Any horn designs 20”H x 45”W x 22”D or smaller for 12" or 15" subs, down towards 20hz? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 02-19-2014, 04:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Are there any horn designs using 12" or 15" drivers that will dig down towards 20hz and close in on 125db in-room?
I looked, and didn't see anything. So I thought I'd ask before I spend the next few weeks trying to wrap my head around how to use Hornresp.

Dimensions are absolute max, cannot possibly go larger (I tried & tried).

Ideally, we'd like to use the TC Sounds Epic 12" driver since he already owns it.
Epic 12"
http://www.parts-express.com/tc-sounds-epic-12-dvc-subwoofer--293-650


Btw, it's been a real long time since I've looked into these. Tapped Horns are easier to get playing low in smaller enclosures than Front Loaded Horns, correct?
I do prefer FLH "sound" myself. But this has design constraints and it will take a miracle to get 20hz and 125db in the size we have available.
So if I'm going to learn how to design one of these enclosure, I want to make sure I learn the correct one.

We'll have floor and one wall boundry. No corner boundry available. This is 2pi right?
Thankfully though, it's somehow a decent location as the 12" ported Epic 12 is doing really well there.
We just need a cleaner sound and more SPL.

"The boom is dead, long live the bass"
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post #2 of 12 Old 02-19-2014, 04:32 PM - Thread Starter
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One more question. Which is the best Hornresp guide out there right now? For dummies?
The one on HomeTheaterShack?

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post #3 of 12 Old 02-19-2014, 04:40 PM
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Sorry buddy, what you are asking for is impossible, especially with that driver.

Small, loud, or deep. Pick two.
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post #4 of 12 Old 02-19-2014, 04:45 PM
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http://www.avsforum.com/t/1358033/lilmikes-cinema-t-6

That's as good as it's going to get
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post #5 of 12 Old 02-20-2014, 11:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I wasn't able to find any help anywhere, so I did venture forth with learning Hornresp.
I used LilMike's tutorial for no particular reason other than I've read 1000's of his posts and he's super helpful and knows his stuff.

I'm not sure at all if I've done this right though? It's my first attempt at Hornresp after actually reading directions. lol

TC Sounds Epic 12 parameters (not to be confused with old school Epic 12):
http://www.parts-express.com/pedocs/manuals/293-650-tc-sounds-3370-00-manual-43416.pdf

I've attached my Hornresp record for this attempt.
EpicSecondRecord.txt 1k .txt file

And here are pics of the results.

  • 600W input at 4ohms gets it to the rated 23mm xmax at 27hz. Need a high pass filter at 20hz.
  • 120db in 2pi. Or 113db at 20hz before filter.
  • Huge peak at 80hz that needs to be EQ'd out.
  • 284 liters / 10 cu.ft which is exactly what I get when using .5" wood in my 20x22x45 available dimensions.


So, did I do okay? And if this looks okay, would it actually be possible to fit it in my dimensions as I hope it will?




Attached Files
File Type: txt EpicSecondRecord.txt (928 Bytes, 0 views)

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post #6 of 12 Old 02-21-2014, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CZ Eddie View Post

Are there any horn designs using 12" or 15" drivers that will dig down towards 20hz and close in on 125db in-room?
My THT will. But it won't fit in that space.
Quote:
284 liters / 10 cu.ft which is exactly what I get when using .5" wood in my 20x22x45 available dimensions.
You can add at least 10% to the volume that the HornResp schematic shows. Then folding it into a pre-determined size will be problematic. With those dimensions a lot of bends will be required, and every bend adds more volume to the cabinet. Assuming that pre-determined size relates to a pre-determined location you'll probably run right up against Murphy's Law of sub placement, which states that where it looks and/or fits best is where it will give the worst result. mad.gif

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post #7 of 12 Old 02-21-2014, 09:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
You can add at least 10% to the volume that the HornResp schematic shows.

Internal or overall volume?
Quote:
Assuming that pre-determined size relates to a pre-determined location you'll probably run right up against Murphy's Law of sub placement, which states that where it looks and/or fits best is where it will give the worst result. mad.gif

We have a 3 cu.ft. mid 20's tuned bass reflex in that location now, using this driver. It puts out much better SPL than I thought it would due to the poor location.
But my cousin doesn't like the sound quality. I've never had the opportunity to measure it though. Might just need EQ.

Thanks Bill.

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post #8 of 12 Old 02-21-2014, 10:04 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm confused about something here. I realize the length of the horn when folded will determine the width and depth of the finished enclosure after folding.
But how do you determine the height?
I may have been mistaken when I thought L12 & L34 determines the height.

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post #9 of 12 Old 03-21-2014, 08:43 PM - Thread Starter
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The demo has started. Looks like we have 20 H x 50 W x 26 D space available. Which is 15 cu.ft. exterior volume.
For comparison sake, an 20" wide BFM TubaHT (THT) loaded with a 15" subwoofer is also 15 cu.ft. exterior.



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post #10 of 12 Old 03-21-2014, 09:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Hmm, maybe I should just look into re-folding the 20" THT then. I already bought the THT plans a few years ago and love the sound and output.
Yup, this is my new plan.

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post #11 of 12 Old 03-22-2014, 02:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Yay. hahah
After final dimensions of cabinet were figured out, we have.... 20.5 H x 52.5 W x 26 D. Just a bit more than is needed for a re-folded 36*36*20.5" THT subwoofer.


Large taped boxes on the sides will be speakers. Hopefully Fusion Tempest. Or a Tannoy dual concentric variant.
Big tape box in the middle is an 80" TV (use your imagination).
Paint shopped square at bottom will be the sub.


Previous sketch of the idea to go with. Old measurements.


Pic of how it started out...
There are a couple 8" Pioneeer in-wall coaxials and a 12" sub in ported enclosure.


And this is what it was like before I got involved...

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post #12 of 12 Old 03-23-2014, 05:15 AM
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Looks promising- keep us posted!
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