7 SEOS12's, 7 Cel 15's, 6 Dayton UM's, Build Thread - Page 19 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #541 of 580 Old 09-13-2015, 08:13 PM
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Sorry, Bass, I did not realize you did not have all the DCX's and amps you needed. I totally understand running passive x-overs on the ones you have yet to convert to active.


So the CleanBox Pro is a Godsend as I mentioned before. I think I mistakenly said I have two 12" subs. I actually have two 15" Alpine SWR-1542D subs in two separate ported enclosures being driven by a Behringer EP4000. The enclosures are tuned to 21 Hz. I decided to watch the Eagles Live from Melbourne this evening. This is one of the best music Blue rays I have heard so far. The bass was square in my chest and I was loving every minute of it.


The project for DIY pro-audio speakers and amps has really gotten me thinking. Instead of having a ba-jillion CleanBox Pros for each amp, what kind of multi-channel rack-mount option is there. So far this is all I could find:


https://proaudio.com/catalog/arx-bal...-optimizer.asp


You guys know of any other options?
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post #542 of 580 Old 09-14-2015, 05:22 PM - Thread Starter
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So I checked stock online, and I reserved online, and drove for 1 hour, and got to BestBuy and they said they were out of GoPro Black's. I'm so steaming mad right now.
Website fail!

Instead of playing with a camera I now have to cut more wood!
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post #543 of 580 Old 09-14-2015, 05:48 PM
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Serves you right for relying on Best Buy. You should have known better than that, bud.
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post #544 of 580 Old 09-14-2015, 08:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post
Serves you right for relying on Best Buy. You should have known better than that, bud.
Shoulda done 2 Day Amazon. LOL!

To make matters even worse, not 2 hours after I got home they called me and said... "found it", now I have to go back tomorrow to pick it up (again!)

This thing as a few cool features that I like:
1) 170degree VOF (vs the 1% VOF my old cam had.)

2)
4K@30FPS
1080P@120FPS
720P@240FPS
That is significantly better than I had before.

3)
Waterproof

However there are a few downsides:
-no zoom
-no viewer

That's about all I know of ATM...

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post #545 of 580 Old 09-14-2015, 11:54 PM - Thread Starter
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I've never seen this before. In the zillions of holes I have routered. (Just my luck, of course.)
As I was routing out the inset, the bit hit an internal knot between the laminations in this critical area, which of course caused the knot to explode, leaving a crater.
I had to fill it in with wood glue, then I'll have to sand it flat once dry.
I couldn't just leave it because it would allow a massive air leak.


But in good news, I have added another 10 angle-braces to the box.
I think that, in combination with the double baffle, will make this thing about a million times stronger.
When the dual UM-15's and the mid were pumping hard I was noticing some box flex, so I do believe all of this is very much necessary.
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post #546 of 580 Old 09-15-2015, 12:05 AM
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at the crazy level of performance that you have bth, have you considered isolating each component in its own enclosure/individual baffle in order to minimize any residual effects of baffle vibration that may be introduced by the woofers on the mids and highs? somewhere along the line linkwitz did this and hasn't gone back.


edit: haha, i stand corrected. he did go back.
http://www.linkwitzlab.com/LX521/PhotoGallery.htm

Listen. It's All Good.

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post #547 of 580 Old 09-15-2015, 12:23 AM - Thread Starter
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There is one between the bass and mids/highs. It would rip the mid apart without it.
There is one between the bass units too, but shared the space.

The only thing I didn't do was build one for the tweeter, but I will if I have too...
It's not too late, there are ways of doing it (maybe...)
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post #548 of 580 Old 09-15-2015, 12:30 AM - Thread Starter
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I supposed you could build 3 boxes and sit them on top of each other with rubber pads isolating them. That's a lot of extra work, you'd have to use some sort of iso-clips to hold it all together.
That would be pretty far out there on the overkill. I don't think that level of isolation is necessary for good sound. But hey, you don't know until you try

