one dayton ho 18 or two dayton hf 15s ? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 03:36 AM - Thread Starter
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so shipping for the Dayton 18 for where I live is $104 for a total of $354 for one.
on ebay I can get free shipping on Dayton rss390hf-4 at $172 can have two for a total of $344
I already bought the amp a epx2800
which way should I go?
my goal is for max dbs@20hz
have room for large boxes up to 15 cubic feet each or so
they will be positioned directly behind main lp in a sealed 3,000 cubic foot room
already have six jbl es250pbk 12 inch subs will all be in the front side by side these drop off bad at 30hz-25hz
above 30hz is almost enough but a little more would give me that over the top ok good enough feeling
I am leaning towards the two 15s as the best use of my amp
need most bang for buck as wife is just about at her limit of cost involved and will be stuck with this for many years.
what style box and size?
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post #2 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 04:53 AM - Thread Starter
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ok been reading for hours ho more power good for smaller boxes
hf less power bigger box required this is ok with me so wich is better for sub sonic bass?
one 18 inch rss460ho-4 or two 15 inch rss390hf-4?
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post #3 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 05:40 AM - Thread Starter
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I am thinking the biggest bang for the buck would be the two 15s.
just about to pull the trigger what is the best box design for max dbs 15hz-25hz range? not too worried about above 30hz response.
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post #4 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 06:56 AM
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I would go with two of the 15's over a single 18. That will help even out the frequency responce. If it were me, I would sell those crappy JBL subs and take tte money you get off them and buy 2 or 4 Dayton HO18's.
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post #5 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 11:50 AM
 
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two 15s
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post #6 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 12:29 PM
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Two 15"s shipped free to HI is a great deal, and they will outperform the 18. I was going to suggest you went with stacks of Infinity 1260Ws from Amazon, eight of them comes out to under $500 shipped

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0028AVGEO/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

You could build a pair boxes with 4ea subs per box, wired for 4 ohms. 8 12"s will equal 3.5 18"s, or 5 15"s
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post #7 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 12:43 PM
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Here is all sealed to compare

 

Yellow - Dual 15HF in 8 cu ft, 500w

Light Blue - Dual 15HO 3.5 cu ft, 1000w

Blue - ONE 18HO 1000w

 

 

 

 

Here is a Dayton 18 HO in a 12cu ft ported enclosure tuned to 16hz, 1000w. Highpass at 16hz.

 

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post #8 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 01:41 PM - Thread Starter
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18 vented 12 cubic looks the best but how does a 15 hf look like in a large vented box and with two side by side I would add another 5 dbls or so
I am thinking the specs on the 15 hf look a little better than the 18 ho for loud at 20hz if I ran two large vented boxes of the 15 hf am I right or wrong?
just about to pull the trigger on the 15 ho
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post #9 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 01:51 PM
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Dual 15HF requires a large enclosure for ported (20cu ft would be best).

 

Both the same enclosure but the Dual 15HF is using 600w and the single 18HO at 1000w.

 

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post #10 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 02:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrkazador View Post

Dual 15HF requires a large enclosure for ported (20cu ft would be best).

Both the same enclosure but the Dual 15HF is using 600w and the single 18HO at 1000w.


so it would seem two 15 hf would be slightly better than one 18 ho but would take up allot more space and wood so one 18 would be smarter in the long run?
well I am going to set on this for a while and not buy anything for now maybe read up on folded horns
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post #11 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 02:20 PM
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You will get the two 15's. They won't be enough. wink.gif Then you'll upgrade to two 18's. tongue.gif
So might as well go with the single 18 now. haha biggrin.gif
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post #12 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 02:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by BassThatHz View Post

You will get the two 15's. They won't be enough. wink.gif Then you'll upgrade to two 18's. tongue.gif
So might as well go with the single 18 now. haha biggrin.gif
went that road with the six 12s you made my mind up 18 it is then but since no good deals for me I can wait for xmass and make the wife happy
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post #13 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 08:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Two 15"s shipped free to HI is a great deal, and they will outperform the 18. I was going to suggest you went with stacks of Infinity 1260Ws from Amazon, eight of them comes out to under $500 shipped

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0028AVGEO/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

You could build a pair boxes with 4ea subs per box, wired for 4 ohms. 8 12"s will equal 3.5 18"s, or 5 15"s
that's kinda what I got now with the 6 jbl 12s. I wanted to put a 18 behind my love seat recliner for the sub sonic hz mostly
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post #14 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 08:18 PM
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Which JBL's do you have, and what is the box/amp setup?

