Who wants to see the Inuke12000DSP tested? - Page 14 - AVS Forum
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post #391 of 411 Old 07-18-2014, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splotten View Post
That is not how you calculate Vrms for a sine wave. Vrms = (Vp-p/2)/sqrt2 = Vp/sqrt2. It is not Vp-p/sqrt2
I know, but in a bridged amp there's two sine waves, 180 degrees shifted. So you get 2*Vp/sqrt(2).

I was talking about peak in my earlier post.

The orange graph and teal signals are the amplified positive and negative signals, and they're just on top of each other on the scope

For bridge 4 ohm, it's like each channels 2 ohm, so you get ((64/sqrt(2))^2)/2 = 1024 watts per channel, so two channels is 2048 watts RMS. Which is the same thing as ((2*Vp/sqrt(2))^2)/4 His RMS output is different as it's probably not exactly a 4 ohm load.
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post #392 of 411 Old 07-18-2014, 06:33 AM
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OK I see what you mean. I know how a bridged amp work, but I didn't think about the possibility that he measured each "half" separately. It makes a lot more sense now. Thanks for pointing it out.
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post #393 of 411 Old 07-19-2014, 02:35 PM
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The 10kQ outputs 105vRMS per channel at the onset of mild clipping and 116vRMS with heavy clipping, so I guess that's just slightly more than two 12kDSP's at limiters (assuming vRMS).


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post #394 of 411 Old 07-19-2014, 03:33 PM
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"OK I see what you mean. I know how a bridged amp work, but I didn't think about the possibility that he measured each "half" separately. It makes a lot more sense now. Thanks for pointing it out."


+1 rms across bridged = 0 and that is what the 6000 is doing per channel.

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post #395 of 411 Old 07-30-2014, 11:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok. Just got the amp back. Fired it up and logged in. Went to set limiters and......now I can set limiter to 165Vp. Interesting.

Also, they did re tighten the front end so its back to normal with that. They also double boxed it as my original box is not fairing so well with the several trips to Nevada and Cali.
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post #396 of 411 Old 07-30-2014, 12:01 PM
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That is very interesting! It's as if they did something different this time.
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post #397 of 411 Old 07-30-2014, 02:07 PM - Thread Starter
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I hooked it up to a multimeter and could only get 103 volts during some sine sweeps.

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post #398 of 411 Old 07-30-2014, 09:06 PM
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Not surprising since these aren't designed for continuous high level output, so limiting is invoked.

Any way to do bursts of a second or less?

Noah
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post #399 of 411 Old 08-01-2014, 04:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noah katz View Post
Not surprising since these aren't designed for continuous high level output, so limiting is invoked.

Any way to do bursts of a second or less?
I did various test tone bursts under a second. Slight increase of a volt or two
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post #400 of 411 Old 08-01-2014, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebuckaman View Post
I did various test tone bursts under a second. Slight increase of a volt or two
Are you measuring this with a voltmeter or something else?


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post #401 of 411 Old 08-01-2014, 06:23 PM - Thread Starter
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voltmeter
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post #402 of 411 Old 08-01-2014, 06:30 PM
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so unloaded and measured with a voltmeter, with limiter set to 165 volts, you get what just before clipping?

and you have sufficient gain to get to clipping?


just curious. :-)
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post #403 of 411 Old 08-01-2014, 07:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post
Quote:Originally Posted by Scott Simonian

Oh sweet, thanks!


crap vid but you get the idea
Sounds like, I don't know; 'not so good / promising, maybe'... Just pointing out the obvious.
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post #404 of 411 Old 08-01-2014, 07:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebuckaman View Post
voltmeter
voltmeter measures rms voltage, but the limiter lists peak. If you're measuring 101 volts with a meter, peak voltage is higher, divide by .707


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post #405 of 411 Old 08-01-2014, 09:31 PM
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"I hooked it up to a multimeter and could only get 103 volts during some sine sweeps."


if the amp is bridged per channel, then 103 volts is +103 on one leg and -103 on the other leg. so the total swing is 206 volts, no?
206 volts rms is 206^2/4 = 5300 watts per channel into 4 ohms. the amp is spec'd for 3400 watts into 4 ohms, so the limitation would seem to be on the current side, not the voltage side.

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post #406 of 411 Old 08-01-2014, 10:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post
"I hooked it up to a multimeter and could only get 103 volts during some sine sweeps."


if the amp is bridged per channel, then 103 volts is +103 on one leg and -103 on the other leg. so the total swing is 206 volts, no?
206 volts rms is 206^2/4 = 5300 watts per channel into 4 ohms. the amp is spec'd for 3400 watts into 4 ohms, so the limitation would seem to be on the current side, not the voltage side.
that was bridged? damn thought it was one channel.
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post #407 of 411 Old 08-02-2014, 01:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post
"I hooked it up to a multimeter and could only get 103 volts during some sine sweeps."


if the amp is bridged per channel, then 103 volts is +103 on one leg and -103 on the other leg. so the total swing is 206 volts, no?
206 volts rms is 206^2/4 = 5300 watts per channel into 4 ohms. the amp is spec'd for 3400 watts into 4 ohms, so the limitation would seem to be on the current side, not the voltage side.
You are over complicating it. If 103Vrms was measured at the terminals then that is what the woofer "sees". That is ~2650W measured (assuming a 4ohm load). The limiter can now go to 165Vp = 116.7Vrms. That equates to 3400W into a 4Ohm load. Looks like the 12000 cant swing that much voltage into a 4 ohm load if testing with sine tones or sweeps, but it might do it into a 8 ohm load.
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post #408 of 411 Old 08-02-2014, 01:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notnyt View Post
that was bridged? damn thought it was one channel.
I'm sure it was one channel. LTD is referring to the way some of these amps are constructed internally. They are essentially 4 amp channels bridged two and two into a 2 channel amplifier.
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post #409 of 411 Old 08-02-2014, 10:05 AM
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ok, i thought each leg was being measured relative to ground.


"Power rails measure at +/-84V"

http://forum.speakerplans.com/behrin...opic69202.html


so across the terminals would be a theoretical 168 volt difference. with the limiter at 165 volts peak, that as you show, would give a theoretical 3402 watts into a 4 ohm load per channel and that is right on their spec. for how long it can hold that voltage under varying conditions, how relevant that is to various users, and how that compares to other amps are of course the big questions.

http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/NU12000DSP.aspx


not, each side of the amp is itself already bridged (this means the channels can't be bridged further), which may be why there was some confusion in how to measure the amp and calculate its power.

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post #410 of 411 Old 09-06-2014, 08:57 PM
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My gut feeling still tells me the performance of the non-dsp Inuke 12000 will be much better than this. Anyone have plans to pick up a non-dsp Inuke 12000? I want to get one but Im waiting for AmericanMusicalSupply to get them in stock.
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post #411 of 411 Old 09-07-2014, 12:43 AM
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is the second picture 'twice the amp' as the first picture?


btw, the caps are 2200 x ? and 3300 x ? (from another picture). the 6000 employs 4x 2200x220v 4x3300x100v, so probably the same caps, but also 8x1000x100v that disappeared from the 12000?





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