions on EQing? I have REW.

Thanks,

Java
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post #6 of 26 Old 04-12-2013, 08:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Java View Post

Hey LTD,

I build a pair of sealed 18ho's and have been underwhelmed (http://www.avsforum.com/t/1451411/rss460ho-diy-sound-group-flat-pack-build#post_23188691). I'm running them with an NU6000 (non-DSP). I have a mini-dsp coming, so I will be able to EQ. Any suggestions on EQing? I have REW.

Thanks,

Java

If you have REW, have you measured? If so, post some graphs. You may just have a null but if the response/decay is good .. you may just need more! wink.gif Often times its more the room than it is the speakers. I like to try to achieve the best non-DSP response before tweaking it.

I just built super chunk bass traps in my space (2 fronts are complete) and already notice better upper / mid-bass response.
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post #7 of 26 Old 04-12-2013, 08:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

I wonder how a pair of the Dayton UM-15's in a sealed enclosure, or a pair of UM-15's in a ported enclosure tuned to the recommended 18hz...how would those compare to the OP's existing HSU ULS-15's?

I definitely thought that based on everyone's discussion that a pair of UM15's would probably match my ULS pair the best; however given the UM15 models similarly in the same size enclosure .. I would probably just go with the 18HO. Doubling the sub count + more cone area should make for an interesting upgrade (for almost even swap money after selling my ULS pair).
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post #8 of 26 Old 04-12-2013, 05:07 PM
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java, i replied over in your thread.

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post #9 of 26 Old 08-07-2013, 06:34 PM - Thread Starter
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So decided on the Dayton 18HOs back in April and unfortunately progress was slow (but steady). Here are some completed pictures. The first picture is the open screen wall so that you know what I had to work with. You can see the two HSU ULS-15's I replaced.


x

x
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post #10 of 26 Old 08-07-2013, 06:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Here is the rack .. I went with a Peavy IPR2 7500 (2ohm stereo) which is WAY more power than I need. Thanks to Gorilla (Andrew), Popalock (Austin), and many others for their input and opinions.

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post #11 of 26 Old 08-07-2013, 06:40 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm going to build 1.25" thick grills made out of 5/4 FG Pine (face frame like construction). They will make the bottom fabric all one depth when attached and disappear .. black on black on black. I'm going to use magnets to attach them because I have determined that I hate speaker guides even through I bought a crap ton of them thinking I was going to do my acoustic panels for the walls with them.
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post #12 of 26 Old 08-07-2013, 07:05 PM
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Man they look awesome. The entire room does. Great job!
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post #13 of 26 Old 08-07-2013, 08:27 PM
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pauleyc, wish this thread was about 2.5 years earlier. I lived in Ashburn before moving to the Southwest Desert. I would have loved to have been able to see your system along with Austins in Chantilly and go to Andrews GTG. Damn!!
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post #14 of 26 Old 08-08-2013, 08:48 AM
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Very nice room, rack and subs. All very well done.

I'm slowly working on 4 18" Daytons. What are your early impressions of the 7500? In particular, what do you think of the fan noise?

Clearly, I'm a man of action - just give me a few minutes to think about it.
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post #15 of 26 Old 08-08-2013, 08:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by filtor1 View Post

Man they look awesome. The entire room does. Great job!

Thanks filtor1 - The room is a work in progress (has been since 2005). Next I plan to do the acoustic treatments on the side walls and more bass trapping in the rear.
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pauleyc, wish this thread was about 2.5 years earlier. I lived in Ashburn before moving to the Southwest Desert. I would have loved to have been able to see your system along with Austins in Chantilly and go to Andrews GTG. Damn!!

Just about the only upside to population density tongue.gif
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post #16 of 26 Old 08-08-2013, 11:50 AM
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What speakers are the mains? Did you upgrade the projector hence the new screen or just wanted something a little brighter?

The room is awe inspiring for certain. I am sure that yours is the house of choice for movie night.
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post #17 of 26 Old 08-08-2013, 01:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by kjlewie View Post

Very nice room, rack and subs. All very well done.

I'm slowly working on 4 18" Daytons. What are your early impressions of the 7500? In particular, what do you think of the fan noise?

Thanks kjlewie - The Peavey is a beast. Probably way too much amp for four Dayton's; however my boxes are only 3.4cu.ft. and I have the gains turned down .. I really don't think I will get in too much trouble. If it were available, I think the Peavey IPR2 5000 would be a great choice. Based on the testing I saw, it appears that the IPR2 provides around 90% of its rated power. The difference between the 5000 and 7500 is less that $100 so maybe I made the right choice. Fan noice is about what I expected but a lower pitched, lower RPM sound than expected. Mine is outside the room (2 layers of 5/8" drywall) so I don't have any issues. It doesn't even get warm, so if it wasn't for the 5 yr warranty, I would just unhook the fans. I don't think I could tolerate them in the same room.
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What speakers are the mains? Did you upgrade the projector hence the new screen or just wanted something a little brighter?