There's nothing magical about having an 18", it's all about Sd + Xmax
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post #15 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 08:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Which JBL's do you have, and what is the box/amp setup?

There's nothing magical about having an 18", it's all about Sd + Xmax
jbl es250pbk I replaced one speaker with a jbl gto1214 maybe slightly better than the others.
I thought the specs on the Dayton rss390hf looked better than the rss460ho 18 inch as far as building something to go sub sonic I can get two of the 15 hf s for a little less then one 1 18 ho
I only know a little about how to read specs
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post #16 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 08:53 PM
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So you have six ES250's? That is definitely not the same thing as having a DIY setup with six 12" subs. Those are undersized ported boxes tuned to around 30hz

The dual HF 15's will work better then a single HO 18".
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post #17 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 09:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

So you have six ES250's? That is definitely not the same thing as having a DIY setup with six 12" subs. Those are undersized ported boxes tuned to around 30hz

The dual HF 15's will work better then a single HO 18".
thanks jay for the help I am going to trust my gut and you and order the two 15 now next I will have to study what others have built with these speakers and copy from someone. seems like the box will be the size of a refrigerator to get from it what I want( mrkazador says and what I have read) but that's ok. I will continue to also run the jbls as they are kinda ok and the two 15 will not be enough on their own I think. I will use on ht and bass heavy music from dubsteb, black eyed peas, bass nectar, to Floyd etc
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post #18 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 10:07 PM
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Do you have some kind of high pass filter, like a miniDSP or something? Ported will get you the most bang for your buck, but you dont want to run anything with content below the tuning point.

8 ft3 tuned to 18hz using a pair of 4" x 23" ports, with a 18 hz high pass filter engaged looks like the best set of compromises to me, assuming that amp puts out 600 watts per channel at 4 ohm. If it's closer to 450 watts, things look even better (with only 1.3 db less then 600 watts).
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post #19 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 10:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Do you have some kind of high pass filter, like a miniDSP or something? Ported will get you the most bang for your buck, but you dont want to run anything with content below the tuning point.

8 ft3 tuned to 18hz using a pair of 4" x 23" ports, with a 18 hz high pass filter engaged looks like the best set of compromises to me, assuming that amp puts out 600 watts per channel at 4 ohm. If it's closer to 450 watts, things look even better (with only 1.3 db less then 600 watts).
no I don't have a high pass filter thanks for the warning I will have to read up on that. the 8 ft3 box I would assume that is for one 15 so two boxes needed?thats fine with me if that is the case
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post #20 of 65 Old 07-28-2013, 10:26 PM
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Yes, each 15 in their own 8 ft3 box
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post #21 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 02:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Do you have some kind of high pass filter, like a miniDSP or something? Ported will get you the most bang for your buck, but you dont want to run anything with content below the tuning point.

8 ft3 tuned to 18hz using a pair of 4" x 23" ports, with a 18 hz high pass filter engaged looks like the best set of compromises to me, assuming that amp puts out 600 watts per channel at 4 ohm. If it's closer to 450 watts, things look even better (with only 1.3 db less then 600 watts).
so will I exceed xmass going below 18hz? I was looking at minidsp the 2x4 for $105 is that what I need? 8 ft3 should I build to 9 ft3 or something to allow for bracing,port tubes,speaker space,foam etc?
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post #22 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 03:44 AM
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What amp have you decided on? Some plate amps have built in high pass filters, and there are always amps with built in dsp such as the Behringer iNuke3000dsp or the Crown XTI. If it were me, and if I had the money, I would go with a Behringer iNuke3000dsp instead of an EP4000 with a MiniDsp.
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post #23 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 05:56 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

What amp have you decided on? Some plate amps have built in high pass filters, and there are always amps with built in dsp such as the Behringer iNuke3000dsp or the Crown XTI. If it were me, and if I had the money, I would go with a Behringer iNuke3000dsp instead of an EP4000 with a MiniDsp.

I like miniDSP and ep4000 better. Ep4000 looks better, has a lower rolloff point, and has more power. Also the miniDSP is more customizeable than the dsp on the iNuke, and you can add eq to 3 more amps down the road with the miniDSP.

Should go with the 2x4 Balanced though. It's like 20 bucks more but it's worth it for the extra output voltage.
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post #24 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 07:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas 1966 View Post

so will I exceed xmass going below 18hz? I was looking at minidsp the 2x4 for $105 is that what I need? 8 ft3 should I build to 9 ft3 or something to allow for bracing,port tubes,speaker space,foam etc?

