Large Ported Dayton HO18's - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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Old 11-08-2013, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD1225 View Post

LTD02, John it is sounding like a vertical Marty being requested above.

I would love to have one of these but I've got no way to lay one down. I would need to stand it off the floor with the woofer and port down firing. Any easy way to do this easily?

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Old 11-08-2013, 08:52 PM
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If that's all you're doing, sure. Just put feet on the firing end of it and stand it up like a sonotube sub. I would probably give the driver and port about four-six inches of clearance from the ground.
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Old 11-08-2013, 09:09 PM
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"Is there any way to make the Marty sub so that you could stand it vertically with the woofer and port firing towards the floor? I don't have that much floor space to put this thing."

probably the easiest would be to just aim it "up". or you could add some legs or something in order to aim it down. just make sure there is at least a few inches between the driver/port and the floor.

" How would the Martysub with the SI 18 or Dayton HO compare to say the Chase VS18.1? The CEA measurements on the CHT VS18.1 were pretty impressive on databass IMO"

if that is his ported cab, i think they would be similar in many ways. the marty has a lower tuning (how much lower depends on the port construction). both have 18" drivers with usable excursion out to about 20mm or so. as far as general design, they are both in the same spirit and so their performance would probably be quite close.

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Old 11-08-2013, 09:15 PM
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"I would love to have one of these but I've got no way to lay one down. I would need to stand it off the floor with the woofer and port down firing. Any easy way to do this easily?"

there is almost an easy way to do anything. :-)

a search on google images for: end table subwoofer

brings up several images including this one. see how by just adding some wood stock to the corners, it creates "legs" that lifts the entire sub off the floor. that would work fine.







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Old 11-08-2013, 09:20 PM
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Thanks for the quick replies. I will look into this. I am torn between nabbing a vs18.1 for 600+ ship or building a martysub with an si18.

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Old 11-08-2013, 09:29 PM
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also, the marty sub isn't the only game in town. one member had the idea to do something like the old conquest, but with ports in the middle. he called it project annihilation. i still think of it as the annihilator. :-)



or you could build a mini-bass canon: dual front firing drivers and top firing slot port. that would be an easy build and if you diy it, you can afford two drivers, which means twice the fun per cab. :-)


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Old 11-08-2013, 10:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

also, the marty sub isn't the only game in town. one member had the idea to do something like the old conquest, but with ports in the middle. he called it project annihilation. i still think of it as the annihilator. :-)



or you could build a mini-bass canon: dual front firing drivers and top firing slot port. that would be an easy build and if you diy it, you can afford two drivers, which means twice the fun per cab. :-)


O man that dual "conquest" looks awesome. Any links to that build?

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Old 11-08-2013, 10:39 PM
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That annihilator almost gives me sub envy biggrin.gif
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Old 11-08-2013, 10:40 PM
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we were discussing it in this thread: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1490514/want-to-start-diying-big-room-what-can-i-go-with/60

then he started a new thread here: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1494135/annihilation-sub-coming-soon

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Old 11-08-2013, 10:42 PM
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yeah, it definitely looks the part. the downside is that one 6" port per driver is really on the small side...so watch your air velocity if modeling that one. i'm not sure if those ports are just barely large enough or not.

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Old 11-08-2013, 11:20 PM
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Could you do a massive slot port in the middle instead of two round ports?
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Old 11-09-2013, 01:02 AM
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yeah, the problem with that is the port would then need to be longer and the round ports are already as close to the back of the cab as possible, so...it would need a bend. not the end of the world, just another little complicating factor.

that is one big advantage of the bass cannon "top slot firing" design. there is no restriction on the port length. it can be nice and big and doesn't need any bends.

but something about that just doesn't look as intimidating. hard to put words on it, some designs just "have it" others don't. then again, it's not like it looks bad or anything....


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Old 11-09-2013, 01:26 AM
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Ok, a center slot port, say 4" wide, that goes all the way to the back wall and splits off in both directions into two 2" ports, like a T. I would probably put a divider for the first few inches to help with directing airflow. Once I'm done at work I can throw it in sketchup real quick to better get the idea across.
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Old 11-09-2013, 01:38 AM
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yeah...that would work just fine.

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Old 11-09-2013, 10:09 AM
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For you guys considering putting legs on a MartySub for a down-firing design, be sure to make those legs STRONG. The MartySub is HEAVY and you will likely end up tipping it up onto the legs from its sides, so you don't want the legs to bend or break while standing up your sub....
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Old 11-09-2013, 01:01 PM
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Just watched two guns movie which was not bad . Bass was really good. Several scenes with gto car rumbling , bass guitar riffs , and trains . Marty was clean and impressive .
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Old 11-09-2013, 02:38 PM
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Well, I am now interested in doing a dual ho 18 ported. What tuning should I go for? I don't need low teens. I'm thinking 17 or 18hz. Movies 40% music 60%. I like it loud and deep. I have had the dts10, the danley th50, dual cap pros, and dual soon tube llt maelstroms. I had to sell it all when we had a baby. Now I am eeking into back into the sub game but I have a limited budget.

I am thinking dual front firing with large slot port on top. I am limited to 24"wX24" deepX up to 60" tall (maybe a bit more). I have an inuke 6000 and will push these subs quite a bit.biggrin.gif

What are your thoughts??? Are the SI 18 or ixl18 better?

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Old 11-09-2013, 04:14 PM
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All three of the subs your are considering are good units. I looked and them too.

I recently got two SI HT-18D2s. Just started the sealed boxes today. Got all the box panels cut, rabbets & cutouts tomorrow and maybe some assembly. I am going with a triple front baffle only because I like the look. I do expect to do another identical dual build for a quad set up. I need to offload two subs I have to get the funds for the other two.

