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post #1 of 28 Old 09-02-2013, 10:09 AM - Thread Starter
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So i built some subs recently. 2 MFW15 drivers and 2 flat packs from DIY sound group. I don't thin i'm getting everything i should out of them and would like to measure them.
What else do i need to do this.
Here is what i have already
Behringer uca202
Behringer ecm8000
Inuke 1000dsp
Laptop with WIN7
Pioneer vsx-1121
I'm just not sure what i need for cables. Any help is greatly appreciated.

JJ
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post #2 of 28 Old 09-02-2013, 10:21 AM
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the rew help files show several different options

http://www.hometheatershack.com/roomeq/

might be a good place to start.

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post #3 of 28 Old 09-02-2013, 10:22 AM
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btw, that mic needs phantom power. the uca202 doesn't provide phantom power irrc, so you would need an external sound card with phantom power or a preamp w/phantom power or an spl meter/mic that is battery powered or a usb mic.

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post #4 of 28 Old 09-02-2013, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

btw, that mic needs phantom power. the uca202 doesn't provide phantom power irrc, so you would need an external sound card with phantom power or a preamp w/phantom power or an spl meter/mic that is battery powered or a usb mic.

The solution is to use a standard stand alone mic preamp,

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MIC800/

or bypass the UCA 202 entirely and use a mic preamp with a USB interface built in:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/USBDualPrePS/
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post #5 of 28 Old 09-02-2013, 01:46 PM
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post #6 of 28 Old 09-02-2013, 03:14 PM
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I think I have seen Bill F recommend the Blue Icicle from the link you posted. Not 100% but pretty confident. I am planning on buying one soon for my mic to replace a TASCOM unit.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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post #7 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 04:33 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjgear View Post

So i built some subs recently. 2 MFW15 drivers and 2 flat packs from DIY sound group. I don't thin i'm getting everything i should out of them and would like to measure them.
What else do i need to do this.
Here is what i have already
Behringer uca202
Behringer ecm8000
Inuke 1000dsp
Laptop with WIN7
Pioneer vsx-1121
I'm just not sure what i need for cables. Any help is greatly appreciated.

JJ

Did you build these cabinets sealed or ported? I would imagine that a sealed MFW-15 would need some boost in the lower end in order to get any decent extension. That Behringer iNuke1000dsp should be able to meet those needs. For measuring with REW you will need: 1) a calibrated mic, (not sure if your ecm8000 is calibrated, but if not you can send it to Cross Spectrum Labs to have that done),

2) you will need an external sound card, depending on weather or not your current sound card has a line in and line out.

3) you will need a way to power the mic, so a mic pre-amp will be required. I prefer the Behringer xenyz 502.
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post #8 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 07:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Its sealed. I'm not sure if the mic is calibrated either. Would i be better just to get an spl meter?
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post #9 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 08:11 AM
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The ECM8000 is calibrated at the factory so it should be better than a SPL meter but still not perfect as shown in the image below. I think you can have your mic calibrated by cross-spectrum for a fee, I can't find any info on his site. http://cross-spectrum.com/

 

 

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post #10 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 05:30 PM
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I tried the blue icicle, but I think I got a dud. None of my pc's would recognize it for more than a few seconds. So I ordered one of these. It does generate a little noise if you crank the gain on it, but kept within reason it seems to perform pretty well.

I was going to try the micmatec, but the behringer had better overall reviews that I could find.

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post #11 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 08:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Alright we'll start with this first. I uploaded 4 photos into my gallery of my inuke setup. Can you guys take a peek at them and let me know if you see something wrong? My old Hsu 12" subs seem to have more slam than these.
Any help is greatly appreciated.

JJ
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post #12 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjgear View Post

Alright we'll start with this first. I uploaded 4 photos into my gallery of my inuke setup. Can you guys take a peek at them and let me know if you see something wrong? My old Hsu 12" subs seem to have more slam than these.
Any help is greatly appreciated.

JJ

 

Am I looking at this correctly... There is more than a 15db boost from 20hz up to 50hz.

 

 

 

 

and why is there a highpass?

 

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post #13 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 08:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Just added the gain in the first picture you posted and actually felt like they were producing something. What should i do to correct it?
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post #14 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 09:56 PM
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Are you saying the audio level is low? This is a problem on some receivers that don't put out enough voltage for pro amps.

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post #15 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 10:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes. I have 2 Hsu HRS12v subs and i couldn't even tell i had turned the MFW15's on. I know there is something wrong in my settings for the inuke but my problem is i lack the knowledge to tell where it is.
'
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post #16 of 28 Old 09-03-2013, 10:23 PM
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Pro amps like the iNUKE are meant to be used with pro equipment that output at a higher voltage than consumer gear. Your HSU subs are made to work with consumer gear that uses a lower voltage. If your receiver can't output a high enough voltage for the iNUKE then you need a "bump box" to raise the voltage.

