Dual Bass Reflex Sub Build - LAB12 Drivers - AVS Forum
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Old 12-05-2013, 07:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Thread changed to reflect current strategy of building dual LAB 12 based subs. Drivers were purchased while living in Cambodia and sound great with music. New build info starts after post #12.


cool.gif

After months of planning, changing directions, and rethinking I am moving forward building a pair of transmission line subs. The design was developed over the past year and half on diyAudio while I was out of country, but now I am ready to start the build. diyAudio member tb46 is the developer of this design and is finalizing putting the Hornresp model into a schematic plan. I was going to go sealed, but at the end of the day I wanted to do something different.

Hornresp Data: Calculated tuning around 22.6 Hz based on minimal cone excursion



Based on latest iteration of the plan, the enclosure will measure 25.5" H x 25.5" D x 16" W. Once finalized I will post and develop the cut sheet. Dual subs will be powered by an Adcom GFA555 amp (for now).

Internal dividers will have around a 3.2 degree angle. I remember reading on one of the tapped horn build threads that when using PL adhesive you don't have to cut the panels to exact degree. Would appreciate any feedback on whether I need to cut the internal dividers at the angle or will the PL adhesive fill the gaps?

I am hoping for an in room response of 115 dB @ 1 M per sub (250 W/4 ohm input). I guess time will tell. I have REW and a calibrated Cross-spectrum Labs calibrated EMM-6 USB microphone. Once subs are built I will try to figure out room measurements.

My space is rather large (~4,800^3) but these two subs will be used as flanking subs for my 4 Pi speakers. I primarily listen to music (75%). WIll post photos as time allows.

For HT they will be paired with an 18" Mael-X sub (sealed, 5.9 ft^3, Qtc: 6.5) powered by a QSC RMX1850HD amp. For eq I have a miniDSP (2x4), Behringer DSP1124P and Behringer FBQ2496.

Hope to start sawing wood in next couple of weeks, but the holidays may intervene.wink.gif

Thanks for reading, hope these turn out well....

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:04 PM
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Not to be critical, but the Lab 12 in 100L ported tuned to 23Hz give almost an identical result.

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Old 12-05-2013, 08:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Bill

I modeled it winISD and you are correct. However I want to do somerhing different just for the fun of it. I keep reading that TL's have a better sound quality than ported. ..may or may not be the case but at the end of the day its only plywood. LAB12's seem to run out of excursion around 30 Hz regardless of build type. If I want to equal the output of the mal-X I will need to cross these puppies over around 35 Hz.

Thsnks for taking the time and effort to post !

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWCgrad View Post

I keep reading that TL's have a better sound quality than ported.!
Not really. Their main benefit is that they work well with high Qts low EBP drivers, allowing ported extension and sensitivity with drivers that are usually better off sealed. Of course, that doesn't apply to the LAB 12. Also, while I haven't looked closely at your design, a glance at the impedance chart shows it functionally to be a vented box. A TL has only one impedance peak, just like a sealed cab, with that peak at FP, and a 22Hz TL would be at least 385 cm long.
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LAB12's seem to run out of excursion around 30 Hz regardless of build type.
True, even in a horn. But at least the horn will get you 125dB. eek.gif
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:54 PM
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given that music tends to have 10db more spl in the bass and given the high sensitivity mains that you are running, seems like these guys may be a little on the small side, unless if you tend not to crank it.

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Old 12-05-2013, 09:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

Not really. Their main benefit is that they work well with high Qts low EBP drivers, allowing ported extension and sensitivity with drivers that are usually better off sealed. Of course, that doesn't apply to the LAB 12. Also, while I haven't looked closely at your design, a glance at the impedance chart shows it functionally to be a vented box. A TL has only one impedance peak, just like a sealed cab, with that peak at FP, and a 22Hz TL would be at least 385 cm long.
True, even in a horn. But at least the horn will get you 125dB. eek.gif

Hum...I guess once I get them built I will find out if it was worth the effort. Since the don't model any worse than ported I don't see anu negatives. Outside of the big tapped horns - which really won't work I'm the allotted space - I have yet to see a really great design with these drivers. I find it hard to believe that Zu Audio can charge thousands for Lab12 based drivers.