This sort of thing has crossed my mind at least twice.
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post #549 of 580 Old 09-15-2015, 01:02 AM
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The benefit of isolating the drivers in separate enclosures would mostly be to be able to vary the amount of stuffing. The lowest octaves don't require a lot of stuffing top get rid of the "box noise" and any stuffing will make the enclosure deviate more from the mathematical model.
To get a solid enough enclosure (ideally no give at all, like concrete) the separate enclosures would not help in itself except there's less volume to strengthen beyond insanity since the tweeter enclosure and mid enclosure requires a tad less reinforcement. Leaving the extra reinforcement for the low frequency drivers. But tbh reinforcement is cheap, polyester resin is cheap, as is wood. Its just a matter of making reinforcement that is less labor intensive. Strips of wood glued in place with polyester and a double layer 200 gram glassfiber mat. Goes quick, rock solid result.
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post #550 of 580 Old 09-15-2015, 10:15 PM - Thread Starter
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This is the first image I have ever taken of stars, 30 second exposure night-mode on the GoPro Hero 4 Black.
That is more stars than you can see with your eye!


None of my other cameras or camcorders could do this, not even close.

It is also the first camera that was able to capture the full width of my room in a single video frame. 170 degree FOV. A tiny bit of fish eye, but hey whatever works!

The only thing I wish it had was optical zoom capability...

I did a spectral analysis of it's mic, and it was hottest in the bass (10-60hz) by about 30db, hopefully that doesn't make it too hot for recording subwoofers (I'll have to try that out next...)
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post #551 of 580 Old 09-17-2015, 11:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Got the other 2 baffles rough cut, routing the left speaker tomorrow evening, still waiting for the knot glue to dry to level on the right speaker.

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post #552 of 580 Old 09-18-2015, 09:15 AM
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I can't see the gopro images, btw.
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post #553 of 580 Old 09-18-2015, 10:23 AM - Thread Starter
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post #554 of 580 Old 09-18-2015, 10:24 AM - Thread Starter
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I have now added a corner brace to every corner on all 3 axis on the first box. It is a lot of braces! I even added braces directly under the tweeter section just for overkill.


Video, or it never happened!!!

You can watch in 4K fullscreen for best quality.
(if you have a 4K screen that is...)

My braces are always ugly, but it gets the job done!

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post #555 of 580 Old 09-18-2015, 03:30 PM
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Nice bracing, its never overkill. Once you give it some juice you'd be surprised how much the surfaces actually move even with lots of bracing. Having a few more triangles with the hypotenuse side glued onto the middle of the surfaces would also be sweet, just cut slits in the fibrous filler mats when installing it. Any movement at all is lost db and affects the tuning. Not to mention it affects the cone movement itself with audio energy produced by the moving surfaces.
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post #556 of 580 Old 09-22-2015, 12:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Here is the Before and After acoustical difference of the new bracing, on three of the weakest spots on the box:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwU...ew?usp=sharing

Before:

After:


Before:

After:


Before:

After:


Seems like the cab vibrations have shifted 50hz higher and reduced in SPL by 6-10db.
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post #557 of 580 Old 09-27-2015, 01:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Just gluing on the 2nd baffle to the Left speaker right now.
Then routing begins. Should have it buttoned up by late tonight.

Should start on the center channel tomorrow afternoon, weather permitting.

After that, I guess this thread will be 95% completed.
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post #558 of 580 Old 09-28-2015, 07:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Need more time for the braces to dry. Ran out of daylight.
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post #559 of 580 Old 10-01-2015, 11:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Got Left and Right zipped up now.

Just working on the center channel...
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post #560 of 580 Unread 10-12-2015, 06:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Haven't had much free time. Just about done though. Progress is being made. Not long now...
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post #561 of 580 Unread 10-24-2015, 06:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Ended up adding 18 new braces to the center; in addition to the 1.5inches of wood.
Boom Boom!



95% done this thread now.
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post #562 of 580 Unread 01-02-2016, 12:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Ordered the Fostex super tweeters. Should be here by Friday with any luck.


7.5kHz to 40kHz @ 101db/w, 30watts
Designed in Japan, Made in China.


I'm hoping these sound good.

My UMIK is only rated for 25kHz, oh well...
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post #563 of 580 Unread 01-02-2016, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BassThatHz View Post
Ordered the Fostex super tweeters. Should be here by Friday with any luck.


