Dual Othorn build - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 143 Old 05-31-2013, 11:50 AM - Thread Starter
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The B&C 21sw152-4 drivers arrived this week, and the BB plywood will be delivered on Monday!





UPDATE:



















































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post #2 of 143 Old 05-31-2013, 12:20 PM
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Looking forward to hearing these combined with the GH.
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post #3 of 143 Old 05-31-2013, 12:36 PM
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Nice! Subbed here for sure.

Luke - How did you go about finding a supply house that will deliver BB? If you don't mind me asking, what's the going rate for a 5x5 or 4x8 sheet of 13 ply there? I've received a few quotes so far, but they wanted an arm and a leg being I was such low volume I assume. frown.gif
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post #4 of 143 Old 05-31-2013, 01:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Nice! Subbed here for sure.

Luke - How did you go about finding a supply house that will deliver BB? If you don't mind me asking, what's the going rate for a 5x5 or 4x8 sheet of 13 ply there? I've received a few quotes so far, but they wanted an arm and a leg being I was such low volume I assume. frown.gif

It took a while to even find a supplier that had BB in something larger than 24"x30" pieces.

If you find BB in 4x8 sheets, it's cheaper stuff from China. BB imported from Russia is only made in 5x5 sheets according to all the suppliers around here. Not sure if that's true or not.

5x5 sheet of 13-ply 3/4": $72
5x5 sheet of 9-ply 1/2": 45

Shipping for any size order within 50 miles, only $22!!
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post #5 of 143 Old 06-01-2013, 06:14 AM
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How high are you going to run the Othorns?
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post #6 of 143 Old 06-01-2013, 06:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeamdman View Post

It took a while to even find a supplier that had BB in something larger than 24"x30" pieces.

If you find BB in 4x8 sheets, it's cheaper stuff from China. BB imported from Russia is only made in 5x5 sheets according to all the suppliers around here. Not sure if that's true or not.

5x5 sheet of 13-ply 3/4": $72
5x5 sheet of 9-ply 1/2": 45

Shipping for any size order within 50 miles, only $22!!

i have used the cheaper stuff and the quality stuff both in 4x8 sheets.

my local Lowes orderd the good 13 ply stuff in 4x8 for me for under $70 a sheet.

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post #7 of 143 Old 06-01-2013, 08:28 AM - Thread Starter
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How high are you going to run the Othorns?

80-100hz.
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post #8 of 143 Old 06-15-2013, 02:28 PM - Thread Starter
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These things are so small it's like I'm working on little toy subwoofers.
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post #9 of 143 Old 06-15-2013, 03:28 PM
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Small...? That's funny because I was just thinking that seem not so big yesterday. These should be cake after building g horns.

I was testing this cab with the TC 5100 driver last night. I think you will enjoy them.
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post #10 of 143 Old 06-15-2013, 03:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Small...? That's funny because I was just thinking that seem not so big yesterday. These should be cake after building g horns.

I was testing this cab with the TC 5100 driver last night. I think you will enjoy them.

Well, small compared to the Ghorns. Those things still shock me with their size when I walk into the room.

How'd the 5100 fair to the 21sw152?
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post #11 of 143 Old 06-16-2013, 08:58 AM
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Well I am not entirely sure yet...The 21 is slightly more sensitive as expected. The respone shape on the 5100 looks good though and it seemed to reach about the same levels long term. I believe it might have a bit more burst output capability due to much greater excursion ability, but not much. The 21 still has more thermal power handling though...either is good. Unfortunately I didn't get the distortion tests done on it.
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post #12 of 143 Old 06-16-2013, 05:55 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm not quite sure the 5100 would be able to handle the clone amp delivering 4,000+ watts per driver like the B&C's will. I'll be putting a beating on these things.
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post #13 of 143 Old 06-17-2013, 10:02 AM
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How are these bad boys coming? I'm definitely interesting in building either two of these or G-horns at some point. I've found a local source for good, reasonably priced BB so I can begin to get more serious. I'm almost thinking it would be wise to keep some of my sealed 18s for the real low stuff and add in 2 of the O's to kill the mid-upper range.

How does one get a hold of the detailed plans?
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post #14 of 143 Old 06-17-2013, 10:36 AM
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Luke can forward you his plans...
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post #15 of 143 Old 06-17-2013, 10:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

How are these bad boys coming? I'm definitely interesting in building either two of these or G-horns at some point. I've found a local source for good, reasonably priced BB so I can begin to get more serious. I'm almost thinking it would be wise to keep some of my sealed 18s for the real low stuff and add in 2 of the O's to kill the mid-upper range.

How does one get a hold of the detailed plans?

I'm enjoying the Ghorns so much I'm not in a big rush to complete these, but these are only a 1-2 week project once I really get going.

Send me a PM with your email and I'll send over the plans.
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post #16 of 143 Old 06-17-2013, 11:09 AM
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PM sent, thanks Luke and Ricci!

Luke - Are you simply using a circ saw/guide/rail to make the cuts? I assume these are held together with PL premium and pocket screws as well?

This combo is going to be realistically unbeatable in the entire low end range.
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post #17 of 143 Old 06-17-2013, 12:34 PM
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We will certainly find out at my GTG in august.
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post #18 of 143 Old 06-17-2013, 01:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Just for fun I thew this together based on Josh's measurements. Now, obviously room gain will throw these numbers around quite a bit, just realize this was only for fun:



The first is comparing the GH/OTH combo in comparison to my old quad sealed setup. The second is too see how far off it is from Notnyt's system.