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given that music tends to have 10db more spl in the bass and given the high sensitivity mains that you are running, seems like these guys may be a little on the small side, unless if you tend not to crank it.

I live in a townhome so I don't get to let loose very often. Occasionally I will crank the Black Sabbath up to about 110 dB at the primary listening position. I am primarily looking for high sound quality in this build. With a previous iteration of the sub design the TC Sounds 12" driver drops right in and provides significantly greater output due to its greater excursion. When I want better extension I will fire up the maelstrom X sub. In about a year or so I would like to add a couple of UXL 18 based subs.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 12-06-2013, 06:21 AM
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I find it hard to believe that Zu Audio can charge thousands for Lab12 based drivers.
They're a cable company. You were expecting truthful specs and reasonable prices? rolleyes.gif

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Old 12-06-2013, 06:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

They're a cable company. You were expecting truthful specs and reasonable prices? rolleyes.gif

Nope, I rank cable companies right up at the top of the BS heap. The Submission sub retails at $3, 999.00. What a bargain, I think I will buy four.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 12-07-2013, 09:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Here are the MOD-3 Hornresp input and enclosure design. I wanted the enclosure to be as small as possible and still have a -3 dB point of ~20 Hz, I believe the designer did a fine job. Since these two subs will be for music this should be sufficient.



In case anyone wants more output (and who doesn't), here is Oliver's final design with the TC Sounds Epic 12 driver. It has much more Xmax than the Eminence, and as a result can be driven with 725 W vice 350 W to reach Xmax. Both require an HPF at 19 Hz to prevent runaway cone excursion below tuning (duh!).



Dark Gray Line - Epic 12
Light Gray Line - LAB 12

Looks like a 5 dB increase in output. Nice, if I didn't already own the LAB-12 I would go with the Epic's. Perhaps a future purchase.

Working on the cut sheet now. Trying to decide if I want to go with Baltic Birch (60" x 60" sheet, 13-ply) or a less expensive plywood.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 01-13-2014, 08:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Buying the Baltic birch plywood this week. According to Hornresp the design will require only minimal stuffing. Will put a Wal-Mart pillow in the S1 end of the enclosure.

Can't wait to get started. Will use as flanking subs per recommendations of Wayne Parham.

Will try to learn REW and post measurements.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 01-20-2014, 05:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Bought two sheets of Baltic birch and started making sawdust. Will post some pics when im around my computer. Harder to put together than the usual sealed subs I built in the past. I will build one and try to generate measurements before starting a second.

Compared to carps and popalocks setups these subs will be inadequate. However for my two channel listening sessions I think they will rock the townhouse.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 01-20-2014, 07:20 PM
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Echo what Bill said that these are really just ported subs with a really low first port resonance which limits them to use under 100hz. This is counter to Parham 's flanking strategy.

The obvious question is why not just build 3Pi's? Parham uses the Lab12 in a small ported box tuned to about 20hz and uses them up to about 200hz.

I hate to rain on your parade but You are much better off doing the 3Pi sub route (or similar if his exact dimensions don't work for you).
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Old 01-20-2014, 09:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Echo what Bill said that these are really just ported subs with a really low first port resonance which limits them to use under 100hz. This is counter to Parham 's flanking strategy.

The obvious question is why not just build 3Pi's? Parham uses the Lab12 in a small ported box tuned to about 20hz and uses them up to about 200hz.

I hate to rain on your parade but You are much better off doing the 3Pi sub route (or similar if his exact dimensions don't work for you).

Thanks for raining on my parade! I got so wrapped up on doing something different that I lost sight of the forest for the trees.

Upon further reflection and looking at the inability to run the subs as high as Wayne recommends I will be changing course to a ported sub with same volume and tuning as the Pi 3. Different shape as I don't want a 20" cube.

