Stereo Integrity 24" subwoofer - not kidding! - Page 19 - AVS Forum
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post #541 of 870 Old 05-17-2014, 08:50 PM
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If memory serves that was the ported numbers
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post #542 of 870 Old 05-17-2014, 09:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Electrodynamic View Post

The only thing you'll get from me is 1500 watts RMS. cool.gif

It all depends on how you look at the woofer and our warranty. Our warranty covers manufacturer's defects. Our warranty does not cover burnt or blown voice coils. I could reference the abuse we gave the 24 at the G2G but what we did to that woofer is not covered under warranty. Warranty is not an insurance policy. Just like how you can't buy a new Corvette, drive it home, put the rear end up on blocks and bounce it off the rev limiter for a few hours and when the engine blows up you can't call up Chevrolet and expect a new motor to be installed for free. We rate the HS 24 at 1500 watts RMS. However, other customers have used alternative amounts of power with success. smile.gif

Com'n Nick. I would never lie about how I ended up with a bad unit as all the evidence would be posted on here from the get go before any damage would have been done.

So yes please share your experience with me/us on the drivers ability to reach its limits in IB kind sir. I had a 2010 Nissan gtr which recorded each and every piece of data that went on 24/7 just for those sole purposes being that a $20k trans under warranty was major undertaking by Nissan.

I'm just not wanting to be under powered with your driver but yet don't want to spend unnessasary amounts of money to over power them when all I need is a few watts over their limits to then back down. No shame in your warranty game. We all are responsible for our own actions when its said and done.

Now if I specifically asked you what limit of this or that would cause thermal or other failures that would be different since it would show everyone how much you don't want to give us crazies even more of an opportunity to cause you to cover warranty work that was pushing the limits even if we're just BERELY inside them.

Hope that made sense. I just want to have the ability to back down the power to keep them in check with careful planning. Movie content is quick and heavy on 3-5hz but for just a few seconds.

So come on and spill your findings please sir. I understand warranty guidelines and without them you couldn't make money dishing out replacements.


And all this was typed in EXTREME distress. Cops just left my house on attempted breakin so excuse grammar as both wife and I are still recovering as best as possible.
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post #543 of 870 Old 05-17-2014, 09:24 PM
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13 ft^3 is a good size for a single sealed HS 24. For the enclosure size guys 10 ft^3 will work. If you have a 10 ft^3 enclsoure for an HS 24 please liberally stuff the enclosure with polyfill.

Ported enclosure alignments start at 30 ft^3 for the HS 24. biggrin.gif
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post #544 of 870 Old 05-17-2014, 09:30 PM
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Oh and Nick, these free air runs are essentially the same as IB when taking into account how the driver will behave/handle the situation, correct
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post #545 of 870 Old 05-17-2014, 09:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiovideoholic View Post

Com'n Nick. I would never lie about how I ended up with a bad unit as all the evidence would be posted on here from the get go before any damage would have been done.

So yes please share your experience with me/us on the drivers ability to reach its limits in IB kind sir. I had a 2010 Nissan gtr which recorded each and every piece of data that went on 24/7 just for those sole purposes being that a $20k trans under warranty was major undertaking by Nissan.

You have/had one of the few production cars on the planet that internally document said data and use it to determine warranty or not. If you expect the same level of data-logging from a speaker you should look somewhere else besides our HS 24.
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Originally Posted by audiovideoholic View Post

I'm just not wanting to be under powered with your driver but yet don't want to spend unnessasary amounts of money to over power them when all I need is a few watts over their limits to then back down. No shame in your warranty game. We all are responsible for our own actions when its said and done.

Now if I specifically asked you what limit of this or that would cause thermal or other failures that would be different since it would show everyone how much you don't want to give us crazies even more of an opportunity to cause you to cover warranty work that was pushing the limits even if we're just BERELY inside them.

Hope that made sense. I just want to have the ability to back down the power to keep them in check with careful planning. Movie content is quick and heavy on 3-5hz but for just a few seconds.

So come on and spill your findings please sir. I understand warranty guidelines and without them you couldn't make money dishing out replacements.


And all this was typed in EXTREME distress. Cops just left my house on attempted breakin so excuse grammar as both wife and I are still recovering as best as possible.

I hope everyhing is Ok at your house. smile.gif I have unfortunately been there, done that.

1500 watts RMS. cool.gif
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post #546 of 870 Old 05-17-2014, 11:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiovideoholic View Post

And all this was typed in EXTREME distress. Cops just left my house on attempted breakin so excuse grammar as both wife and I are still recovering as best as possible.