 

Reset your INUKE EQ settings so everything perfectly flat. Have you tried raising the sub trim on the receiver and the gain on the INUKE?

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post #17 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 06:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjgear View Post

Yes. I have 2 Hsu HRS12v subs and i couldn't even tell i had turned the MFW15's on. I know there is something wrong in my settings for the inuke but my problem is i lack the knowledge to tell where it is.
'

Turn the input gain controls on the HRSW12v subs way down, and turn up the corresponding LFE output gain setting to get back the same bass to L&R speaker balance that you had. Turn the HRSW12 controls as low as you can and still get the good bass that you enjoyed.

This will have the effect of providing a far stronger signal to your new subwoofer amplifiers.
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post #18 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 08:57 AM
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I've spent the last couple of nights setting up my NU3000DSP. The first night I got the same thing you did. No real output from the amp. (FWIW, I have a Denon AVR and it supplies plenty of LFE signal once all the settings are in order.)

First off, are both of the physical dials on the front of your inuke turned all the way to the right?

Shut off any Audyssey processing, etc. and set all your speakers back to 0.0 dB on your AVR. If you are using the HSUs alongside the new sub, turn the gain on the back of the HSUs way down (or just shut them off for the time being until you get the new gear straightened out. ) Then reset speaker levels in your AVR via SPL meter.

After that, if it is still way low and you've maxed the sub setting on your AVR, look at bumping up the gain inside the DSP program. If you're still not getting it, then you may need a bump box like suggested above.

Also, have a look at the Inputs and Outputs meters on the right side of the inuke DSP program. If you don't see much of any register on the "inputs" then it is telling you that the amp is not receiving much of a signal. So it is likely an issue ahead of the amp (most likely the AVR settings or just the physical limitations of the AVR you have.) If the "inputs" signal looks good, but the "outputs" signal shows very low readings, then it is an issue with the settings you have setup on/in the inuke itself.

Finally, if both inputs and outputs show high levels, it may be a problem with your wiring to your new sub, or the sub itself.

-Suntan
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post #19 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 09:33 AM
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Agreed, in a whole lot of cases with newer AVR's bump boxes are in fact no longer needed, and more than likely it is just a settings issue. What AVR are you currently running?

(European models do not accept banana plugs.)

 

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post #20 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 09:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Pioneer vsx-1121. I see what looks like plenty of input on the inuke. Just don't know where everything should be set. I have the gain knobs set at 12oclock on both subs(mfw and Hsu). Just seems the HSU's have more slam.

JJ
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post #21 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 09:57 AM
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bump the gains on the inuke to max and see what you think. the HSU will have a lower input sensitivity more than likely being an HT sub as opposed to the higher input sensitvity of a pro amp like the inuke. You can't expect similar performance by just having the gains at the same level on each sub. Also, is the Hsu ported? This will in some cases make the sub appear to have more "slam" if they purposefully build in a peaky response to make the sub appear more powerful. I really don't think Hsu does such a thing, but ports in general are to gain additional output above what the actual driver is capable of on its own.

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post #22 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 10:08 AM
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Hey JJ. Glad to hear from you again and that you haven't given up hope! You may also want to reread your original thread for more info: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1463935/mfw15-box I agree with beast, increase the gain on each channel on the inuke. Wipe out your eq for now.

Yep, the HSU will have more spl in the 30-40Hz range...anything below that these sealed 15's will have more spl.

-Nate
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post #23 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 10:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Ya i reread the old thread thinking i missed something. My only concern is why Mrkazador was questioning the high pass.

JJ
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post #24 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 10:54 AM
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How big are your enclosures again? At 2.5 ft^3, you wouldn't have to use a high pass. At 3ft^3, I would, you get very close to overexcursion at 250w with one driver. (I doubled the enclosure size on these simulations for two drivers)

If these really aren't doing it for you, you could always build ported enclosures for these.



Edit: The spl at the upper right is targeted to the ported design...after room gain you'd be right at 120db at 20Hz. Or just doule your number of sealed enclosures/drivers and double the power.

-Nate
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post #25 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 11:15 AM - Thread Starter
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3cuft. I like the subs just looking to get the inuke setup the way it should be. I knew you had some of these so i was hoping to get your settings you like and use it as a starting point.

JJ
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post #26 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 11:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrkazador View Post

Am I looking at this correctly... There is more than a 15db boost from 20hz up to 50hz.




that is SIX filters turned on each with 6db for a total of 36db of gain! I meant ONE filter for 6db of gain total!

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post #27 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 11:34 AM - Thread Starter
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I took those off right away. Sorry very new to this. When you said 6db between 25 and 30hz i thought i had to add 1 to each frq. So should i add 6 filters with 1 db each at those frq?

JJ
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post #28 of 28 Old 09-04-2013, 11:46 AM
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I simply meant to use one filter and select a frequency between 25hz and 30hz as a starting point.

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