Thanks! I should have listened to Bill before cutting wood. Oh well, live and learn.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 01-24-2014, 06:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Spent last couple of days on winISD designing a bass reflex enclosure for the LAB 12's. Since I had already cut the sides for the previous design I worked with the same external dimensions (26.25" x 25.5" x 16"). This size works well for my space and will serve as the base for my mains (sub driver will be facing the wall behind the mains, with 26.5" of depth it will be a good distance from the drivers of the mains). Will position the driver about 4" from the wall (concrete covered with drywall). Will be about 12-24" from a corner depending on L or R position.

Will post some data when at my laptop, but in general the 105 L enclosure will be tuned at 23.94 Hz (in silico). With an HPF (Butterworth, 4th order) at 20 Hz the driver will handle 275 W with a max cone excursion of 12.8 mms @ 35 Hz. Max output is calculated at 111 dBs from 28 Hz to approx 200 Hz. Port air velocity peaks at 16 m/s @ 24 Hz.

I am not after sub 20 Hz performance as the LAB 12 is the wrong tool for that application. I am after high SQ for two channel music using Wayne Parham's "helper woofer" concept. Cabinet will be extensively braced using baltic birch strips.

Cannot make any progress on the build as long as Maryland is in the deep freeze. I am freaking sick of winter - almost enough to make me miss Cambodia. Almost.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 02-01-2014, 09:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Weather finally doesn't completely suck (43 F). Set-up my new Universal Edge Guide from EurekaZone, not as cool as a track saw but works pretty well. Set to the width of the majority cuts and make all at one setting so they are precise (made them all about 1/16th to narrow but no biggie).



Finally making some dust....

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 02-01-2014, 02:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Got all the baltic birch cut to width. Now need to accurately cut to length. I hope the rain doesn't ruin tomorrow's plans.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 02-02-2014, 07:21 AM
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Sorry I missed your modeling post. That looks good to me. I think you are going to like what the flanking subs do to the upper bass and mid bass response. It is probably the least painful way to get a good response from 40-150hz. Just try to keep them acoustically close to boundaries for the bandwidth intended.

What processing do you plan on using? With some minor DSP tweaking you should be able to get great results. When you get to the point of measuring PM me otherwise I'll probably miss the post.
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Old 02-02-2014, 07:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Sorry I missed your modeling post. That looks good to me. I think you are going to like what the flanking subs do to the upper bass and mid bass response. It is probably the least painful way to get a good response from 40-150hz. Just try to keep them acoustically close to boundaries for the bandwidth intended.

What processing do you plan on using? With some minor DSP tweaking you should be able to get great results. When you get to the point of measuring PM me otherwise I'll probably miss the post.

Thanks for the feedback. As for processing I have a miniDSP and two Behringer feedback destroyers. Only the miniDSP has HPF and LPF. I have thought about putting an Eminence LPF in the box (185 Hz cutoff for the 6 ohm driver) but the miniDSP has greater flexibility. I plan to put the miniDSP in the processor loop of an old Adcom GFP preamp I use for the two subs now (boosts the weak signal coming from the miniDSP and allows me to adjust the output individually.)

Will PM once ready to make measurements.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 02-02-2014, 12:17 PM
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Are you planning to run these off of a summed/LFE channel or in stereo configuration? You can do it either way but I would probably suggest using them in stereo. The best way to do it is to put the MiniDSP between the receiver and the L/R channel then divide the signal between one flanking sub and one Pi on each side. You can then eq the Pi along with the flanking sub and work to get the best response. The Mal-x will continue to handle the LFE.

You can do it the other way with the flanking subs playing summed content but I think the best way to do it is in stereo. It is really a unique way to get good response for stereo content.
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Old 02-02-2014, 03:12 PM - Thread Starter
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I plan on running stereo, but it will be a bit convoluted.

Music:
OPPO 103 ANALOG into an Odyssey Audio Candela tuned preamp.