Damn man! Sorry to hear that. Hope everything calms down for you and the wife.
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post #547 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 06:25 AM
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Nick whats the price going up to? i juts saw this on your FB

"A week and a half remain to get the HS 24 at the current price. At/on 5-28-2014 the price will increase its final cost"
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post #548 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 07:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrodynamic View Post

You have/had one of the few production cars on the planet that internally document said data and use it to determine warranty or not. If you expect the same level of data-logging from a speaker you should look somewhere else besides our HS 24.
I hope everyhing is Ok at your house. smile.gif I have unfortunately been there, done that.

1500 watts RMS. cool.gif

Well, I wasn't asking for monitoring package just stating the obvious, if its blown from abuse that's on the end user for using more than your 1500rms. You said in previous post that you could share what you put it through and I asked to please elaborate.
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post #549 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiovideoholic View Post

Well, I wasn't asking for monitoring package just stating the obvious, if its blown from abuse that's on the end user for using more than your 1500rms. You said in previous post that you could share what you put it through and I asked to please elaborate.

Honestly I wish I could elaborate but I can't/won't. I learned a long time ago to never say a speaker can handle any power above rated power. If I do, someone will see what I said and do what I said or apply even more power to it, blow it up, and quote me in their warranty claim showing me that I said it will handle "x" amount of power. With 1500 watts RMS you can use the driver all day, every day, and never have to worry about it.

You are right in that a wooofer behaves very similar free-air to IB. VERY similar.

I would read Swolephile's review, note how much power he has on it, use your own judgement and apply the amount of power you feel comfortable with. Or ask Ben about how much power he would run on the woofer if he was using it in an IB configuration.
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post #550 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 07:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Sibuna View Post

Nick whats the price going up to? i juts saw this on your FB

"A week and a half remain to get the HS 24 at the current price. At/on 5-28-2014 the price will increase its final cost"

$1299 plus the obligatory $5 shipping charge (lowest we could charge so the price is "shipped"), or $1304 total.
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post #551 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 08:43 PM
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Didn't the HS 24 start at $799 then increase to $999 and now $1299?
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post #552 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by gpmbc View Post

Didn't the HS 24 start at $799 then increase to $999 and now $1299?
it started at $699
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post #553 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 08:50 PM
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Some GTG street cred goes a long way. Not saying it's not deserving of the asking price, but those are some significant increases in a short amount of time.
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post #554 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 08:54 PM
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Realize that even at $1299 it is a value. At Beast's GTG, a single HS24 with 2000w (1 ch IPR-7500 at 4ohm) handily beat my pair of LMS 5400s with 2400w ea from a SpeakerPower SP2-8000. It was powerful down low under 10 Hz and articulate all the way up to 100 Hz. It pressurized a decent size room very well and two would have owned the room. I wish I could fit a pair of HS24s in my room but I can't. However, after hearing the HS24, I would wholeheartedly recommend it to anyone that can fit it.
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post #555 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 09:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gpmbc View Post

Some GTG street cred goes a long way. Not saying it's not deserving of the asking price, but those are some significant increases in a short amount of time.

I'm not sure of Nick's pricing but the $699 was to always be a preorder price to get some people to pay up front to wait for the subwoofer to be built. So Nick gets the money for the preorder and is then able to order the materials to build the subwoofers. Nick doesn't have a ton of money tied up in inventory for a sub that may or may not sell well and customers get a good deal. Win, win.

$999 is still pretty cheap for the subwoofer and Nick is probably really busy with orders. He could have figured out it took more time or money to build the HS24 and raised the price to ensure he can keep in business or grow his business. Alternatively, the HS24 is such a hit that supply and demand factors allow Nick to raise the price closer to perceived value. Or he raised the price because he's selling too many at $999 and he can't keep up with the demand so a higher price will lower demand slightly.

Besides the first guess for the preorder, I'm not sure what applies but I do understand. It would be nice to have a single price increase but one thing I've learned is that small business isn't easy and there is no right answer nor only a single answer.

I still stand by my feeling that even at $1300 the HS24 is a great value. I say that since I heard it for myself and know what it is capable of, which is copious amounts of deep, clean bass.
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post #556 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 09:02 PM
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I get it, I guess it just would be more appealing from a consumer stand point to see it priced a little more realistically out the gates instead of significant price hikes.
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post #557 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgage View Post

Realize that even at $1299 it is a value. At Beast's GTG, a single HS24 with 2000w (1 ch IPR-7500 at 4ohm) handily beat my pair of LMS 5400s with 2400w ea from a SpeakerPower SP2-8000. It was powerful down low under 10 Hz and articulate all the way up to 100 Hz. It pressurized a decent size room very well and two would have owned the room. I wish I could fit a pair of HS24s in my room but I can't. However, after hearing the HS24, I would wholeheartedly recommend it to anyone that can fit it.