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Old 11-09-2013, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebuckaman View Post

Well, I am now interested in doing a dual ho 18 ported. What tuning should I go for? I don't need low teens. I'm thinking 17 or 18hz. Movies 40% music 60%. I like it loud and deep. I have had the dts10, the danley th50, dual cap pros, and dual soon tube llt maelstroms. I had to sell it all when we had a baby. Now I am eeking into back into the sub game but I have a limited budget.

I am thinking dual front firing with large slot port on top. I am limited to 24"wX24" deepX up to 60" tall (maybe a bit more). I have an inuke 6000 and will push these subs quite a bit.biggrin.gif

What are your thoughts??? Are the SI 18 or ixl18 better?

You have had some nice subs. I was targeting 17hz and it ended up 16hz. Not a huge difference between the two.
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Old 11-09-2013, 06:41 PM
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"I was targeting 17hz and it ended up 16hz."

is that with any stuffing in the enclosure? also, could you confirm the dimensions of the port in your build so i can update post #18?

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Old 11-09-2013, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

"I was targeting 17hz and it ended up 16hz."

is that with any stuffing in the enclosure? also, could you confirm the dimensions of the port in your build so i can update post #18?

Two inch lining everywhere . Port is 2 and 3/4" high instead of three inches.
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:20 PM
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and how long, 36"?

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Old 11-09-2013, 10:26 PM
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^^^ yes.
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:40 PM
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thanks!

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Old 12-22-2013, 07:45 PM
 
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Ugh - so my max depth is 44", max width is 24", and max height is about 24". The only dimension that is at all flexible is the height, and that is even stretching it.

What would the approx Hz tune be for a Marty variant that is 4" less deep than the normal 48"?
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Old 12-22-2013, 08:01 PM
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Need ltd to confirm but I would imagine it.would.be 18-20hz.
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Old 12-22-2013, 10:49 PM
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I mentioned in another thread that I had some new ideas about simplified bracing. Since at least one person mentioned they were planning a build soon, I thought I would put my idea out now, even though I am not quite ready. In essence, all of the cross bracing/window bracing in the sub is a PITA to build and install. My thought is that two longitudinal braces extending from front to back on each of the four sides is all we need. Sorta like this:



And here is a SketchUp image highliting the bracing I propose (the top and its two associated braces are removed for clarity):




At the rear panel, they would stop just short of the panel, and I would run two cross braces, between the two side braces, to set the rear panel depth. With this method, there would be no critical cuts for the braces, and you could install all of the braces to the panels before attaching the panels to the rest of the enclosure, so you would have easy access for construction (clamping, glueing, nailing, screwing...).

So the new plan would have just 12 braces; 8 longitudinal braces (two per major panel) that run nearly the full length (two of these act as the slot braces), 2 stub braces on top of the slot panel to support that edge of the front baffle, and 2 cross braces at the rear that nearly span nearly the full width. Cut all of these 1/8" shorter than you need to prevent any panels from standing proud out of alignment. The front baffle will determine the forward-most position of all of the longitudinal braces (including the 2 stub braces but not the 2 slot braces) and these braces must touch and support the front baffle because there is no room for cross braces up front.

At the rear, only the short cross braces will determine the depth of the rear panel, the longitudinal braces do not need to touch the rear panel, but they do need to overlap with the cross braces to form a simple lap joint (sorry I don't have drawings just yet).

I don't have access to Finite Element Analysis to confirm my theory, but I believe this scheme is nearly as rigid as the the cross bracing shown above. Diagonal bracing is not needed either, because the panels themselves prevent any diagonal collapse in those directions. Therefore, the only real need for bracing is to prevent panel resonances.

This theory came about from my thinking about the bracing patterns in folded horns and how to make those lighter. Horns can only have longitudinal bracing, except at folds. Due to their very nature, horns can't have cross bracing anywhere along the signal path. And in the throat, they are probably exposed to even higher pressures than encountered in a sealed enclosure! Despite all this, they don't seem to suffer from excess panel resonance.

I'll keep searching for some photos . . .

Enjoy your holidays and happy building,
Mike

smile.gif

Edit - Drawing added and photo deleted.
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Old 12-23-2013, 12:06 AM
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For the eight longitudinal braces could you install them with small angle brackets. Would take 5 minutes with cordless .
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Old 12-23-2013, 02:05 AM
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"Ugh - so my max depth is 44", max width is 24", and max height is about 24". The only dimension that is at all flexible is the height, and that is even stretching it.

What would the approx Hz tune be for a Marty variant that is 4" less deep than the normal 48"?"

haha...i just sent a note saying that if the standard marty didn't work for some reason that it could be customized...then i see the standard marty is too big! funny how that works...

by making it shorter, all other things equal, the internal volume goes down and the tuning goes up.

4" off the end would reduce the internal volume by about ~1.33 cu ft. red panel in the pic is the new rear wall and what would be chopped off is in yellow highlight. that would increase the tuning from about 17hz up to about 18hz.

since there is still room to increase the slot port length, it could be extended a bit (indicated in red also). adding 3-4" to the slot port length would drop the tuning back down by about 1/2 of a hz or so, so somewhere in the 17.5hz ball park +/-. just be sure to leave **at least** one full port height of breathing room from the end of the slot port board to the rear wall of the enclosure or the port may not function as intended.


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Old 12-23-2013, 02:26 AM
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"I don't have access to Finite Element Analysis to confirm my theory, but I believe this scheme is nearly as rigid as the cross bracing shown above."

your proposed approach seems fine. i don't think fea simulations are necessary for something like this. :-) what might be interesting is to see a braced / unbraced cab measured, assuming that the difference in weight was controlled for.

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