Dual RCA outs, one set to Odyssey Khartago Amp (4 Pi speakers); second set to Adcom GFP 555 preamp (miniDSP in the processor loop and functions only with subs). Adcom Preamp out to Adcom GFP 555 amp (designed by Nelson Pass).

Home Theater

OPPO 103 HDMI out to Onkyo 805 reciever for the surrounds and Mael-X sub. Odyssey preamp has HT bypass for the mains/LAB12 which in HT will run as a single speaker.

My primary use is stereo and I dont want to re-digitize signal to the mains which sound really good in my space.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 02-02-2014, 04:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Spent mot of the afternoon making a crosscut jig for my circular saw. Using the base for the UEG I made a hybrid crosscut jig/track saw guide. Used a steel bar to reduce chance of warping. Two aluminum rails align with the track slots in the saw base. Hopefully this thing will last a few years.


Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 02-02-2014, 04:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 02-26-2014, 06:47 AM - Thread Starter
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In the 24 days since making the crosscut guide it warped to unusability. Been to cold to get outside most days and when warm I was out of town at Disneyworld.

Today I started glueing the first enclosure...at this rate I will have one complete by Thanksgiving.


Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 03-02-2014, 02:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Not much progress...bent my POS circular saw shoe and had go buy a new one. Got some cuts made today before tomorrows expected 12" of snow.

Bought a Kreg pocket screw jig for the port. Wow it made it easy.

Latest progress:

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 04-20-2014, 02:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Got them built! Made the mistake of installing the drivers and putting them in place before painting with duratex.

I am running them in stereo using the miniDSP for HPF (20 Hz) and LPF (200 Hz). I need to pull out the measurement equipment and finally learn how to use it. The 4 Pi/sub combo sounds awesome...will only get better when measured and eq'd.


Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 04-20-2014, 02:38 PM - Thread Starter
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I braced the crap out of the enclosures but ran out of desire to take more photos. I thought I had some on my phone but I guess not. They should be rock solid!

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 05-03-2014, 06:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Assembled all the required equipment to start measurements. ..so far results have been inconsistent (same location of mic providing very different results when re-measuring). Seems REW has a learning curve I have to overcome before I get useable data.

System sounds great, although I blew the hard plastic dust cap of my 18" Mal-x driver on a scene from LOTR ROTK. The sub had been making a wierd sound that I thought was air leak, instead todust cap was only partially glued onto the cone. There was a second, smaller dust cap uunderneath so I do not plan on glueing the plastic one back on.


Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 05-03-2014, 03:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Spent all day trying to dial in my system. Found out my miniDSP is crap, one channel is about 12 dB lower than the other. Switched all wiring to/from the DSP and reduced channel is definitely in the DSP and not upstream or down.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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Old 05-03-2014, 09:27 PM
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Open up the miniDSP and check the input sensitivity jumpers, sounds like one channel is set to 2.0v while the other is at 0.9v.

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Old 05-04-2014, 08:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post

Open up the miniDSP and check the input sensitivity jumpers, sounds like one channel is set to 2.0v while the other is at 0.9v.


Thanks Matt, its to bad I beat it to smithereens with a hammer out of frustration.













Just kidding, will crack it open today. Good thing I had two Behringer FBD's (2496 and 1124) on hand to handle the EQ . The miniDSP interface is much easier to program and doesn't light up like a Christmas tree in my stereo rack.

Current Gear: PJ – BenQ PE7700; Receiver - Onkyo TX-SR805; Blu Ray - OppoBDP 103; Turntable - Dual CS-515 w/ Ortofon Super OM10; Amplifiers - OdysseyKhartago, Adcom GFA555, QSC RMX 1850HD; PEQ - Behringer FBD2496 [Near FieldSub], miniDSP 2×4 [Flanking Subs], REW; Speakers - 4 Pi (w/B&C DE250/JBL2226H) × 3 [LCR], Yamaha Crap × 2 [surrounds], Exodus Audio Maelstrom-X18" sealed sub [near field sub], LAB-12 based ported sub tuned to 22 Hz x2 [flanking subs, XO set at 40 Hz]
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