Yes, you will have the potential to bottom out any ported sub with content below the tuning point. If you've been playing with winISD, a simple look at the cone excursion tab will show you. Here is with and without a 18hz HPF with 450 watts applied



As far as the box, you can plan it out exactly here

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/enclosure-volume-calculator/

A 22" x 30" x 28" box from 3/4" material with a pair of 4" x 23" ports gets you a little over 8.5 ft3, so that's a good starting place. The miniDSP is a very good choice, it will also let you EQ the in room response.

Guys, he already has the epx2800 wink.gif
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post #25 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 10:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

What amp have you decided on? Some plate amps have built in high pass filters, and there are always amps with built in dsp such as the Behringer iNuke3000dsp or the Crown XTI. If it were me, and if I had the money, I would go with a Behringer iNuke3000dsp instead of an EP4000 with a MiniDsp.
I have a epx2800 new in the box I bought it because I was able to get it for $220 new on amazon. I think someone had told me it has a real rms of about 500 x 2 at 4ohms so should be a good match for these speakers I think.
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post #26 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 11:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by JWagstaff View Post

I like miniDSP and ep4000 better. Ep4000 looks better, has a lower rolloff point, and has more power. Also the miniDSP is more customizeable than the dsp on the iNuke, and you can add eq to 3 more amps down the road with the miniDSP.

Should go with the 2x4 Balanced though. It's like 20 bucks more but it's worth it for the extra output voltage.
thanks I was confused about the minidsp all the choices so balanced 2x4 it is but will have to wait a while as I keep buying stuff for this build little bit at a time so the wife will not freak out
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post #27 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 11:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Yes, you will have the potential to bottom out any ported sub with content below the tuning point. If you've been playing with winISD, a simple look at the cone excursion tab will show you. Here is with and without a 18hz HPF with 450 watts applied



As far as the box, you can plan it out exactly here

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/enclosure-volume-calculator/

A 22" x 30" x 28" box from 3/4" material with a pair of 4" x 23" ports gets you a little over 8.5 ft3, so that's a good starting place. The miniDSP is a very good choice, it will also let you EQ the in room response.

Guys, he already has the epx2800 wink.gif
thanks again jay most helpful I see how the hpf is used as a eq I was a little freaked out before as I thought I would be sending no signal below 18hz to the sub but am I understanding this right I will still get some response below 18hz the minidsp will just lower trim back the signal to prevent the sub from just flapping wastefully out of control? never checked out winisd yet that seems like the next step for me that is needed.
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post #28 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Two 15"s shipped free to HI is a great deal, and they will outperform the 18. I was going to suggest you went with stacks of Infinity 1260Ws from Amazon, eight of them comes out to under $500 shipped

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0028AVGEO/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

You could build a pair boxes with 4ea subs per box, wired for 4 ohms. 8 12"s will equal 3.5 18"s, or 5 15"s

Funny, on a PM someone suggested to me the option of running 4 of those as well... It would be cheaper than 2 dayton 15"s and if I understood it, the 4 Inifity 12's would outperform the dayton 15's by a good margin for both music and HT on a budget.

I'm running two Kappa 100.9 - 10" in my truck and it is very solid. It doesn't rattle the neighborhood but it is solid.

Still a stereo Noob, Denon 2113 w/ Arx5 & A1b surrounds.
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post #29 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 12:10 PM
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Funny, on a PM someone suggested to me the option of running 4 of those as well... It would be cheaper than 2 dayton 15"s and if I understood it, the 4 Inifity 12's would outperform the dayton 15's by a good margin for both music and HT on a budget.

I'm running two Kappa 100.9 - 10" in my truck and it is very solid. It doesn't rattle the neighborhood but it is solid.

If you're running sealed boxes you'll need a lot of eq to keep up with the Dayton 15s down low, they just go deeper. As far as max output capability, yes four 12"s equal about 2.5 15"s
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post #30 of 65 Old 07-29-2013, 12:20 PM
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If you're running sealed boxes you'll need a lot of eq to keep up with the Dayton 15s down low, they just go deeper. As far as max output capability, yes four 12"s equal about 2.5 15"s

I was thinking letting the Denon do it's EQ thing then fine tune the Inuke amp. I'm not wanting pure sound loudness but a solid sound that plays Pantera as good as it does Jurasic park. And I do want sealed boxes due to the smaller size.

For size constraints vs quality of sound which way would you go? The 2 Daytons or 4 infnity's? Overall max volume isn't my goal and it wouldn't make the wife happy if it compromised quality.

You had suggested the 2 15' Daytons previously but the 4-12 infinty's was something mentioned elsewhere as an option.

Still a stereo Noob, Denon 2113 w/ Arx5 & A1b surrounds.
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