7.5kHz to 40kHz @ 101db/w, 30watts
Designed in Japan, Made in China.


I'm hoping these sound good.

My UMIK is only rated for 25kHz, oh well...
No human can hear 25k, so what is the point of a tweeter to 40k? For dogs and porpoises?

SI HST-18 DIY Subwoofer / Sony VPLHW40ES / Onkyo TX-NR636 /
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post #564 of 580 Unread 01-02-2016, 10:27 PM - Thread Starter
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This is what I currently have coming out the SEOS.
I wouldn't call that "flat".
I don't want to be down 30db @ 20kHz anymore.
I can definitely hear that rolloff even with my ageing abused ears.


It is also a step backwards from the speaker I was upgrading from. I want my DIY-speaker to at least match the performance of the Hi-Fi speaker I had before.

Which means being flat to the limits of CD-A resolution: 22kHz.
Now if I can best the B&W 803 with a $48 tweeter... even better! (We shall see...)
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post #565 of 580 Unread 01-03-2016, 09:22 AM
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Supposedly the the 20k + hz plays a role in the sound stage, directionality, etc. Meaning you can close your eyes and tell where on the stage the trombones are sitting, what side tympony are placed, etc. Sorry I used classical music references, but that is my back ground.

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post #566 of 580 Unread 01-06-2016, 04:57 PM - Thread Starter
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It's in Chicago right now.
I hope they fly it to Seattle tonight, otherwise it is looking like Monday at the earliest...
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post #567 of 580 Unread 01-07-2016, 02:35 AM
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@BassThatHz
is that frequency response raw or how you are actually running it?
constant directivity waveguides (as many horns) require so-called 'compensation' to provide for a flat response on axis. that is not an artifact of the c.d., but rather of the horn that tries to keep a flat off-axis response as high in frequency as possible.

Listen. It's All Good.
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post #568 of 580 Unread 01-07-2016, 09:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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@BassThatHz
is that frequency response raw or how you are actually running it?
constant directivity waveguides (as many horns) require so-called 'compensation' to provide for a flat response on axis. that is not an artifact of the c.d., but rather of the horn that tries to keep a flat off-axis response as high in frequency as possible.
It is RAW.
I do boost it, but it still loses SQ details, and is still down many db up high.
Undoubtedly the BA-750 would be a better for the SEOS's but at $150x3 just to get a few more Hz... that I'd still have to boost, doesn't seem practical ATM.
The BA-750 is flat to below 1kHz which WOULD be handy from a SQ perspective.

I will eventual upgrade beyond the DNA's, but until then, these Fostex's will have to do.
If they do well I might keep them for a few years, or if they do really-well I might keep them forever.
If the FT17H's suck then I won't use them... they have to provide more benefit than the hassle of implementing them is, that is my threshold.

I'm using almost 100% processor power on my 3 DCX's to make all the subs + 3 mains flat. I hate how the DCX is processor limited in this regard.
I'd rather use tweeters that don't require EQ and free up some horsepower for more bass EQ.

Ideally I'd use no EQ at all, and a 64ch digital-XO box with a -120db (or better) noisefloor, that is flat to 1-3Hz and can process Dolby Atmos; but without a $10k price tag. LOL

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post #569 of 580 Unread 01-07-2016, 12:29 PM
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Hm, curious measurements, looks like the high frequency fingering (it is mandatory to laugh from that term) I get on my large horns in my 2-way setup. Unless I get a horn that specifically has a flat response in one specific direction then I'll have to live with it. For now I think its worth it to have equal experience in all four seats. Might add smaller high frequency horns later on though and just cross from the big ones at like 5-6khz.

Don't EQ fingering, trust that the bare compression drivers sound OK raw (well, up to the point where they lose efficiency, mine drop off 10db between 13khz and 20khz).
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post #570 of 580 Unread 01-08-2016, 11:00 AM - Thread Starter
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The tweeters are now on the west coast, they have to be trucked across the cascades today or monday.
Then loaded on a delivery van, so they should be here Monday evening at the earliest or Tuesday at the latest.
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