Again, I know how many variables will change all this, but I was bored and thought it would be fun. The fun part for me is that compared to my old system, it's still a total of 4 drivers compared to 4 drivers, and 16kw of power compared to the same 16kw of power.
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post #19 of 143 Old 06-17-2013, 06:18 PM
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Looking forward to seeing these built. Are they going to be front stage, or to be determined after measurements?
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post #20 of 143 Old 06-17-2013, 06:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeamdman View Post

Just for fun I thew this together based on Josh's measurements. Now, obviously room gain will throw these numbers around quite a bit, just realize this was only for fun:



The first is comparing the GH/OTH combo in comparison to my old quad sealed setup. The second is too see how far off it is from Notnyt's system.

Again, I know how many variables will change all this, but I was bored and thought it would be fun. The fun part for me is that compared to my old system, it's still a total of 4 drivers compared to 4 drivers, and 16kw of power compared to the same 16kw of power.


How about adding 4 Othorn's to the chart, I'd like to see that.
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post #21 of 143 Old 06-17-2013, 08:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Looking forward to seeing these built. Are they going to be front stage, or to be determined after measurements?

The current plan is to have the Othorns up front since they'll be overlapping with the mains within the range of frequencies that are directional. I'm going to move the Ghorns to the back of the room since there's plenty of space.
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How about adding 4 Othorn's to the chart, I'd like to see that.

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post #22 of 143 Old 06-18-2013, 06:35 AM
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Don't forget that you need 2 to 4x the power for the maximum output from the sealed subs in the chart...That is a LOT of power and more amps.
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post #23 of 143 Old 06-18-2013, 04:55 PM
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Thanks Luke!


Ricci do you think the Othorn can perform like the new Danley BC412 sub with 40-60hz burst tone, as far as moving air? Will it blow out a candle at 2 feet. He(Mike Hedden) said they did this at low volume. He said that it can do farther distances with more power. Just curious what the Othorn would be able to do with a 40-60hz burst tone at full power, as far as how far it will blow out a lit candle. Please don't tell me to build one and try. Maybe I will eventually.
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post #24 of 143 Old 06-18-2013, 06:11 PM
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the bc is four horns arranged so as to benefit from boundary loading when the cabinet is placed in 2pi space.

essentially, it acts as its own "wall" to direct the sound forward. this is why sensitivity is so high
in the 80-100hz ballpark.

it isn't for home theater, as it rolls off relatively early around 35hz or so.

blowing out candles is kind of like hair tricks in car subs. kind of interesting, but doesn't
really tell you much about the performance.

Listen. It's All Good.
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post #25 of 143 Old 06-18-2013, 06:29 PM
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the bc is four horns arranged so as to benefit from boundary loading when the cabinet is placed in 2pi space.

essentially, it acts as its own "wall" to direct the sound forward. this is why sensitivity is so high
in the 80-100hz ballpark.

it isn't for home theater, as it rolls off relatively early around 35hz or so.






Thanks for your input LTDO2. Not much for sound quality then, but it will kick your ass! I'll stick with 4 Othorn's then. The best of both worlds.
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post #26 of 143 Old 06-18-2013, 07:14 PM
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the closest danley product to the othorns is probably half a cinemonster.

http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/products/subwoofers/tapped-horns/th-221/

i don't recall seeing anybody crank out a diy version of it.

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post #27 of 143 Old 06-18-2013, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

the closest danley product to the othorns is probably half a cinemonster.

http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/products/subwoofers/tapped-horns/th-221/

i don't recall seeing anybody crank out a diy version of it.


Me either, but I have seen some try,but to no fuition. Your one of the most knowledgeable persons on this forum, if you cared, could you try, if you have the time? I'm sure it would be worth your effort because we(AVS Community) all care for a project like this,
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post #28 of 143 Old 06-18-2013, 08:07 PM
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A bc412 is probably much louder than my cab...Its bigger it has 4 12's and it has a much higher corner frequency. Anytime you push the cabs extension lower you will lose potential sensitivity and output you could have at higher frequencies with a higher frequency cabinet loading. With horns a bigger cab can give more sensitivity/ more extension / smoother response or a combination of the above. The Othorn excursion minimum is near 27-28Hz...A lot lower. It is probably closer in function to a TH118 than anything else in the Danley line up but even still the effective loading appears lower and there are a lot of other differences.
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post #29 of 143 Old 06-18-2013, 09:07 PM
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A bc412 is probably much louder than my cab...Its bigger it has 4 12's and it has a much higher corner frequency. Anytime you push the cabs extension lower you will lose potential sensitivity and output you could have at higher frequencies with a higher frequency cabinet loading. With horns a bigger cab can give more sensitivity/ more extension / smoother response or a combination of the above. The Othorn excursion minimum is near 27-28Hz...A lot lower. It is probably closer in function to a TH118 than anything else in the Danley line up but even still the effective loading appears lower and there are a lot of other differences.

Cool, I'm OK with the higher tune because of the added benefits. This is Danleys newest HO enclosure, his small enclosure. He has a bigger BC412 version. Can't wait to see it's potential. So we should not look to compare these horns because of the discrepancy. OK lets build a new one that is capable of blowing out a candle at 4 feet @ half power lol.
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post #30 of 143 Old 06-18-2013, 09:20 PM
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Wow. Looks awesome!! I am just wondering how they will sound biggrin.gif

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