The room is awe inspiring for certain. I am sure that yours is the house of choice for movie night.

Thanks clearwaterms - I had Triad Gold LCRs (at the start of the year) with the horizontal center and I got the opportunity to trade for the same speakers but with a vertical inwall center. Sonically its an identical match to the L/R and it minimized how far I moved my screen forward. This gave me a perfect front stage but I needed a new AT screen and I wanted to switch to 2.35:1 anyway (previously a 16:9). I did get a new JVC RS46 but just b/c I good a deal I couldn't pass up. I wasn't planning on replacing my screen and projector, so my guidelines for the sub were to build them so that they fit in the new screen design and they should cost close to what I sold my two HSU ULS-15's. I got $1600 for my old subs and have ~$1700 in these.
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post #18 of 26 Old 08-15-2013, 08:19 PM - Thread Starter
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So I finally got around to running REW. Not terrible. Assuming I tame a couple peaks at ~25Hz and ~70Hz. Compared to average, my 3db down point is around 14Hz w/o any EQ applied. The graph has no smoothing. Definitely think a miniDSP is in my future...

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post #19 of 26 Old 10-03-2013, 06:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pauleyc View Post

I'm going to build 1.25" thick grills made out of 5/4 FG Pine (face frame like construction). They will make the bottom fabric all one depth when attached and disappear .. black on black on black. I'm going to use magnets to attach them because I have determined that I hate speaker guides even through I bought a crap ton of them thinking I was going to do my acoustic panels for the walls with them.

Yo! Sorry I haven't posted here earlier. Been busy with the end of the FY and all. Now that I have a little more time I've been able to get a few things done. In regards to your grills, check out the grills I just made for my subs on my thread. Extremely proud of them!

I'll try to do a write up of the technique over the next few weeks just in case you or anyone else may be interested.

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So I finally got around to running REW. Not terrible. Assuming I tame a couple peaks at ~25Hz and ~70Hz. Compared to average, my 3db down point is around 14Hz w/o any EQ applied. The graph has no smoothing. Definitely think a miniDSP is in my future...


Nice raw response man. So, what's the latest with the mini? Still on your radar? It would definitely help clean up your curve a bit. You already no my preference, I like a fat low end, so my target curve would be something more along these lines....

9198d8ac_5_110_no_smoothv2_zps2b31f891.png

Starting this curve at 14hz may be a bit aggressive if running your subs hot during movie content, so maybe try a similar curve, but start around 20hz instead and leave the response below that alone for the most part.

With the mini you can dial it in perfectly to your liking!

Let me know if/when you want to come back by for a thorough demonstration of the mini in action.
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post #20 of 26 Old 10-03-2013, 07:15 AM
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Very nice room and great looking subs! Your initial response looks like you have plenty to work with also. cool.gif

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post #21 of 26 Old 10-03-2013, 07:50 AM
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Sorry I missed this post initially as well. Room and subs are looking great. I'm still loving the peavey's as well, although I haven't had much time to crank them up in the last month or so. Bah.
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post #22 of 26 Old 10-08-2013, 08:21 PM
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Theater looks great!

Seeing all these huge installs in NoVA is awesome, too bad the neighbors already hate me with a couple lowly supercubes frown.gif
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post #23 of 26 Old 10-09-2013, 09:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys .. summer has been busy and I haven't used my room as much as I would have liked but its definitely picking up now that the weather is getting colder. It helps that the summer blockbusters are coming to BR as well! wink.gif

Thanks Pop - I'll check that out. I still haven't finished the grills. I definitely have a mini in the plan but I spent this summer looking at new boats and ended up buying two eek.gif One is a flip, the other is a keeper but until I flip my wife has me on lock down ... tongue.gif

Thanks Gorilla - I appreciate the heads up on the Peavy source .. I probably would have been happy with the IPR5k but a little headroom never hurt anyone! wink.gif
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post #24 of 26 Old 11-17-2013, 05:55 PM
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Fellow Triad Gold Member......,biggrin.gif

I sent you a pm with a few questions...........appreciate your reponse.

BTW, nice room!cool.gif
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post #25 of 26 Old 11-18-2013, 06:13 AM - Thread Starter
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PM Sent

I do love my Triad Gold LCRs, but this Dayton success story has me wondering about SEOS and other DIY mains. I wish I could have made it over to Austins little get together a few weeks ago .. it would have been nice to demo others. cool.gif
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post #26 of 26 Old 11-18-2013, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pauleyc View Post

PM Sent

I do love my Triad Gold LCRs, but this Dayton success story has me wondering about SEOS and other DIY mains. I wish I could have made it over to Austins little get together a few weeks ago .. it would have been nice to demo others. cool.gif

Thanks for your reply..................

I love my Golds too........................but wish I could have used Gold Monitors instead! biggrin.gif

I need to find a pro amp that vents front to back................my rack vents to outside and is hooked up to a make-up air damper. Don't want these fans fighting against each other. My only alternative is to use SpeakerPower plate amps which is an expensive proposition! eek.gif
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