Is this how it was tested the day of the GTG?

Did you power your LMS-Ultra's with said SP2-8000 against the SP2-8000 powered HS24?

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post #558 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrodynamic View Post

$1299 plus the obligatory $5 shipping charge (lowest we could charge so the price is "shipped"), or $1304 total.

Well, ****! That's all I can say. After talking to you about the price increase a few months ago I was perfectly fine paying the extra but now that's going up again. I want IB and big IB but now these are getting crazy expensive! Not hating on you but a mention of an additional increase would have had me locked in at what you quoted me. I'm sure they are extremely well built drivers but I could have locked in at a price that would have given me a more than a free driver with my purchase compared to the newest increase.

But I'm far from selfish and hope you keep making money while bettering your business in the process. My plans of 8 24s will just have to change with the costs continuing to rise.
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post #559 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 10:36 PM
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Is this how it was tested the day of the GTG?

Did you power your LMS-Ultra's with said SP2-8000 against the SP2-8000 powered HS24?

There were 4 phases to Beast's GTG on Saturday.
1. Single HS24 against 2 LMS 5400s
2. JTR Noesis 212HT-LPs(mine) against Beast's Danley SH50 speakers
3. Try to blow up the SI HS24 with 8,000w
4. Hook back up Beast's system for some serious enjoyment (Beast's 8 SI18s and Danley's were impressive and awesome. Best theater I've ever heard.)

Regarding test 1, a single Stereo Integrity HS24 was pitted against my pair of LMS 5400s. The SI HS24 was powered by Beast's IPR7500 and since I know there was only a single connection at the back of the sub initially, that means it was running at 4ohms on 1 channel of the IPR7500, which gives about 2000w. My LMS5400s were wired at 4ohms in each enclosure so they were each connected to a channel on SpeakerPower SP2-8000 and received 2,400w each. BossoBass and his son had measuring equipment so we were able to hear and see (Spectrograph) that the HS24 had more bass, especially below 15Hz. Regarding sound quality, they really sounded the same. You couldn't tell which was which when we did the A/B portion of the test.

Regarding test #3, the HS24 was rewired to allow each voice coil (2ohm) to be hooked up to an amp channel. Initially the HS24 was hooked up to Beast's IPR-7500 but after a few minutes, it went into protection mode. We disconnected the amp and measured the coils to find they were closer to 1.6 ohms instead of 2 ohms. So then we hooked up my SP2-8000 so that 4,000w was going to each voice coil for a total of about 8,000w. My amp worked well for about 15 min until we went to +10 over reference and after a few minutes my SP2-8000 also went into protection. It wasn't thermal, Brian at SpeakerPower and Mark Seaton thought it went into some sort of DC protection. We reset the amp and it continued with the HS24 but we were at or below reference and soon got bored since it was apparent we weren't going to be able to blow up the HS24.

One more thing. I've since ordered a second SpeakerPower SP2-8000 since Mark Seaton and Brian at SpeakerPower think I should wire my LMS-5400 subs down to 1 ohm and connect each sub to a channel of the SP2-8000 such that each sub will get 4000w each. I know that's a 1 ohm load on a 2 ohm channel but since Mark Seaton and Brian at SpeakerPower seem to think it would be fine, I'm going for it. So that means I will have 16,000w of power to 3 LMS-5400s (4000w each) and 2 UXL-18s (2000w each). It would be interesting to see how my LMS-5400s with 4,000w each would compare to a single HS24 with 8000w. I have a feeling it might be a closer fight than it was in the first test.
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post #560 of 870 Old 05-18-2014, 11:31 PM
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Wow! 8kW was feed to a single HS24 somemore +10 above/over reference level, that's insane eek.gif what contents were you guys demo/ tested with?
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post #561 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 12:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgage View Post

Realize that even at $1299 it is a value. At Beast's GTG, a single HS24 with 2000w (1 ch IPR-7500 at 4ohm) handily beat my pair of LMS 5400s with 2400w ea from a SpeakerPower SP2-8000. It was powerful down low under 10 Hz and articulate all the way up to 100 Hz. It pressurized a decent size room very well and two would have owned the room. I wish I could fit a pair of HS24s in my room but I can't. However, after hearing the HS24, I would wholeheartedly recommend it to anyone that can fit it.

