Need to fill in 20/30hz to 300hz below a Unity horn - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 16 Old 11-20-2013, 03:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Hey Guys

Any recommendations on a solution for the 20/30hz to 300hz range under a Unity horn (which reaches down to 300hz)? How about a tapped or folded horn?

I need output and speed to keep up with the Unity which is quite fast.

Thanks,
Jim
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post #2 of 16 Old 11-20-2013, 03:14 PM
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I am not an expert here, but I think you'll find that most tapped or folded bass horns operate their best over a relatively limited bandwidth - nowhere near the wide range you're looking for. You're probably looking for a pair of big ported bass bins of the more conventional variety.
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post #3 of 16 Old 11-20-2013, 03:32 PM
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300Hz is quite high. You'll probably need to spread that over 2 drivers. One handling 300Hz down to 60-100Hz, and a subwoofer (which could be horn-loaded) taking over below that. The middle driver will still be pretty directional, so crossing that with the unity horn will be tricky.

Sounds Good to Me... keeping track of my audio projects.

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post #4 of 16 Old 11-20-2013, 04:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys.

I guess I'm thinking about this in the context of a couple of commercially made products:

http://www.peavey.com/products/index.cfm/item/1098/118016/SP%26nbsp%3BFHBX

and

http://www.epiksubwoofers.com/empire.html

There was a gentleman on here who (very) successfully employs the Empires to do exactly what I am trying to accomplish:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1319638/danley-sm60m-and-epik-empire-creating-a-full-range-hybrid

I've been conversing with him and he mentions that the integration is quite seamless. I'd go this route, but who knows what's up with Epik these days.

Regarding the Peavey, I have no idea if it sounds any good or just goes loud.

-Jim
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post #5 of 16 Old 11-20-2013, 07:18 PM
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Originally Posted by jdubs View Post

Regarding the Peavey, I have no idea if it sounds any good or just goes loud.
It won't sound good to 300Hz. The reason is that it, like most bass horns, is only tapered on one plane of the horn path, the other is straight sided, and it is wide enough that the resonant modes that occur in a horn with parallel walls create a boxy sound above 150Hz or so. It won't run to 30Hz either, the horn is far too short. Look at the SPL chart. It's a 40Hz horn, and it would take at least four of them to run reasonably flat. As for the Epik, or any other direct radiator, sensitivity is way too low to mate well with a horn top.

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post #6 of 16 Old 11-20-2013, 07:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the reply, Bill.

I hear you and figured as much. What about a PPSL using something like Eminence Kappa Pro-15LF drivers? I'm reading that such a design will do down to 35hz and up north of 300hz....and sound good doing it.

-Jim
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post #7 of 16 Old 11-20-2013, 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by jdubs View Post

Thanks for the reply, Bill.

I hear you and figured as much. What about a PPSL using something like Eminence Kappa Pro-15LF drivers?
Kappa Pro 15LFs are good for an f3 of perhaps 40Hz. Like most pro drivers they trade low frequency response for sensitivity.

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post #8 of 16 Old 11-21-2013, 03:18 AM
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Why not go with duel Dayton HO18's for the 16hz to 80hz range, and then either an AE TD15 or a JBL-2226 to cover the 80hz to 300hz range? Other possibilities are the TD12, TD18, JBL-2242, SI-18D.
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post #9 of 16 Old 11-21-2013, 06:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdubs View Post

Thanks for the reply, Bill.

I hear you and figured as much. What about a PPSL using something like Eminence Kappa Pro-15LF drivers? I'm reading that such a design will do down to 35hz and up north of 300hz....and sound good doing it.

-Jim
PPSL is definitely interesting, from what I've read they are a lot cleaner than other options. If you did a sealed box with a PPSL layout it should hopefully have the depth you are looking for but also be clean up to 300Hz or so, assuming the slot size was correct and not acting like a LPF (which I think it can do? The science makes my head hurt... lol)
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post #10 of 16 Old 11-21-2013, 09:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

Why not go with duel Dayton HO18's for the 16hz to 80hz range, and then either an AE TD15 or a JBL-2226 to cover the 80hz to 300hz range? Other possibilities are the TD12, TD18, JBL-2242, SI-18D.

I'm going to do active crossovers and things are already so freaking complicated with the Unity that if I ca do the low(ish) end with one driver (or pair of drivers with the PPSL), it would be one less thing to worry about.

-Jim
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post #11 of 16 Old 11-22-2013, 04:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdubs View Post

I'm going to do active crossovers and things are already so freaking complicated with the Unity that if I ca do the low(ish) end with one driver (or pair of drivers with the PPSL), it would be one less thing to worry about.

-Jim

I understand that completely! I would hate having to integrate not only those Unity horns, but also a subwoofer and a mid-bass woofer as well. Seems like it would make things easier to use a pair of UXL-18's or possibly a pair of Dayton or SI 18" drivers, assuming that they have a decent amount of mid-bass capability.
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post #12 of 16 Old 11-22-2013, 05:21 AM
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pro audio 18" fit that bill almost perfectly.

TD18H+ from AE Speakers http://www.aespeakers.com/drivers.php?driver_id=24
18LW2400 form 18Sounds http://www.loudspeakersplus.com/product/18LW2400/18-SOUND18LW2400/

a cabinet tuned to around 25hz is probably a good target for balancing extension with max spl above that point.

genelec runs p.a. 18's to 400hz in their top of the line monitor: http://www.genelec.com/products/1036a/

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post #13 of 16 Old 11-23-2013, 04:22 AM
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Would the TD18 be a decent amount better than the 18LW2400, enough so to justify the price difference? Hopefully my desk top PC will be out of the shop soon so that I can model some of these drivers! I don't think winISD is comparable with iPhones! LoL
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post #14 of 16 Old 11-23-2013, 06:55 AM
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tough to say marty. depends in part on how they are used. i wouldn't expect night-and-day differences.

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post #15 of 16 Old 11-25-2013, 03:46 AM
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When it comes to mid-bass cabinets that are dedicated to mid-bass, and function separately from the subwoofers, how should the mid-bass cabinets be placed in a room? This question has me stumped, and I would really like to hear some opinions on this?
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post #16 of 16 Old 11-25-2013, 05:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

When it comes to mid-bass cabinets that are dedicated to mid-bass, and function separately from the subwoofers, how should the mid-bass cabinets be placed in a room?
Beneath the mains in most cases.

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