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post #1 of 48 Old 05-10-2013, 10:32 AM - Thread Starter
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I just sold my definitive technology bp7004s, and I'm ready to do another speaker build. The goal is to make a 2.1 system that I'm primarily going to use for music. I would like to keep parts under $500, not including materials to build the cabinets. I already have a subwoofer that I'm going to use in the system. I've been looking at the speaker kits from parts express made by Dayton, but I'm not sold on them yet. Any suggestions?

That's how it starts; in a completely different direction.
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post #2 of 48 Old 05-10-2013, 10:42 AM
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Have you looked at the kits at meniscus?

http://meniscusaudio.com/kits-c-133.html?page=1&sort=3a

Also the kits at diysoundgroup.com. If you wanna go louder, since you're using a sub.

Also consider some of the designs floating around that aren't kitted, but you'll need to be more specific about your requirements if you want recommendations on those. Size, SPL, etc.?
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post #3 of 48 Old 05-10-2013, 10:52 AM - Thread Starter
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I was looking to keep the footprint down. Hopefully in the 8x12 region. Height is not a issue, somewhere under 48 would be nice. I'm not opposed to bookshelf size either.
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post #4 of 48 Old 05-10-2013, 11:14 AM
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Well I'd take a close look at the meniscus kits then if nothing at PE interests you. Most of them are small form factor. Why aren't you sold on any of the PE kits? Style?
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post #5 of 48 Old 05-10-2013, 11:35 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm considering the ua711 or the ua721. The 721 will put me over budget a bit, but if they're that much better than the $120 extra spent there would be well worth it. I just haven't seen many reviews on these. Also in comparison to the tritrix that are considerably less. How would these stack up against my old def techs?
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post #6 of 48 Old 05-10-2013, 11:39 AM
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I built the Mandolin kit by Jeff Bagby. There is also an MTM version that would cost right around $500 to build, that would be worth a listen. 6" paper cone, 1 1/8" dimple dome/ring radiator tweeter. I really like the sound. Meniscus is good people.
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post #7 of 48 Old 05-10-2013, 11:40 AM
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No idea how to answer those questions, hopefully someone else. Or the PE forum guys might know better.
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post #8 of 48 Old 05-10-2013, 06:04 PM
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post #9 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 01:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Thinking of a MTMW tower now. The components I'm looking at are dayton 4" rs100-4 (4), dayton dc25t-8 (2) and the dayton 8" rs225-8 (2). This would be crossed in at 800 and 5k. I would put the 8" in a ported box. Any suggestions on this. Also I like the za5.5 too.
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post #10 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madskaman View Post

Thinking of a MTMW tower now. The components I'm looking at are dayton 4" rs100-4 (4), dayton dc25t-8 (2) and the dayton 8" rs225-8 (2). This would be crossed in at 800 and 5k. I would put the 8" in a ported box. Any suggestions on this. Also I like the za5.5 too.

Not a good idea. In an MTM layout, the crossover point to the tweeter can be no higher than one wavelength of the mid's center to center (CTC) spacing. At 5kHz, then the CTC spacing of the mids can be no than 5.4". Even at 1 wavelength, you get lobing, which is what the D'Appolito style takes into account.

Now, the crossover point between the woofer and mid(s) follow the same rule, no more than 1 wavelength, so you normally want to keep them as close as possible, but then the woofer also encounters floor bounce with half the frequency (I think it's one half) associated with the wavelength associated with the woofer to floor distance. So now you want to keep the woofer close to the floor, which makes it hard to cross high to a mid.

Now, why only one woofer if you have two mids?

YID DIY
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post #11 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 03:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Then I'll play it safe with the rs150 mtm. Thank you.
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post #12 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 04:06 PM - Thread Starter
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I had the crossovers from my first build and thought I could reuse them. I'll cross the mtm over at 2k and port it. Should I get the dayton 2 way crossovers or build my own? I've never made them before, but feel comfortable do it.
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post #13 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 05:12 PM
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Assembling a crossover is pretty easy; place the components, solder them up, done. Designing a crossover takes a lot of work.

For example, building an engine is easy; organize parts, start putting things in place, torque to spec, etc... Put it together in a 1bay garage over a few weekends.
Designing an engine however, requires a team of engineers and thousands of hours of simulation and testing.

Off the shelf crossovers (generic crossovers), are just that, generic. Sure it's a starting point for speaker building, as in, it will make sound and protect the drivers, but it's a long ways away from creating a good sounding speaker. I'd hate for a person to spend $3-400 in raw drivers and another $50-60 in generic crossovers, to make noise when they could go off a proven design, or a kit, and spend an extra $30--40 in crossover components and have good sound. If the difference between mediocre and good was a mere 10% increase in price, it would be well worth it in my book!