At $1299 it would cost more then what I paid for three UXL-18's, do you think the HS24 would out perform three UXL-18's seeing that they are the same price?

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post #562 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 08:17 AM
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Wow! 8kW was feed to a single HS24 somemore +10 above/over reference level, that's insane eek.gif what contents were you guys demo/ tested with?

we ran through all kinds of stuff! All the big bass demo scenes like HTTYD, WOTW, Irene, Battle LA etc. Along with several music tracks with some serious bottom end on them, and sine waves to test as well. It was intense. I felt like I was beat up after the whole day of brutal bass.....

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post #563 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 08:24 AM
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Yes but the question is for $1600 you could get 8 18's or $1300 for one 24.
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post #564 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 08:31 AM
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I was lucky to get two at $699 each biggrin.gif same for Swolephile, Popalock and few others, ChopShop is even lucky to get 8 cool.gif
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post #565 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

At $1299 it would cost more then what I paid for three UXL-18's, do you think the HS24 would out perform three UXL-18's seeing that they are the same price?

The SI HS24 appears to be the best single DIY subwoofer in the world so you wouldn't necessarily expect it to be the best value.

When I first came back to AVS, I learned that multiple subs was better than a single sub to ensure consistent coverage of the frequency range at multiple seating positions. With this thought in mind, here are my recommendations.

If you can't afford to buy AND fit two HS24s then I would mark them off of your list (my opinion). If you have a small room then a single HS24 might pressurize it but you won't necessarily get consistent bass coverage at every seat. A pair of HS24s would pressurize most small to medium size rooms and would even out the bass response at all/most seats. To truly get the most out of yours subs and speakers, you will also need to treat it with bass traps and acoustic traps so don't forget this crucial step and expense.

If you can't buy/fit a pair of HS24s then I see two options. The first option is the UXL-18 but if you're like many of the people quoted on this forum you'll want at least 4. I have 3 LMS-5400s hooked up and 2 UXL-18s that I need to build enclosures for. With 3 I feel like it is great but needs 1 or 2 more to be awesome so with 5 I should be set. My room is 13x17 and open to a kitchen/hall/stairs in back. Realize that the UXl-18s will play solid down to about 10-12Hz while a pair of HS24s will be solid to 5-6Hz depending on the room. Not a big deal but something to note.

The second option is to contact Nick at SI and see how many 15/18s he has left as I understand he might have some B-stock still available. But you'll need to double the SI HT18s to 8 to get the equivalent of 4 UXL-18s. Note that Beast has 8 SI HT18s and his room is PHENOMENAL.
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post #566 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 10:16 AM
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for what it is worth, a single hs24 models closest to 3x dayton um18's in terms of sensitivity, with the daytons having a couple db more swept volume for max spl. in a sealed enclosure of the same size, 3 um's provide a little lower q, for those who might be looking at that. that said, who knows if the um's will ever actually make it to market. eta currently 6/29. a 24" is just pretty cool though and when compared against a similarly priced offering from jl audio or something in the car audio world, it would seem to be a really good value too.

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post #567 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by audiovideoholic View Post

Well, I wasn't asking for monitoring package just stating the obvious, if its blown from abuse that's on the end user for using more than your 1500rms. You said in previous post that you could share what you put it through and I asked to please elaborate.

To answer your question:

I was testing it a lot last night. At about 1/3 of my amps power I could no longer make it hit (bottom out) while in free-air with a 5hz - 100hz sine sweep.
This is a maximum intensity sine wave played at reference with a 0dB level adjustment on the sub; My signal chain is from an HTPC->Onkyo->CV5000->HS 24

Because I have the amp in parallel mode (one coil per channel) it is effectively doing 2500Watts per voice coil when at full power (assuming exactly 2ohm resistance).

This makes it 1/3 of 2500 watts or about 830watts per coil. So just over 1660 watts for both coils.

With normal material you could probably do a lot more (see above posts for proof of 8kW). My own setup will probably be close to the full power of my amp 5kW, but I need an enclosure first before I will feel ok running that 24/7



Now, will the source material ever be full intensity like my sine wave test? Most likely never..... (except when you are in a clipping scenario)

The other thing that makes my results sketchy are the assumption that the load is exactly 2ohm. I didn't measure the coils, but I plan on doing that tonight, but even then the resistance changes based on any number of factors (major one being heat).
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post #568 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by dgage View Post

There were 4 phases to Beast's GTG on Saturday.
1. Single HS24 against 2 LMS 5400s
2. JTR Noesis 212HT-LPs(mine) against Beast's Danley SH50 speakers
3. Try to blow up the SI HS24 with 8,000w
4. Hook back up Beast's system for some serious enjoyment (Beast's 8 SI18s and Danley's were impressive and awesome. Best theater I've ever heard.)

