Need some help designing Sub box for Kicker SoloX 18" and Crown Itech 6000 amp - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 20 Old 09-10-2013, 09:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Hey guys,

I need some help designing a sub box for my Kicker 18" SoloX subwoofer with a Crown Itech 6000 Amplifer.

Here are the specs of the Sub;



I've Also attached the amplifier specs below;
Crown Itech 6000.pdf 402k .pdf file

Apparently the amp has around 5000w, but I've done the math's, its most likely around 2500w RMS if that.

Now, Kicker recommends an enclosure around 10cu'ft tuned to 35hz. After doing a heap of research, Its come to my attention that the tuning frequency should be around 18-20hz for home theater use.My question being, If I tune the box this low, will it still be good for music? I have Klipsch rf-7 full range tower speakers which produce quite alot of bass themselves.

I've done some modelling with winisd, it seems like 13cuft tuned to 19hz would be good. I must stress, I'm no expert in designing sub boxes, so If someone could check my design and let me know what you think, would be greatly appreciated,

I've attached the winisd file;

SoloX box.zip 1k .zip file

All help is greatly appreciated, Thanks in advance
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Crown Itech 6000.pdf (402.1 KB, 1 views)
File Type: zip SoloX box.zip (558 Bytes, 5 views)
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post #2 of 20 Old 09-11-2013, 03:50 AM
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20Hz tuning will lose you quite a lot of ULF bass below that point that you can't really hear that well but can instead feel - there's not always that much of it but it does add a tactile feel and 'weight' IMHO.

How much space do you have? You could build a LLT box (Large and Low Tuned) tuned to, say, 11Hz - this would get you a lot more extension, probably into single digits in-room with room gain taken into account.

In either scenario you will need to employ a High Pass Filter, although I'm not sure what the HPF options are on that amp.


If the driver really can handle 5000wRMS, you could feed it that much in a sealed box and have extension down to single digits with plenty of output higher up too.
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post #3 of 20 Old 09-11-2013, 07:46 PM - Thread Starter
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I don't really have a limit on box size, but I would have thought tuning it to 11hz would be a little low considering I want this sub for music aswell?

I'm only feeding the sub around the 2500w RMS. Crown and every other PA company uses a funny rating system which is not infact true rms. I've calculated from amp draw, it really is around roughly 2000-2500w RMS.

I'm not sure how to read the winisd graph in terms of group delay and stuff, only able to model the frequency response,

I've modelled the sealed box as well, I't seems like there is no where near the output as the ported box even below tuning frequency. But as I've said, I'm no expert.

Thanks for the response
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post #4 of 20 Old 09-11-2013, 10:18 PM
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Holy hell, a 40 BL, 1.84lbs of moving mass, and over 1 Le/Re.
Nearly 2 pounds!

YID DIY
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post #5 of 20 Old 09-11-2013, 10:36 PM
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you are in luck! there is a box called the Marty Sub that we were just working on in another thread.

11.5 cubic feet tuned to around 17hz. perfect for that driver.

pick up the thread around here: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1489541/large-ported-dayton-ho18s#post_23711174

your driver cutout dimensions would be unique to that driver, but all else would be the same.

2500 watts. 22 mm excursion. high pass filter recommended as with most ported...


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post #6 of 20 Old 09-11-2013, 10:42 PM
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alternatively, you could make a smaller sub more like the captivator, which is slot ported and tuned to around 17.5hz.


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post #7 of 20 Old 09-11-2013, 10:45 PM
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"My question being, If I tune the box this low, will it still be good for music?"

yes. it will give up a little bit of sensitivity higher up, but as far as sound quality, it will actually be a little better with the low tuning.

