Mach 5 uxl-18 sealed, Behringer EP4000 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 34 Old 09-15-2013, 01:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Need some advice here, first DIY project smile.gif

I've ordered a Mach 5 uxl-18, should get it by the end of the week.
Need a small box so i'm going sealed. 3.5ft3 should give me good performances according to Winisd Pro.

I'm trying to decide between the Behringer ep2000 bridged mono at 2000w/4ohms or the ep4000 using only one channel 1400w/4ohms or 4000 w/4ohms bridged mono, though i'm not sure i would risk to use 4000w on the uxl-18 eek.gif

I won't add another sub down the road so i dont't really need the second channel on the ep4000. I already have an SB-13 Ultra and love it. Just trying to smooth out the bass in the 3800ft3 room.

Any advice would be greatly appreciate ...
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post #2 of 34 Old 09-15-2013, 01:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Niavlys View Post

Need some advice here, first DIY project smile.gif

I've ordered a Mach 5 uxl-18, should get it by the end of the week.
Need a small box so i'm going sealed. 3.5ft3 should give me good performances according to Winisd Pro.

I'm trying to decide between the Behringer ep2000 bridged mono at 2000w/4ohms or the ep4000 using only one channel 1400w/4ohms or 4000 w/4ohms bridged mono, though i'm not sure i would risk to use 4000w on the uxl-18 eek.gif

I won't add another sub down the road so i dont't really need the second channel on the ep4000. I already have an SB-13 Ultra and love it. Just trying to smooth out the bass in the 3800ft3 room.

Any advice would be greatly appreciate ...

the ep4000 isn't that high.. that's PEAK power. the RMS power for the ep4000 is 670 watts per channel at 4ohm stereo or 1900 watts bridged at 4ohms
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post #3 of 34 Old 09-15-2013, 02:29 PM
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The ep4000 is perfect for the UXL, the 2000 will under power it.

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post #4 of 34 Old 09-15-2013, 02:33 PM
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yup, run the UXL bridged and it should give you more than enough power
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post #5 of 34 Old 09-15-2013, 04:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by wormraper View Post

the ep4000 isn't that high.. that's PEAK power. the RMS power for the ep4000 is 670 watts per channel at 4ohm stereo or 1900 watts bridged at 4ohms

I should have known that, now i remember i have read about this a couple of times rolleyes.gif

I'll go with the ep4000.

Thanks guys
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post #6 of 34 Old 09-25-2013, 11:16 AM - Thread Starter
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I got the UXL-18 and the Behringer yesterday smile.gif
This is my first experience with a large driver like that and i must say this thing is impressive eek.gif

But i have a question .....
I’m going sealed, 20’’X20’’X15’’ internal dimensions for a volume of 3.5ft3 and i’ll be using 1’’ thick MDF for the box.
Do i need internal bracing for such a small box made out of 1'' thick MDF ?
If so, i guess i’ll have to make it 16’’deep instead of 15’’ to compensate for the added volume of the bracing.


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post #7 of 34 Old 09-25-2013, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Niavlys View Post

Do i need internal bracing for such a small box made out of 1'' thick MDF ?

Strong and stiff are not always directly coupled. The point of bracing isn't to make the box stronger but stiffer so energy being produced goes to make sound and not flexing the box. Rule of thumb i've read a few times for subs is that any thing over 30L really should be braced. But bracing doesn't need to be fancy. Even dowels can do a fine job.
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post #8 of 34 Old 09-25-2013, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Niavlys View Post

I got the UXL-18 and the Behringer yesterday smile.gif
This is my first experience with a large driver like that and i must say this thing is impressive eek.gif

But i have a question .....
I’m going sealed, 20’’X20’’X15’’ internal dimensions for a volume of 3.5ft3 and i’ll be using 1’’ thick MDF for the box.
Do i need internal bracing for such a small box made out of 1'' thick MDF ?
If so, i guess i’ll have to make it 16’’deep instead of 15’’ to compensate for the added volume of the bracing.



Have you constructed the box yet? 20 x 20 x 15 internally gives you 3.5ft3, yes, but after the driver volume and bracing you are probably looking at 3ft3 or slightly less.

I run my UXL in a 3.75ft3 box after driver and bracing. Others have mentioned to use the ep4000 in bridged. I concur as I run a QSC rmx 2450 (very very similar to the ep4000) bridged with nice results.
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post #9 of 34 Old 09-25-2013, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Niavlys View Post

I got the UXL-18 and the Behringer yesterday smile.gif
This is my first experience with a large driver like that and i must say this thing is impressive eek.gif

But i have a question .....
I’m going sealed, 20’’X20’’X15’’ internal dimensions for a volume of 3.5ft3 and i’ll be using 1’’ thick MDF for the box.
Do i need internal bracing for such a small box made out of 1'' thick MDF ?
If so, i guess i’ll have to make it 16’’deep instead of 15’’ to compensate for the added volume of the bracing.