Check into some DIY kits/designs that folks have spent time simulating, prototyping, testing, tweaking, repeating, etc... They're providing their time and knowledge free of charge basically.

YID DIY
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post #14 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 06:41 PM
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http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?202675-RS125-RS28-MTMWW-2-5-way-*PIC*

Here's a design by Pete Schumacker with RS125's instead of 150's that might work for you. It's on my short list to build.
David
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post #15 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 06:45 PM - Thread Starter
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well now i'm back to square one, but with a little more knowledge. I've been reading up more on the zaph 5.5 kit and it sounds like it would be a great speaker. I think this my be the way to go for me. sorry for my indecisiveness.
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post #16 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 06:50 PM - Thread Starter
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i like the rs125 one as well. something more for me to think about for a while. thank you.
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post #17 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 09:13 PM
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Its ever so slightly over your budget but these are amazing speakers and Danny is a super stand up guy: http://gr-research.com/n3.aspx

One of my friends down in Portland has a set and the matching N3S center (just a sealed version of the standard transmission line design of the N3). These are on my short list to build. Top quality crossover components and proven design by one of the best in the business. Over on Audiocircle in the GR Research area you'll find TONS of builds of this kit.

Scott
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post #18 of 48 Old 05-11-2013, 09:20 PM
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Here's a thread I started with pictures of other people's builds: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=92302.0

Scott
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post #19 of 48 Old 05-12-2013, 04:44 AM
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OP- is that $500 dollar budget per speaker? If so, you might look into building the Statements or Mini-Statements as those would represent a tremdious value for performance versus cost, plus they sound terrific as well!
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post #20 of 48 Old 05-23-2013, 09:39 PM - Thread Starter
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I've been thinking about and researching this for a while and I'm going to double my budget and go with a proven design. That being said I'm debating between the dayton rs-3ways and the statements. My biggest concern is the positioning of the speakers. I'm not going to be able to keep them much more than 6 inches or so away from the wall. Because I'm leaning towards the statements, I'd like to know if this going to be a game changer for me? And if there is anything else in the $1000ish category worth taking a look/listen at.
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post #21 of 48 Old 05-23-2013, 11:04 PM
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I'd bet that this Jeff Bagby designed SEOS waveguide speaker would sound excellent and the price is right. $315/ea. Read the reviews.
http://www.diysoundgroup.com/waveguide-speaker-kits/fusion-series-kits/fusion12-kit.html
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1291022/hey-guys-we-need-a-little-rallying-here
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post #22 of 48 Old 06-10-2013, 08:47 AM - Thread Starter
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I broke down and decided to do it...
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post #23 of 48 Old 06-10-2013, 08:58 AM
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Looks like statements. I was just looking at them at meniscus. Ported version or did you get the sealed plans?
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post #24 of 48 Old 06-10-2013, 09:13 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm doing the ported ones. Im still trying to decide on the base design and the port location. I'd like to go out the back with it, and put the crossovers in the base. Any suggestions?
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post #25 of 48 Old 06-11-2013, 04:06 AM
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If you only have around 6" inches to position them from the front wall, then I would highly recommend that you go sealed. Only go ported if you have the room to properly place the Statements as the performance will be highly dependent on the positioning of the ported versions versus the sealed versions, which are a lot more forgiving of placement. If you are set on going ported then I would highly recommend putting the port on the front. That way you can at least have them closer to the front walls.
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post #26 of 48 Old 06-11-2013, 05:56 AM
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The statements are designed to have more space behind. The Finalists do better close wall, as close as 6"
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post #27 of 48 Old 06-11-2013, 09:00 AM - Thread Starter
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I already have the cabinets pretty much done for the ported design. I guess I could move them out another 6 inches to 12 inches away from the wall. Would that make enough of a difference?
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post #28 of 48 Old 06-12-2013, 07:37 AM
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It would help, but honestly those big Statements need plenty of breathing room. So what is the maximum distance you can do from the front and side walls? I would shoot for no less than 12" inche from the front wall, and no less than 18" inches from the sidewalls. Idealy you would need somewhere in the neighborhood of 2 feet from the front wall and around that, maybe less, from the side walls. Either way, I am sure you will be pleased. If it were me, and I had space restrictions, I would have built the sealed versions of the Statements. With that being said, you already have all of the drivers, so if you do not like the sound after completion then you could always build a pair of sealed cabinets in your spare time. I am looking forward to hearing your subjective listening impression on these bad boys! What were your previous speakers? Hopefully you have heard lots of speakers that you can compare these Statements too!
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post #29 of 48 Old 06-15-2013, 11:31 PM - Thread Starter
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I've got quite a bit done over the last week. I'm pretty happy with the construction so far. I'm getting excited to light these up.







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post #30 of 48 Old 06-18-2013, 07:43 AM
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Any updates? I am looking forward to you posting your innitial impressions of these bad boys!
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