Regarding test 1, a single Stereo Integrity HS24 was pitted against my pair of LMS 5400s. The SI HS24 was powered by Beast's IPR7500 and since I know there was only a single connection at the back of the sub initially, that means it was running at 4ohms on 1 channel of the IPR7500, which gives about 2000w. My LMS5400s were wired at 4ohms in each enclosure so they were each connected to a channel on SpeakerPower SP2-8000 and received 2,400w each. BossoBass and his son had measuring equipment so we were able to hear and see (Spectrograph) that the HS24 had more bass, especially below 15Hz. Regarding sound quality, they really sounded the same. You couldn't tell which was which when we did the A/B portion of the test.

Regarding test #3, the HS24 was rewired to allow each voice coil (2ohm) to be hooked up to an amp channel. Initially the HS24 was hooked up to Beast's IPR-7500 but after a few minutes, it went into protection mode. We disconnected the amp and measured the coils to find they were closer to 1.6 ohms instead of 2 ohms. So then we hooked up my SP2-8000 so that 4,000w was going to each voice coil for a total of about 8,000w. My amp worked well for about 15 min until we went to +10 over reference and after a few minutes my SP2-8000 also went into protection. It wasn't thermal, Brian at SpeakerPower and Mark Seaton thought it went into some sort of DC protection. We reset the amp and it continued with the HS24 but we were at or below reference and soon got bored since it was apparent we weren't going to be able to blow up the HS24.

One more thing. I've since ordered a second SpeakerPower SP2-8000 since Mark Seaton and Brian at SpeakerPower think I should wire my LMS-5400 subs down to 1 ohm and connect each sub to a channel of the SP2-8000 such that each sub will get 4000w each. I know that's a 1 ohm load on a 2 ohm channel but since Mark Seaton and Brian at SpeakerPower seem to think it would be fine, I'm going for it. So that means I will have 16,000w of power to 3 LMS-5400s (4000w each) and 2 UXL-18s (2000w each). It would be interesting to see how my LMS-5400s with 4,000w each would compare to a single HS24 with 8000w. I have a feeling it might be a closer fight than it was in the first test.

First of all, I want to hear about it when you do get that second SP2-8K and rewire. Nice.

I totally forgot about the shutdown on the Peavey. So it really sounds like we need to have a proper amp comparison testing of the IPR2-7500 against the SP2-8000. Seems pretty obvious that the SP amp has the extra ooommphh down low where we need it and the endurance to take a real beating too. Not that the Peavey isn't great it just isn't nearly as robust compared to the SP. Bear in mind the price premium (for the SP) and what they are being subjected to actually speaks volumes of how good those Peavey's much be for $800.

Although I do wonder how much of an impression was left on all of you not purely by the SI-24 driver, alone but by the SI-24 and SP amp combination. It sounds like they were made for each other.

Thanks for responding, dgage. Excellent post, sir. smile.gif

My Dual 18" LLT subs 120dB down to 10hz

 

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post #569 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 10:51 AM
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Well, ****! That's all I can say. After talking to you about the price increase a few months ago I was perfectly fine paying the extra but now that's going up again. I want IB and big IB but now these are getting crazy expensive! Not hating on you but a mention of an additional increase would have had me locked in at what you quoted me. I'm sure they are extremely well built drivers but I could have locked in at a price that would have given me a more than a free driver with my purchase compared to the newest increase.

But I'm far from selfish and hope you keep making money while bettering your business in the process. My plans of 8 24s will just have to change with the costs continuing to rise.

Still have a week and a half at the $999 price or are you not able to order yet?

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post #570 of 870 Old 05-19-2014, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiovideoholic View Post

Well, ****! That's all I can say. After talking to you about the price increase a few months ago I was perfectly fine paying the extra but now that's going up again. I want IB and big IB but now these are getting crazy expensive! Not hating on you but a mention of an additional increase would have had me locked in at what you quoted me. I'm sure they are extremely well built drivers but I could have locked in at a price that would have given me a more than a free driver with my purchase compared to the newest increase.

But I'm far from selfish and hope you keep making money while bettering your business in the process. My plans of 8 24s will just have to change with the costs continuing to rise.

Still have a week and a half at the $999 price or are you not able to order yet?

you can order
i just ordered mine
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