Have you constructed the box yet? 20 x 20 x 15 internally gives you 3.5ft3, yes, but after the driver volume and bracing you are probably looking at 3ft3 or slightly less.

I run my UXL in a 3.75ft3 box after driver and bracing. Others have mentioned to use the ep4000 in bridged. I concur as I run a QSC rmx 2450 (very very similar to the ep4000) bridged with nice results.
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post #10 of 34 Old 09-25-2013, 12:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trepidati0n View Post

Strong and stiff are not always directly coupled. The point of bracing isn't to make the box stronger but stiffer so energy being produced goes to make sound and not flexing the box. Rule of thumb i've read a few times for subs is that any thing over 30L really should be braced. But bracing doesn't need to be fancy. Even dowels can do a fine job.

I’ll add some bracing then. Pretty easy to do anyway, thanks smile.gif
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Originally Posted by platoon2063 View Post

Have you constructed the box yet? 20 x 20 x 15 internally gives you 3.5ft3, yes, but after the driver volume and bracing you are probably looking at 3ft3 or slightly less.

I run my UXL in a 3.75ft3 box after driver and bracing. Others have mentioned to use the ep4000 in bridged. I concur as I run a QSC rmx 2450 (very very similar to the ep4000) bridged with nice results.

I’ve not started the work on the box yet, i just bought the MDF sheet this morning. I’ll start working on it next week.
Glad you told me that, i’m going to add additionnal depth to the box.
I'll definitively run the EP4000 bridged.

How do you like your sub ? How large is your room ?

My room is 3800ft3 and i'm using one SB13-Ultra. It really is a great sub, i love it but i''m expecting the UXL to crush it.
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post #11 of 34 Old 10-05-2013, 01:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Here's a quick update on my project,

Nothing new here, just a simple box made out of 1’’ MDF, no fancy bracings, i used 1’’X 1’’ sticks cut out of MDF leftovers.
I did the knock test on the box before and after bracings and i got surprised to hear a good difference in sound, even if the box walls are 1’’ thick.
The corners are 3/4’’ hardwood rounded corners bought from local hardware store. The box will be painted gloss black finish. Still some sandings to do, here are some pics....





LTD02 and hybridfive like this.
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post #12 of 34 Old 10-05-2013, 01:49 PM
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SOLID!

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post #13 of 34 Old 10-05-2013, 01:54 PM
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SOLID!

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Very cool, thanks for sharing!

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post #14 of 34 Old 10-05-2013, 02:47 PM
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Nice job, the diy bug will getcha now:)
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post #15 of 34 Old 10-05-2013, 03:16 PM
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Nice looking build!!!!!

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post #16 of 34 Old 10-05-2013, 04:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys smile.gif

I like building things, i've done quite a few DIY projects but in the A/V world, it´s a first for me. I must say i like it, looking forward to hear the UXL smile.gif
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post #17 of 34 Old 10-06-2013, 12:55 PM
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Looking good, man. What box dimensions did you end up going with? As I mentioned mine is in a 3.75ft3 box, semi corner loaded with a bridged QSC 2450 powering it. My room is 21 x 15 x 8.
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post #18 of 34 Old 10-06-2013, 04:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks,

I ended up with 20" X 20" X 17" internal.
Mine won't be corner loaded, it's going to sit behind the left speaker, against the wall and adjacent to a walkway that is opened to 2 more rooms. Not the best place in the room for a sub but my SB13 is already in the right corner and i have such great results with that placement that i don't want to move it !
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post #19 of 34 Old 10-12-2013, 05:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Still have some work to do on painting the box, not happy with the finish but in the meantime, couldn't resist to fire up the UXL and the ep4000 biggrin.gif

I used an SPL meter to adjust both the SB13 and the UXL to 72db, adjust the phase between the subs and then, let Anthem room correction do the equalizing. The gain on the ep4000 was set at 24db ( max is 34db ) and the SB13 volume was set at -18db, ARC set the sub level at 0db in the avr, which is dead on where it should be. The results are impressive, the UXL definitely has a huge impact in my room. The bass is now flat all the way down to 23hz before it drops about 3db from 23hz to 20hz. But the biggest improvement came at around 80hz and up.

I ended up placing the UXL exactly like my SB13, the driver firing at the wall, about 3" from the wall, otherwise i get very boomy bass and a drop of about 8db or so at around 80hz. With the subs facing at the wall, i get nice tight bass and the 8db drop at 80hz almost disappeared.

I still have to spend more time fine tuning the subs but i can already say that i'm impressed by the UXL. I watched some blu-rays with heavy bass scenes and this thing is shaking the room without any effort eek.gif
Prior to get the UXL, i was running the small SB13 3db hot, depending on the movie i was watching. With the addition of the UXL, no need to do that anymore !