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post #8 of 20 Old 09-11-2013, 11:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi LTD02,

When you say, perfect for that driver, Do you mean perfect my soloX 18" or perfect for the driver in the linked thread? Sorry I'm a little slow,

Thanks heaps
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post #9 of 20 Old 09-11-2013, 11:32 PM
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perfect isn't the right term as there really isn't any "perfect".

the plot that I just posted is from winisd with your solo x in an 11.5 cubic footer tuned to 17hz.

the solo x would work great in such a setup and with the power that you have available for movie and music content.

the only thing not to like is that the cab is fairly large, but that was because we tried to find a design that could employ some pre-cut "handy panels" from home depot to help cut down on the number of cuts the builder would be required to make.

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post #10 of 20 Old 09-12-2013, 12:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Interesting, I can't seem to get the same curve when I model it in WinIsd??? Wonder what I'm doing wrong. Im using the old version of winisd, not the alpha version. Think that would make a difference?

Oh, and it doesn't matter how large the cab is, I can't get off the shelf pieces here, it all has to be custom frown.gif
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post #11 of 20 Old 09-12-2013, 05:39 AM
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What is you box size and port size ?

-


"Too much is almost enough. Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation is for cowards."
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post #12 of 20 Old 09-12-2013, 06:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

What is you box size and port size ?

It will be what LTD02 suggested, 11.5cuft tuned to 17hz. I just cant get the same response curve as him when I put the figures in winisd for some reason
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post #13 of 20 Old 09-12-2013, 07:04 PM
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"It will be what LTD02 suggested, 11.5cuft tuned to 17hz. I just cant get the same response curve as him when I put the figures in winisd for some reason..."

here is what i have in winisd for that driver.



11.5 cubic footer tuned to 17hz is what i used.

ah! ZERO out inductance (Le) on the driver. that messes things up. winisd doesn't account for that parameter properly, so i leave it out.

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post #14 of 20 Old 09-12-2013, 07:13 PM
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oh, and another VERY MINOR thing, going with a slightly oversized cab creates that little bump in response at the bottom end.

that is a GOOD THING, as when a high pass filter is applied, response just goes smooth.

normally, one could use a high pass filter and then put a little eq bump right on the tuning frequency, BUT that isn't the best idea because the tuning frequency is where maximum power is already being consumed. so that little 2-3db bump in the raw response actually saves about 50% power usage on the tuning frequency, which is something that is never really discussed but is nice. ported cabs draw max power right on their tuning frequency.

here is the response with a 2nd order high pass filter at 17hz. looks pretty good to my eyeball. :-)


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post #15 of 20 Old 09-12-2013, 07:15 PM
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for others who are interested, here is power consumed assuming 2500 "watts" setting in winisd.

so that little bump around the tuning frequency drops power down to about 850 watts. nice! power on the top end will by reduced significantly when a low pass filter is applied to match to the mains, so don't worry about that at all.


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post #16 of 20 Old 09-12-2013, 07:16 PM
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"Oh, and it doesn't matter how large the cab is, I can't get off the shelf pieces here, it all has to be custom"

btw, where is "here"? :-)

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post #17 of 20 Old 09-12-2013, 08:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks heaps for that! I'm in Australia. I can see my house falling apart with this! Hahaha,

I'll try and reproduce it on winisd smile.gif I'm using the older version btw!
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post #18 of 20 Old 09-12-2013, 10:02 PM
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Are you in Melbourne or NSW area?
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post #19 of 20 Old 09-13-2013, 12:13 AM
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Aww Kicker. Brings me back to the early nineties when I was cutting my audio teeth starting with car audio. I had great luck back in the day with Kicker Solobarics in very small sealed enclosures. I wish you good luck with your build.

JBL Pro Cinema
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post #20 of 20 Old 09-13-2013, 12:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reddig View Post

Aww Kicker. Brings me back to the early nineties when I was cutting my audio teeth starting with car audio. I had great luck back in the day with Kicker Solobarics in very small sealed enclosures. I wish you good luck with your build.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrapladm View Post

Are you in Melbourne or NSW area?

I'm in perth area!

Yeah, I've always been a kicker fan! Sound good to me!
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