I'm thinking of getting a MiniDSP with the UMIK-1 and use REW to see what's happening below 20hz and also see if i could get back those missing 3db between 20hz and 23hz ...



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post #20 of 34 Old 10-13-2013, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
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The results are impressive, the UXL definitely has a huge impact in my room. The bass is now flat all the way down to 23hz before it drops about 3db from 23hz to 20hz.

Nice, congrats

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Originally Posted by Niavlys View Post

I ended up placing the UXL exactly like my SB13, the driver firing at the wall, about 3" from the wall, otherwise i get very boomy bass and a drop of about 8db or so at around 80hz. With the subs facing at the wall, i get nice tight bass and the 8db drop at 80hz almost disappeared.

Classic 1/4 wave cancelation issues.

It's refreshing seeing the driver facing the boundary, all too often individuals prefer the driver forward aesthetic over the ideal response config, so good lookin' out.

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post #21 of 34 Old 10-13-2013, 10:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks,

Having a way to measure real time in room frequency response (ARC software in my case) is what made all the difference here. I've tried about every other placement in my room, including having the sub in a down firing position without any good result. It's only when i saw a thread here on AVS saying that having the driver facing a wall was beneficial in many cases. I tried that and the improvement was immediate. I would love to have those drivers facing the other way but sound quality is my priority .... and the good side of it is i don't need to fabricate a grill anymore !

Now i need to learn more on the MiniDSP and REW. As good as ARC is, i have the feeling that REW and the Mini would be a huge step forward.
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post #22 of 34 Old 10-13-2013, 11:42 AM
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Yeah, REW is outstanding. However, OmniMic is great too. I've got both, they each possess their strongpoints.

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post #23 of 34 Old 10-30-2013, 06:22 PM - Thread Starter
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I got my Minidsp and started to play with it today. There's definitely a learning curve on how to use it with REW but thanks to all those tutorials found here on AVS and on the Minidsp website, it's easier than i thought smile.gif

Like i wrote in the thread above, my subs started to roll off at about 23hz after EQ'ing them with ARC. But things changed drastically as soon as i added the Mini ... way more than expected !

Here's what i was able to acheive with my sealed UXL-18 and the SB-13 in a 3800ft3 room with hardwood and ceramic tiles flooring, 8ft ceiling, opened to 3 more rooms. Note that i forgot to disable the sub crossover in the receiver, that's why the FR is rolling off at 100hz ...



Just for the sake of it, i started EQ'ing with the SB13 only, just to see how much LFE i could get out of it. The result was not bad down to 20hz but not satisfying at all below 20hz. Then i added the UXL and started the EQ'ing process again with both subs. With the addition of the UXL, i must say it's a night and day difference, specially below 20hz. This thing has a ton of power, it's almost scary eek.gif
Keep in mind that this is my first experience in home theater, that may explain why i'm so impressed !

Right now, the FR is almost flat all the way down to 14hz. I think i can do better, just need more time to play with the Mini and REW. In the meantime, i'm open to any advice, i still have a lot to learn ... but damn i love it !
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post #24 of 34 Old 10-30-2013, 07:23 PM
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I think you should sell the PB-13 and build another identical sub. Likely have better performance all around with the 2 identical drivers and configurations. Not sure if the EP4000 would power both though....
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post #25 of 34 Old 10-30-2013, 08:09 PM
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I think you should sell the PB-13 and build another identical sub. Likely have better performance all around with the 2 identical drivers and configurations. Not sure if the EP4000 would power both though....

the sb13 is a great sub but im sure that UXL destroys it. i would get another EP4K if you did a matching UXL

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post #26 of 34 Old 10-30-2013, 08:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Not sure i want to sell my SB13, i love it, specially with music smile.gif

Would there be a huge difference with 2 UXL vs. 1 UXL and 1 SB13 ?
The space behind the right speaker is limited, the box i built for the UXL won't fit in there.
I can't pull the speaker more into the room so i would need to change the shape of the box and try to make it fit in that space.
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post #27 of 34 Old 10-30-2013, 08:44 PM
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would there be a difference? i would think so, but if it wont work in your space and your happy with your results, i would keep the sb13. it is an excellent sub.

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post #28 of 34 Old 10-31-2013, 05:10 AM - Thread Starter
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I’m definitely keeping the SB13 but i like the idea of adding another UXL with an EP4000 later this year, i need to know what i’m missing !
The only places available to position the subs in my room are behind the front speakers but because of it's small size, i think i could stack the SB13 on top of one of the UXL without any problem.
Hummm... food for thoughts smile.gif
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post #29 of 34 Old 12-07-2013, 01:58 PM
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nice job Niav! cool.gif

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post #30 of 34 Old 12-07-2013, 04:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks !!!

I'm glad i found the DIY section on AVS, lots of good advices and nice projects over here smile.gif
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